Thoughts on Acoustic Guitar Mics for Live environment

waterlooz · #1 05-10-2021, 11:42 AM

Hello,

I have recently acquired a Collings without any electronics installed. I am hesitant to put a K&K or other pickup in it and am wondering what mics are being used when playing live. For context, I use a Schertler Jam 150.

I have read a ton on line but am curious to hear from those on the forum as to what s/he might recommend. Is it as simple as a SM-57 or would a SM-81be better on a stage.

Thanks!

rockabilly69 · #2 05-10-2021, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlooz

Hello,

I have recently acquired a Collings without any electronics installed. I am hesitant to put a K&K or other pickup in it and am wondering what mics are being used when playing live. For context, I use a Schertler Jam 150.

I have read a ton on line but am curious to hear from those on the forum as to what s/he might recommend. Is it as simple as a SM-57 or would a SM-81be better on a stage.

Thanks!

What kind of gigs will you be doing with it? What model Collings is it?

I have a Schertler Jam 200 and Jam 400, along with the Jam 150 ext cabinet, so I'm pretty familiar with the sound of those amps.

waterlooz · #3 05-10-2021, 01:54 PM

Collings Baby - Small venue - outdoor up to 75 people.

waterlooz · #4 05-10-2021, 01:55 PM

w/vox too : )

Brent Hahn · #5 05-10-2021, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlooz

Hello,

I have recently acquired a Collings without any electronics installed. I am hesitant to put a K&K or other pickup in it and am wondering what mics are being used when playing live. For context, I use a Schertler Jam 150.

I have read a ton on line but am curious to hear from those on the forum as to what s/he might recommend. Is it as simple as a SM-57 or would a SM-81be better on a stage.

Thanks!

An SM81 might be better than a 57 or 58. Maybe, depends on the PA and the sound person. A DPA 4099 would be a noticeable improvement, and it'd move around with you because it's clipped to the guitar. But it's pricy and feedback-prone.

rockabilly69 · #6 05-10-2021, 03:27 PM

I know this is not want you want to hear, but I don't think a lone mic will get you there for those types of gigs. To get the volume loud enough with your Jam 150 to cover that many people, I think you would be dealing with feedback problems, and the Jam 150 doesn't really have enough EQ to deal with the notching necessary to get the most out of a microphone and deal with that feedback. I like the Jam 150 so please don't take that as a slight. It's just not ideal for a microphone on the guitar. I think that's why they added parametric EQ to the newer JAM 200.

I would recommend something like this not permanently installed to get you on the page. Of all the mic/magnetic combos it has been the most natural sounding I've heard, although you can only get enough mic in the mix to give a little air on top when up at volume.

https://reverb.com/item/40510690-sch...kup-2019-black

You could just keep it in the guitar case when not gigging.

waterlooz · #7 05-10-2021, 03:42 PM

Thanks for the link.

My issue is that the Collings baby has a 3.5" sound hole. Schertler says 3.54" min. I cannot find any pups that fit into a smaller diameter. I may have to go K&K which is doable but I'm in no rush whatsoever.

Goat Mick · #8 05-10-2021, 03:53 PM

If you're playing for 75 people, that's a pretty good size room and you'll need to push some volume to be heard. I don't think I would try it without a pickup. You'll be fighting feedback all night.

rockabilly69 · #9 05-10-2021, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlooz

Thanks for the link.

My issue is that the Collings baby has a 3.5" sound hole. Schertler says 3.54" min. I cannot find any pups that fit into a smaller diameter. I may have to go K&K which is doable but I'm in no rush whatsoever.

I've ran into that problem a few times with a dew pickups, and to get around it, I would disassemble the ears of the pickup on one side to fit it in, and then put it back together after one side, was in. I would send Schertler a letter to see if that is truly the absolute minimum that it would fit in, or is it conservatively stated. Good luck!

gfirob · #10 05-10-2021, 05:46 PM

Sounds like a job for K&K's and a Tonedexter.

phcorrigan · #11 05-10-2021, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlooz

Thanks for the link.

My issue is that the Collings baby has a 3.5" sound hole. Schertler says 3.54" min. I cannot find any pups that fit into a smaller diameter. I may have to go K&K which is doable but I'm in no rush whatsoever.

If you're thinking about K&K you might also consider James May's Ultra Tonic. You can find quite a few reviews here.

At some point I'm planning to install the Ultra Tonic add-on for the K&K in my HD-28V.

Here's the link: http://jamesmayengineering.com/

BTW, James frequents this forum, so you can likely ask him questions directly.

SpruceTop · #12 05-12-2021, 03:16 AM

Before I stopped using mics for acoustic guitar back in 1978, I'd used the Shure SM57, ElectroVoice RE11, and ElectroVoice RE20 mics for gigging. They all worked but were prone to feedback in some of the places I was playing in at the time. After 1978, all I've used are pickup systems and haven't looked back.

varmonter · #13 05-12-2021, 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlooz

Thanks for the link.

My issue is that the Collings baby has a 3.5" sound hole. Schertler says 3.54" min. I cannot find any pups that fit into a smaller diameter. I may have to go K&K which is doable but I'm in no rush whatsoever.

I had a 30s parlor that had a small
soundhole. My sunrise mag pickup
was the only one that would fit.
It sounded great. Their website states a min of 3.5. You will have to
remove one clip. than reattach when
you get it in place.
As far as mics the sm-81 is my fav.
But mics are not always the best solution for loud close environments.

fwphoto · #14 05-12-2021, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phcorrigan

If you're thinking about K&K you might also consider James May's Ultra Tonic.

Yep. Just did the Ultra Tonic/K&K conversion on my OM-21 & am blown away by the difference. As more folks move to Ultra Tonic I think you'll be hearing more about how good it is, especially compared to the K&K (which I really liked 'till now :-). On another forum someone had the Ultra Tonic installed on a new guitar & plans on using the Tonedexter with it. Might be a "Grail" system for amplified acoustic guitar. Will wait & see but I really am sold on my Ultra Tonic/K&K converted OM-21!

Frank

ljguitar · #15 05-12-2021, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlooz

Hello,

I have recently acquired a Collings without any electronics installed. I am hesitant to put a K&K or other pickup in it and am wondering what mics are being used when playing live. For context, I use a Schertler Jam 150.

I have read a ton on line but am curious to hear from those on the forum as to what s/he might recommend. Is it as simple as a SM-57 or would a SM-81be better on a stage.

Thanks!

Hi water-looz
Some venues are friendlier to live-mic use than others.

And if I were going to attempt it, I'd probably purchase an Ear Trumpet Labs mic. They have been hand-building and voicing mics especially for live play for a long time now.