Trade gone bad.....ideas?

[Edgar Poe]

What has the respected forum member said about all this. Does he know the third party ?

Ed

[Jcamp]

Lawyers hav offices. Call the office and tell them who you wanna talk to. If they don’t call back call a few more times. If it’s a firm talk to the head of the firm. Tell them the lawyer they hired is either avoiding u or swindling you. If that doesn’t work I don’t know what to tell u other than go get your original guitar back and let the other forum member handle getting his back

[sdelsolray]

Originally Posted by okeem22

Wow thanks everyone.
To clarify, I traded my guitar to a forum member. He traded his to Bob. Bob was to send his guitar to me. It is 2/3 done and am waiting for my guitar from Bob.

Certainly have emails showing an agreement with no loose ends. Bob and his wife are attorneys! Oh boy, this could really be fun.....lol

Have to laugh to keep from crying! ������

This is a complicated situation.

To add to the above, consider doing the following:

1) Find out which State or States Bob and his wife are licensed in as lawyers. Each State maintains a State Bar from which this information can be obtained. Either may be licensed in more than one State (or DC).

2) At some point in your written communications to Bob and his wife, indicate that unless you receive the guitar from them (not sure which guitar at this point) you intend to file complaints against both with the identified State Bar organizations alleging fraud against you and conversion of your property. Lawyers can be severely disciplined for such conduct, such as suspensions for, say, 6 months.

[archerscreek]

To address some of the legal issues thrown about here:

1) With very few exceptions, such as real estate transactions, contracts need not be written to be enforceable, although a written instrument certainly helps prove the terms.

2) If Bob dies OP has a claim against his estate. Bob’s family doesn’t get to keep the guitar.

3) Bob’s obligations don’t stop or pause with his incapacity. This is why people execute Power of Attorney documents. The POA is empowered to act on behalf of the incapacitated person (pay bills or fulfill others contractual obligations). If the POA is so distraught he/she cannot act, then the POA can be removed.

4) It’s possible there could be a criminal case. Theft by fraud or some other theft variant pops up. I’ve handled thousands of cases as a prosecutor and as private counsel, and frankly a lot of victims chose the criminal route (and are often better off doing so) because one, they don’t have to hire their own attorney and two restitution is often part of the sentence.

[pszy22]

Call Judge Judy.

[okeem22]

Originally Posted by pszy22

Call Judge Judy.

Thanks. I needed that!
She scares me.........wouldnt want to go in front of her, never know which route she will take and run with......

[archerscreek]

I should add a 5) to my list. Parties get into hot water when it comes to collections. There are laws against making threats, even threatening legal action in some circumstances, and against contacting employers and others not involved. I have taken courses on collections, been involved with collections as an attorney, and can tell you with 100% certainty that debtor attorneys love to wait in the weeds and have their clients receive threats because of the stiff sanctions available against the parties that do so, including loss of the property in question. Cases are fact specific of course, but caution is always in order.

[Gmountain]

Originally Posted by sdelsolray

This is a complicated situation.

To add to the above, consider doing the following:

1) Find out which State or States Bob and his wife are licensed in as lawyers. Each State maintains a State Bar from which this information can be obtained. Either may be licensed in more than one State (or DC).

2) At some point in your written communications to Bob and his wife, indicate that unless you receive the guitar from them (not sure which guitar at this point) you intend to file complaints against both with the identified State Bar organizations alleging fraud against you and conversion of your property. Lawyers can be severely disciplined for such conduct, such as suspensions for, say, 6 months.

No, that's not going to happen.

[ManyMartinMan]

Originally Posted by Jcamp

... If it’s a firm talk to the head of the firm. Tell them the lawyer they hired is either avoiding u or swindling you. If that doesn’t work I don’t know what to tell u other than go get your original guitar back and let the other forum member handle getting his back

Originally Posted by sdelsolray

...indicate that unless you receive the guitar from them (not sure which guitar at this point) you intend to file complaints against both with the identified State Bar organizations alleging fraud against you and conversion of your property. Lawyers can be severely disciplined for such conduct, such as suspensions for, say, 6 months.

First of all - do neither of these. Phil and Archer have given you as legal of advice, without being legal advice, as you will get on an open forum. If you can't get a direct response to your phone messages and emails follow Phil's last paragraph.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by Mycroft

Directly, no. By implication, yes. If you want to continue this, send a PM.

No need, but since you mentioned a PM I think a PM to the OP by one of the lawyers who have posted here offering to represent him would help.

Lots of opinions here but offering to actually represent shows an entirely different level of sincerity.
And my apologies if you took offense at anything.

[Mycroft]

Originally Posted by Athens

No need, but since you mentioned a PM I think a PM to the OP by one of the lawyers who have posted here offering to represent him would help.

Lots of opinions here but offering to actually represent shows an entirely different level of sincerity.
And my apologies if you took offense at anything.

As opposed to an attorney who is licensed to practice in the jurisdiction where the OP lives, or where the guitar is? An attorney can only practice law where they are licensed. And some here have offered more than opinion, but rather intelligent and knowing ideas on how to proceed.

[TomB'sox]

I would suggest as a moderator here that we focus on the OPs problem rather that arguing among each other.

[F512]

Originally Posted by sdelsolray

This is a complicated situation.

To add to the above, consider doing the following:

1) Find out which State or States Bob and his wife are licensed in as lawyers. Each State maintains a State Bar from which this information can be obtained. Either may be licensed in more than one State (or DC).

2) At some point in your written communications to Bob and his wife, indicate that unless you receive the guitar from them (not sure which guitar at this point) you intend to file complaints against both with the identified State Bar organizations alleging fraud against you and conversion of your property. Lawyers can be severely disciplined for such conduct, such as suspensions for, say, 6 months.

I agree with this. It sounds like you are being lied to and the member in question is trying to put things off until you just give up. Even if it’s true that he had a heart attack, which sounds doubtful, you have made a 6-7k business transaction and it is up to him to follow through. End of story.

[jazzguy]

With all due respect, I am scratching my head of why you entered into this kind of transaction in the first place? Especially with such an expensive guitar. At the very least all of you should have flown to 1 place to make the exchange. Something sounds fishy here. This just seems like this had a slim chance of working out well in the first place. Still do hope it works out for you.

[okeem22]

I think it was doable considering I knew both parties ( or had dealt with them at least), and all 3 guitars were in very fine condition. No real diffence than a straight trade with someone really. The third party wanted my guitar and was happy.
Bob wanted his guitar and was happy. So third party is really out of it. Soooooooo, Bob has the guitar he is happy with and doesnt really matter where it came from. He owes his guitar. Essentially like you and I make a trade deal, I send my guitar and you are happy with it but you never send yours off.

Originally Posted by jazzguy

With all due respect, I am scratching my head of why you entered into this kind of transaction in the first place? Especially with such an expensive guitar. At the very least all of you should have flown to 1 place to make the exchange. Something sounds fishy here. This just seems like this had a slim chance of working out well in the first place. Still do hope it works out for you.