Boutique/Small Factory Builders

[zmf]

Originally Posted by dneal

Santa Cruz: Very dry and woody sounding. Good note to note separation. Not rich/lush/fat (I guess that means bass to mid bass not emphasized). Clear mids and strong trebles.

Bourgeois: Warm and mellow. Notes from each string blend together.

Collings: Opposite of Bourgeois. Crisp, clear with a lot of note separation. Mids and trebles stand out.

Huss and Dalton: Somewhere in between Bourgeois and Collings. Not as responsive, maybe a little more heavily built.

Goodall: This one is hard, because I was expecting rich and lush with extreme overtones. I didn’t find that to be the case with the TROM I played. Somewhere between the Santa Cruz and Bourgeois. Warm but dry. Good articulation but notes blend well.

Dneal has provided a good summary, particularly for most dreads and OM's from these companies. I really agree that Collings tends to be the opposite of Bourgeois.
I'd add the Santa Cruz slope-shoulder dreads DO have a rather pronounced bass relative to their other models. I bought their VS model mainly for the bass, and the RS bass is even more intoxicating.

Originally Posted by NewDad

Just curious... Is there an objective and consistent difference in build quality between these makers?

I don't think that a difference in build quality is relevant among these brands. Or at least you can count on all standing up well over the years. And they all have their charms.

I envy you going forth on a mission to compare these guitars -- you'll have to let us know your preference when you're done.

[Silly Moustache]

Hi,

I don't have much to contribute, although I did at one time ('90s) own a Bourgeois DS260, which I still think might have been the most superb instrment ever, but the neck was too thin and profile too shallow for me.

After many Martins, I discovered Collings (in '99) and now have four and they are my "thing".

However, I also own a SCGC "RS" built in 2012 which I acquired virtually unused in 2014, and whilst fine, is only now blooming.

The point that I wanted to make is that I have found it most interesting to read the considered impressions of these brands.

This is the true "stuff" of an acoustic guitar forum.

Great stuff.

[Br1ck]

I'd do as little pre trip research as possible, except the very general preference you have as to size and wood type. Even then, I'd play a few out of type to what you think you want. Can you take a known and liked personal instrument? If you have a Martin you like, you may be reluctant to spend the rather stiff premium for the boutique builds. Trust no one but yourself. I've played a lot of very clean and fairly new boutique guitars at Gryphon over the years, traded for something else. I've yet to play one I thought I just had to have. Most were very nice guitars. All would not have made me better than $2k worth of lessons.

They will all be eye candy. You can't survive otherwise. I've played some of the brands you mention where I've never liked any of them. Others would rave about the same guitars. Yours is the only opinion that matters. Heck, I've got a guitar I'd venture 90% would try and hate. But they don't matter.

It is the rare person who buys a $7500 guitar and then tells people they find it lacking. But if there is not one guitar you just can't put down, and keep coming back to it time after time, and you try leaving the store but your feet won't let you, THEN you ask for a quiet room so you are not listening to the reverberation of acoustic machines all around you.

If you happen to be someone that can drop $10,000 in Vegas and not miss it, then go buy something and feed the economy.

[Kelly77]

I have an H&D TD-R Custom .... 1.75 nut / hide glue. It cured my GAS. Play it every day. Light touch.... sensitive, articulate, beautiful clarity. Ramp it up and it becomes a full on cannon with lotsa headroom. I play blues, country, a bit of bluegrass.... does each well. Tone will change like a chameleon with your picking pressure. I was on a journey for a versatile acoustic and this is it. My Martin 000-18 is very jealous. Have fun with your journey.

[Shadowfox]

Yes visit Chicago Music Exchange!

I would also say grab a bite across the way at Dinkel's bakery (the best donuts ever, and homemade bread for their deli sandwiches)

I would also add Furch to that list. SGI Stonebridge is based out of a guy named Todd Allison's house not far from CME.

https://reverb.com/shop/sgichicago

Personally, I prefer Furch's tone more than most of those listed (have not played a Goodall). Their build quality is at least on par with the list above.

