Mixing advice

[TBman]

I'm a fledgling recording guy too and I stopped using my mics and just use the H5 at the lower bout for now.

I was battling ambient room noise - too much "room" in the recordings (I'm in a smallish room too). I felt that my mics were actually too sensitive for what I was doing and more importantly where I was doing it. I'm in a 10 by 12 carpeted room and the Zoom's built in mics are enough for this room.

The only thing eq I do is normalization if multiple sections are recorded, noise removal and in certain songs reverb. (along with gain adjustments and stereo splitting with panning adjustments).

The reason why I'm putting my two cents in is that I've found that breaking it down to the simplest starting point, getting that right, and then going from there was the best for me. In this case, maybe you should postpone using the spaced pair, just the built ins and work on the placement of the zoom and the room - maybe use another if you can or use room treatments of some sort.

By keeping the recording set-up simple, I'm able to concentrate more on playing and execution.

I have a larger room to record in as well, but not enough table room there for 4-6 page (and longer) tunes, lol.

[Wrighty]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

It really depends. You may hear an echo or a hollow sound, but a bad room can also show up as just a harsh sound, which is kind of what I'm hearing here. It can be tricky to predict how a room will sound, because mics hear things differently than our ears - we tend to compensate when we're listening and can ignore a bad room sound to some extent, while the mics won't. I don't know how much of your recording sound is due to processing and how much is due to the room - but I suspect the biggest difference between your target and yours is the room. You may be able to partially overcome a bad room by micing closer than you would normally - pretty much how I handle my you tube videos, which are done in a pretty standard untreated bedroom. Try spaced pairs about 15-20 inches apart and maybe 6-8 inches from the guitar. You might also post the raw track before any processing in Auria, which would make it clearer whether it's the room or post-processing that's the problem.

Thanks Doug, that,s helpful and i will give that a try.

Out of interest, here’s the raw track;

https://soundcloud.com/peter-wright-...aw-track<br />

[Ty Ford]

The highs are panful. Perhaps your monitors are not telling you the truth.

[rick-slo]

Your link of raw file not embedded. Here you go.



Sounds better than the earlier tweaked recording.

I tweaked the raw track above with a touch of one channel track delay, touch of equalization, and a little reverb.
Here is the link to the outcome of that: http://dcoombsguitar.com/Misc/AGFTemp5.wav

Still a bit of noise but not bad. A little shimmery on the treble notes - sound is like you may be playing those strings with bare fingers.

[Trevor B.]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

One is helped a lot by a good sounding room. Personally I usually use a spaced pair of mikes separated about a couple of feet and about two feet out from the guitar, one mike pointed towards the neck body joint and the other towards south of the bridge a bit. Wearing headphones I experiment for best sound by turning the a little to the right or left. A warmer sound moving towards the mikes with consideration for too much of a muddy sound starting to occur.
A number of various mike positions can work. I think the main thing is listing back live through good headphones as you are setting up the mikes.

I agree wholeheartedly with these suggestions and would add that for me finding the balance between mic distance(s) from the guitar and the input level I set is the most critical step in the process. And, it varies from guitar to guitar and mic(s) to mic(s).
That said, I really enjoyed your playing and hope you stick with the learning curve of home recording.

[MikeMcKee]

I was in a very similar situation. I have an H5, and really like it. I didn't stay with the built in mics long, and experimented with several different external mics and mic placement, but just couldn't get past the brightness, or "sterile" sound that I continually had and came to the conclusion it had to be the preamps in the H5. Finally decided to start checking out other preamps. After trying out a few, I ended up trying the new Warm Audio 273EQ...and that did it. Absolutely love it, and it has given me exactly what I was looking for. Not cheap...about $1500, but after what I had been going through, absolutely worth it.

[Wrighty]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Your link of raw file not embedded. Here you go.



Sounds better than the earlier tweaked recording.

