Taylor makes a mistake.

[whiskeyjack]

This is the last post I'll make concerning Bob Taylor's incredibly stupid decision.

A lot of folks here have said, "Move on." Even I said it earlier in another thread (along with some more understanding and rational comments than you might read here). And, we'll eventually move on. This isn't the end of civilization as we know it and there's lots worse problems in each of our respective lives.

But Taylor Guitars, Inc. is a business. And there are elements of customer courtesy that have been purposely ignored by Bob Taylor. He spoke through JR to this forum. Why didn't he speak through JR when ES or luthiery issues arose? I don't undestand that.

I got to thinking about how much "I" supported Bob Taylor's business. By choice, no regrets. But I also got to thinking about how I'd respond if the dealership I bought a $4000 car from decided they didn't want to associate with me anymore because they felt my friends and associates were a liability to their establishment. Would I buy another car there? duh.

Bob Taylor figures we're a liability to him. That may not have been his intention but, from my pespective, it certainly is the signal he's sent. And apparently, a significant portion of forum members are gonna' just roll over and say, "Thank you Bob for making such fine guitars for us. You don't owe us anything. My 614ce is yummy. It's your company, created by your talent; you should have complete control. And you can do, say or be anything you want and we'll keep supporting your business because, hey, we love ya, Uncle Bob, regardless of what ya do. Here's another $2500 for another guitar just to make sure there's no hard feelings even though we're a pain in the as# and a liability to your business."

Not me.

I won't give up on the forum but I probably won't buy any more Taylors. Too many other companies make guitars that are just as good. . . .

I offer, my apologies if I've offended anyone with this line of reasoning but Woody makes a good point. He voiced his response to Bob Taylor's decision by saying his next guitar probably won't be a Taylor. I read that as a response to major PR failure and a lack of customer courtesy on the part of Taylor Guitars.

Regardless of my other posts on this issue, I made a decision yesterday regarding Taylor guitars. The decision was based on Mr. Taylor's decision to ignore an opportunity to provide customer courtesy - a courtesy he provided so wonderfully so many times before on this forum. I fired him. Bob Taylor no longer makes guitars for me. I'll keep two because they're paid for and they have a special purpose (I love 'em) but I'm always looking at good guitars and they'll likely be replaced at a later time.

Catharsis is a wonderful thing. 'Makes me realize what things mean too much to me. Taylor guitars meant way too much to me.
I shoulda' made some changes earlier: I'm gonna' make 'em now.

This is still a great forum and I hope the coming changes will make this place more dynamic with broader horizons.

[Gaz]

i think a forum is made up of pple and that's what makes this forum special... this forum is bigger than just a name... it's what we members make it... and i believe that we can and will make it what it always had been... a great place to chat and discuss taylors and other stuff...

i have learnt so much about guitars in general through this forum, and a simple name change cannot affect the substance of this forum... appearance is not just that matters... it's about the pple that make it what it is...

if some feel that the forum is not so good without the taylor name and are prepared to leave just because of that, then i say that this forum would be better without them... we need dedicated members that would help others learn and decide rather than those who are infatuated with the name of 'taylor'...

what's in a name? i know this forum is a great place, and i love it!!

regards, and i apologise if i insulted anyone with how i feel...

[squintbro]

Originally posted by Whiskeyjack
This is the last post I'll make concerning Bob Taylor's incredibly stupid decision.

A lot of folks here have said, "Move on." Even I said it earlier in another thread (along with some more understanding and rational comments than you might read here). And, we'll eventually move on. This isn't the end of civilization as we know it and there's lots worse problems in each of our respective lives.

But Taylor Guitars, Inc. is a business. And there are elements of customer courtesy that have been purposely ignored by Bob Taylor. He spoke through JR to this forum. Why didn't he speak through JR when ES or luthiery issues arose? I don't undestand that.