[jrb715]

You've isolated some fine builders. And though there seems some consensus on sounds in the responses, don't believe that's how you will hear, or privilege, the builders. An unacceptable bass for one player will be an articulate, superior bass without hangover for another.

I find the guitars from one of these builders extremely competent but pretty boring, my son loves these guitars.

I also don't think the builders guitars uniformly fit a typical sound throughout the lines. A Collings SJ and CJ35 sound very different than other Collings guitars. And you will find that you won't find all the guitars in a builders line equally compelling. You might love the dreads and be put to sleep by the OMs or vice versa--and of course each individual guitar will have its own voice.

What advice I might give, since you have to put up with advice in a forum, is to have a good sense of what you think are the needs of the material you play or want to play and try guitars until one just flat out suits you.

[Dwight]

I've got all the above except Goodall. I found them too harmonically rich for my taste.

I have a Huss and Dalton TOM-R that has the power of a dread. A Bourgeois Dread that is balanced not boomy and a very sweet 00. Collings are unbelievably well built as noted above. Santa Cruz are generally very lightly built and very responsive. Richard Hoover likes to say they are heirloom quality and he's right. I wouldn't be able to give advice on which is best, as they are all the best.

[memphis1]

I’m just gonna leave this right.....here.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A9iInUIKdZM

[MHC]

I've owned several Huss & Dalton's and currently own a TOM-M custom. I have also owned a Collings OM2HG and played many other examples, and I have played many Santa Cruz guitars.

Each maker does have unique characteristics, but with boutique guitars I find that the wood combination make a huge difference as each maker understands how to maximize the characteristics of a particular tone wood. So, it's difficult to generally associate tone with brand. The one exception might be Collings which, in my opinion, manages to carry over a distinctive flavor no matter the tone wood combo.

Of course, a human being can consider themselves highly fortunate to own any one of the brands you've mentioned -- but here are my very subjective impressions:

Santa Cruz:
Having played many Santa Cruz OMs (meaning more than a dozen) I can't say that this maker speaks to me. They've been described as dry and woody by some, and I agree. The ones I've played, however, have lacked a bit of complexity to my ear. Also, I've not been a fan of the neck shapes I have come across - although I understand that there is great variation with SCGC when it comes to necks. Take this with a grain of salt, a player like Jamie Stillway gets amazing tone out of her Santa Cruz OM/PW so... I'd trust her (a real pro.) on Santa Cruz.

Collings:
Folks have described it as "piano-like" and that's a good term for them. Lot's of complexity and super responsive -- scary responsive. That might be what Brencat is alluding to when he says that they are "Unforgiving of loosey-goosey playing." Yeah, if you just look at a string wrong, it'll ring out and shame you. Many people describe Collings as "bright" and this is true, but I think it's a beautiful characteristic of clarity. I've never thought of Collings as "brittle" which some people associate with bright. Peter Huttlinger and Chris Smither know how to capitalize on this Collings characteristic. One other note, Collings has a special way with German Spruce tops (IMHO) and my OM2HG had a truly elegant, burnished sound. I foolishly sold it and it remains the one guitar that I'd like back again some day.

Huss & Dalton:
During all of my experimentation, Huss & Dalton emerged as my favorite. I currently own a Custom TOM-M (Italian top and short scale). It can be loud and complex, or sweet and pure, or earthy and raw. It has a satisfying round low end, and articulate highs that bloom without a hint of shrill. The TOM-M is not quite as loud as the TOM-R which is a real canon for an OM (esp. with a torrified top).

Is it between Martin and Collings in terms of tone... yeah, I guess that's fair to say. It has its own thing. It is an elegant guitar made by people with a bluegrass background - so that's in there too.

I also gravitated to H&D because I love their medium-C shaped neck and their string spacing at the saddle.

All that said, I am mighty curious to play a Bourgeois guitar someday. I always love them when I hear them. A little while back I saw Courtney Hartman (with Della Mae) and her Bourgeois OM (large sound hole) sounded out of this world.

I hope you have a fabulous trip to Chicago and that you find, and get to play, ALL of these great guitars.