Madagascar or Guatemalan

hotroad · #1 11-13-2018, 03:55 PM

I am looking at a couple of guitars with those woods. I want this one to really sing with good projection but clear highs and trebles. Which wood is better for that. Maple is often used for that tone but I am not going there this time. Any help would be appreciated. On top is an Adi torrified top and a dread size body.
Martin is the builder.

zmf · #2 11-13-2018, 04:35 PM

Not much help here, but....

From my small personal database on Martin rosewood dreads:

The most magnificent one I've played was an "America's Guitar" with Madagascar. Had the chime of cathedral bells.

But it could have been just that particular guitar.

llew · #3 11-13-2018, 04:50 PM

Madagascar in my opinion. And if for any reason you decide to sell it down the road it will be more valuable than Guatemalan in my experiences. There is a reason Martin is using Madagascar back and sides paired with torrified Adirondack on their Authentic's. But let your ears have the final vote. Good luck!

Taylor Martin · #4 11-13-2018, 04:51 PM

Here's my experience with those woods, while not apples to apples but most here probably can't give an apples to apples as to what you are exactly looking at.

my Bourgeois Slope D with Adi top and Madagascar back and sides - The tone is what you would expect from a Slope D, full, warm and articulate but not more pronounced in the mid to highs. Great singer songwriter guitar

my Martin OM with Torrified Adi top and Guatemalan back and sides - I love the tone on this thing and it has pretty much been the cure for GAS for me. I find it to be more pronounced in the mid to highs, but not lacking in bass (if that makes sense).

When I bought the mentioned Martin I also bought a Collings OM1 but the Martin won me over in tone. I say that to say, you may not want to discount a Collings as I think it may have the sound you describe you are after. I had a D1A and an OM1 and either I think will fit your description better that a Martin (no discredit to Martin as I still have 2), and have even played a D1 I wish I would have bought. If you have the opportunity to try one go for it.

Good Luck and I'm interested in hearing others opinions to your question.

hotroad · #5 11-13-2018, 05:48 PM

So Collings may be more chimey than a Martin with either Madagascar or Guatemalan. I am looking for good highs/trebles on this one.

Appreciate the feedback so far.

Still wondering what wood would provide better highs of the two mentioned in my post.

mcduffnw · #6 11-13-2018, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotroad

So Collings may be more chimey than a Martin with either Madagascar or Guatemalan. I am looking for good highs/trebles on this one.

Appreciate the feedback so far.

Still wondering what wood would provide better highs of the two mentioned in my post.

It's far more the top and the top bracing, how stiff or flexible, how dense, how reactive to soundwaves passing through it, what is the predominant tonal strength of the top and how it reacts with the braces, their stiffness and density, and tonal signature, and how the braces react with the top that is going to give you the tone of the guitar...and really...truly...it all comes down to each individual guitar and how the whole soundbox as a unit...the top, top bracing, sides, back, and back bracing work together as a whole...regardless of the types of woods used.

It's just that simple, and just that complex, all at the same time.

duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

Steadfastly · #7 11-13-2018, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcduffnw

It's far more the top and the top bracing, how stiff or flexible, how dense, how reactive to soundwaves passing through it, what is the predominant tonal strength of the top and how it reacts with the braces, their stiffness and density, and tonal signature, and how the braces react with the top that is going to give you the tone of the guitar...and really...truly...it all comes down to each individual guitar and how the whole soundbox as a unit...the top, top bracing, sides, back, and back bracing work together as a whole...regardless of the types of woods used.

It's just that simple, and just that complex, all at the same time.

duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

McD, you said that so much more eloquently than I could. May, I add, that's why playing a guitar first is always recommended? We have had a number of members here that ordered a custom guitar and didn't like it all that much when they finally brought it home.

hotroad · #8 11-13-2018, 07:57 PM

I will be choosing this guitar without playing it first. But there is a two day return if I need it. So I have to depend on the wisdom of the AGF to decide, plus my 40 years of playing nearly full time.

justonwo · #9 11-13-2018, 08:04 PM

I own and play frequently two guitars made with Madagascar rosewood. I've played many examples of this tonewood. The trebles are very clear, defined, and musical. In one case, the mids are fairly scooped (my Brondel) and in the other case, the mids are heavy (Circa), which goes to show you that A LOT depends on the builder and the guitar. I think other parameters beyond the back and sides are far more determinative for the highs, but assuming all else is equal I think Madagascar will do a great job of delivering what you're looking for.

What are the two guitars in question, by the way? I know they're both Martin dreads, but can you say more?

hotroad · #10 11-13-2018, 08:33 PM

The Martins are Dreads, one is an HD, Guatemalan, 45 style headstock, 45 style rosette, torrified 80 years, Grade 7 Adi top, hand scalloped top bracing, aging toner, Adi braces, one piece mahogany neck.
The Madagascar is very similar in specs except for the back and sides being madi.

ADO · #11 11-13-2018, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotroad

The Martins are Dreads, one is an HD, Guatemalan, 45 style headstock, 45 style rosette, torrified 80 years, Grade 7 Adi top, hand scalloped top bracing, aging toner, Adi braces, one piece mahogany neck.
The Madagascar is very similar in specs except for the back and sides being madi.

It sounds like you might want to listen to the Martin CS-21-11. It was built by Martin to be the lightest dread. It has adi top and madi back and sides and has authenic bracing. the guitar delivers your request. to get you exactly what you want, choose the madi and cut a large sound hole in it. lol why didn't i think of that dale look beyond the trees

hotroad · #12 11-13-2018, 11:55 PM

I took a listen to some Martin CS-21-11 and it does sound like what I am after. Problem is I can't find any for sale anywhere. Only made in 2011 and not many then. Great guitar for sure. Let me know if you find one, please.

zmf · #13 11-14-2018, 12:05 AM

Collective wisdom stated here seems to suggest you're on a fool's errand. Find something you can play first.

The Collings suggestion is a good one.

ADO · #14 11-14-2018, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotroad

I took a listen to some Martin CS-21-11 and it does sound like what I am after. Problem is I can't find any for sale anywhere. Only made in 2011 and not many then. Great guitar for sure. Let me know if you find one, please.

put the word out somebodys got one they will sell. Don't settle for anything less than what you are looking for or you'll be looking again. dale

martingitdave · #15 11-14-2018, 09:09 AM

I've owned Adirondack topped Martin dreadnoughts with both Madagascar and Guatemalan back and sides. My personal favorite was the Guatemalan, and I should not have sold it. But, I had GAS and was looking for something "different" at the time. Dumb. The Madagascar models sounded like a cross between East Indian Rosewood and Mahogany. Either one of these would suit your desire for more high end, but I think the Guatemalan rosewood Martin has more resonance to boot. It's hard to go wrong with either choice.