I got to thinking about how much "I" supported Bob Taylor's business. By choice, no regrets. But I also got to thinking about how I'd respond if the dealership I bought a $4000 car from decided they didn't want to associate with me anymore because they felt my friends and associates were a liability to their establishment. Would I buy another car there? duh.

Bob Taylor figures we're a liability to him. That may not have been his intention but, from my pespective, it certainly is the signal he's sent. And apparently, a significant portion of forum members are gonna' just roll over and say, "Thank you Bob for making such fine guitars for us. You don't owe us anything. My 614ce is yummy. It's your company, created by your talent; you should have complete control. And you can do, say or be anything you want and we'll keep supporting your business because, hey, we love ya, Uncle Bob, regardless of what ya do. Here's another $2500 for another guitar just to make sure there's no hard feelings even though we're a pain in the as# and a liability to your business."

Not me.



I offer, my apologies if I've offended anyone with this line of reasoning but Woody makes a good point. He voiced his response to Bob Taylor's decision by saying his next guitar probably won't be a Taylor. I read that as a response to major PR failure and a lack of customer courtesy on the part of Taylor Guitars.

Regardless of my other posts on this issue, I made a decision yesterday regarding Taylor guitars. The decision was based on Mr. Taylor's decision to ignore an opportunity to provide customer courtesy - a courtesy he provided so wonderfully so many times before on this forum. I fired him. Bob Taylor no longer makes guitars for me. I'll keep two because they're paid for and they have a special purpose (I love 'em) but I'm always looking at good guitars and they'll likely be replaced at a later time.

Catharsis is a wonderful thing. 'Makes me realize what things mean too much to me. Taylor guitars meant way too much to me.
I shoulda' made some changes earlier: I'm gonna' make 'em now.

This is still a great forum and I hope the coming changes will make this place more dynamic with broader horizons.

Yeah... What he said!


Whiskey makes a great point. Taylor stopped making my guitars early this week. I sold my last Taylor just as this drama was unfolding. The sale was not due to the bad move by Taylor, but it made me feel good that I no longer was going to have to deal with the Taylor company. Yes Taylor makes a nice guitar. No I won't buy anymore Taylors. They don't want me, I don't want them.

[C C]

Originally posted by Whiskeyjack

I got to thinking about how much "I" supported Bob Taylor's business. By choice, no regrets. But I also got to thinking about how I'd respond if the dealership I bought a $4000 car from decided they didn't want to associate with me anymore because they felt my friends and associates were a liability to their establishment. Would I buy another car there? duh.

Whiskeyjack, I understand your point, BUT

Bob Taylor is NOT a dealer. If you walked into your local dealer (the people we should have a personal relationship with) I'm sure that they would be glad to see you.

You mention customer courtesy. Well Taylor's customers are the dealers and i would bet that pressure from some dealers had something to do with Taylor's decision.

A dealer is showing a new guitar to a customer and the customer says, "I don't want a Taylor because the ES sucks, it even said so on Taylor's OWN web site." Taylor starts getting calls from dealers and we want Taylor to do what?

I never had any contact with anyone from Chrysler Corp. but the people at my local Dodge dealer treat me just fine. I think my next one will have a Hemi.

[Doulos]

Originally posted by Whiskeyjack
This is the last post I'll make concerning Bob Taylor's incredibly stupid decision.

A lot of folks here have said, "Move on." Even I said it earlier in another thread (along with some more understanding and rational comments than you might read here). And, we'll eventually move on. This isn't the end of civilization as we know it and there's lots worse problems in each of our respective lives.

But Taylor Guitars, Inc. is a business. And there are elements of customer courtesy that have been purposely ignored by Bob Taylor. He spoke through JR to this forum. Why didn't he speak through JR when ES or luthiery issues arose? I don't undestand that.

I got to thinking about how much "I" supported Bob Taylor's business. By choice, no regrets. But I also got to thinking about how I'd respond if the dealership I bought a $4000 car from decided they didn't want to associate with me anymore because they felt my friends and associates were a liability to their establishment. Would I buy another car there? duh.