I tweaked the raw track above with a touch of one channel track delay, touch of equalization, and a little reverb.
Here is the link to the outcome of that: http://dcoombsguitar.com/Misc/AGFTemp5.wav

Still a bit of noise but not bad. A little shimmery on the treble notes - sound is like you may be playing those strings with bare fingers.

Thanks very much Derek - on both counts.

I like it very much - can you give me a bit more detail on what EQ and delay settings you used please? (And also why only on one channel)

I can then try to replicate and understand how you got there.

[Wrighty]

Originally Posted by Ty Ford

The highs are panful. Perhaps your monitors are not telling you the truth.

Could be for sure - I am using a medium quality set of headphones to mix with.

[MikeMcKee]

Originally Posted by Wrighty

Could be for sure - I am using a medium quality set of headphones to mix with.

We would all love to have a studio set up with great monitors, but many of us don't have the space or set up. So, we have to mix/master with headphones. I recently pickup a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro's and am really pleased with them. I think really well priced for how good they are.

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by Wrighty

Thanks very much Derek - on both counts.

I like it very much - can you give me a bit more detail on what EQ and delay settings you used please? (And also why only on one channel)

I can then try to replicate and understand how you got there.

Basically I will listen to recording and if needed:
1. balance volume of the R and L channels of the stereo track
2. check for phase alignment of R and L channels (I have a meter for starters and then go by ear). Lower notes usually sound fuller when phase aligned.
I adjusted that by delaying the right? channel by about 4 milliseconds. That little tweak more noticeable via listening with headphones than speakers.
3. Routinely use a high pass filter starting somewhere around 50Hz.
4. Look for harsh frequencies and equalize them down a little if helpful. In this recording I cut a couple of decibels in about the 6 to 8 thousand hertz range.
5. Pick out a reverb and its settings (deciding on that most always takes the most time).
6. If I can't get to something I like then it's re-record time.

[Wrighty]

Great, thanks very much for taking the time to help.

[Wrighty]

Originally Posted by MikeMcKee

We would all love to have a studio set up with great monitors, but many of us don't have the space or set up. So, we have to mix/master with headphones. I recently pickup a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro's and am really pleased with them. I think really well priced for how good they are.

Those look great - going to see if I can find a used pair, thanks [emoji3]

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Your link of raw file not embedded. Here you go.



Sounds better than the earlier tweaked recording.

I tweaked the raw track above with a touch of one channel track delay, touch of equalization, and a little reverb.
Here is the link to the outcome of that: http://dcoombsguitar.com/Misc/AGFTemp5.wav

Still a bit of noise but not bad. A little shimmery on the treble notes - sound is like you may be playing those strings with bare fingers.

Your raw track sounds *much* better than your original mix. For something like this, less is more. You don't need much, if any, EQ. Just add a touch of reverb, and you can basically be done. Rick's mix also sounds very nice, with a few extra touches. So in this case, I don't know that your room acoustics are really an issue, and your mic placement sounds fine. Seems like the issue with the original mix really was the mix itself.

[Wrighty]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

Your raw track sounds *much* better than your original mix. For something like this, less is more. You don't need much, if any, EQ. Just add a touch of reverb, and you can basically be done. Rick's mix also sounds very nice, with a few extra touches. So in this case, I don't know that your room acoustics are really an issue, and your mic placement sounds fine. Seems like the issue with the original mix really was the mix itself.

Thanks Doug - I guess I have over done it with the EQ and need to dial it back.

I am surprised that the raw sounds better - do you think the basic compression I added is also not required on most recordings as a standard add?

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by Wrighty

Thanks Doug - I guess I have over done it with the EQ and need to dial it back.

I am surprised that the raw sounds better - do you think the basic compression I added is also not required on most recordings as a standard add?

You certainly don't need much compression, if any. For solo fingerstyle guitar, it's not needed, and some will advise against any at all. I usually use a tiny touch, so little I don't see the meters move, maybe 1/4 or 1/d db. It's just enough to fatten things a little, but definitely not enough to hear any compression. Compression can be tricky and it's easy to mess up the sound.