Bob Taylor figures we're a liability to him. That may not have been his intention but, from my pespective, it certainly is the signal he's sent. And apparently, a significant portion of forum members are gonna' just roll over and say, "Thank you Bob for making such fine guitars for us. You don't owe us anything. My 614ce is yummy. It's your company, created by your talent; you should have complete control. And you can do, say or be anything you want and we'll keep supporting your business because, hey, we love ya, Uncle Bob, regardless of what ya do. Here's another $2500 for another guitar just to make sure there's no hard feelings even though we're a pain in the as# and a liability to your business."

Not me.



I offer, my apologies if I've offended anyone with this line of reasoning but Woody makes a good point. He voiced his response to Bob Taylor's decision by saying his next guitar probably won't be a Taylor. I read that as a response to major PR failure and a lack of customer courtesy on the part of Taylor Guitars.

Regardless of my other posts on this issue, I made a decision yesterday regarding Taylor guitars. The decision was based on Mr. Taylor's decision to ignore an opportunity to provide customer courtesy - a courtesy he provided so wonderfully so many times before on this forum. I fired him. Bob Taylor no longer makes guitars for me. I'll keep two because they're paid for and they have a special purpose (I love 'em) but I'm always looking at good guitars and they'll likely be replaced at a later time.

Catharsis is a wonderful thing. 'Makes me realize what things mean too much to me. Taylor guitars meant way too much to me.
I shoulda' made some changes earlier: I'm gonna' make 'em now.

This is still a great forum and I hope the coming changes will make this place more dynamic with broader horizons.

great post

[bukwheat]

okie dokie, all of your names have been sent to all the Taylor dealers nationwide and they have been directed to not sell ya'll another Taylor, no matter how bad you want one, no matter what you offer.

"and the little piggie went wee wee wee, all the way home!"

Geez, sometimes human nature's many facets just boogles my mind.

Life goes on as will this forum. Thank God!

bukwheat

[squintbro]

Originally posted by bukwheat
okie dokie, all of your names have been sent to all the Taylor dealers nationwide and they have been directed to not sell ya'll another Taylor, no matter how bad you want one, no matter what you offer.

"and the little piggie went wee wee wee, all the way home!"

Geez, sometimes human nature's many facets just boogles my mind.

Life goes on as will this forum. Thank God!

bukwheat

I got no problems there. My days of buying "off the rack" guitars are over anyway. Enjoy.

[bukwheat]

Originally posted by squintbro
I got no problems there. My days of buying "off the rack" guitars are over anyway. Enjoy.

I have, I do and I will. Thank you

bukwheat

[cpmusic]

Originally posted by C C
Well Taylor's customers are the dealers

C C, that's true, but only in a clinical sense, because a dealer's decision to buy Taylors is based on business, i.e., what will sell. My decision to buy is based on how I feel about the guitar and the company that makes it, so that makes me Taylor's customer too. That's why Taylor advertises to us, not the dealer.

If I learn that a company whose products I buy is guilty of unfair or unsafe labor practices, or is responsible for polluting the air and water at more than a reasonable level for what they do, then I won't buy their products no matter how good the local dealer may be.

What Taylor has done here comes nowhere near the level of labor or pollution violations, but it still smarts to many people, and regardless of who the "customer" may be in clinical terms, it hurts Taylor's image with some of the people who buy the guitars.

[utah]

actually, many manufacturing companies consider the end user 'the customer' and the dealer 'a partner'.

However, many dealers consider the manufacturer 'the supplier' and themselves as the suppliers 'customer'.

personally....I think it is the first scenario.

I bought the guitar. I cannot buy direct from Taylor. I have to use one of their 'partners' in distribution to purchase. But, in the end....I am the 'customer'.

Don't even try to dissagree with me cause you know what they say....

The 'customer' is always right! lol.

Just my two cents.

[TKeys]

Well stated, Whiskeyjack.

Todd