Any Pilots Here?

[HodgdonExtreme]

Originally Posted by Kerbie

I think that's a large leap.

Could be. As mentioned, I wasn't aware this was going on at all until this thread.

[Huskyman]

Originally Posted by Kerbie

Husky,

That's kind of odd because the rules governing which way a traffic pattern goes apply only when ATC is not operating. If they are, the pattern goes whichever way ATC says it goes. And major airports typically have ATC present.

It is possible and legal for an airliner to land at an uncontrolled airport. When that happens, the pilots usually terminate ATC communications before entering the pattern. If that's impossible due to bad weather, then no other traffic is allowed at the field until the airliner lands and calls ATC to terminate their flight plan.

It's been quite a few months since I saw that video but I am almost certain it was a large airport I think in Kansas City and there was atf. I know for sure he was complacent and flew the wrong way into the pattern as that was the purpose of his whole video, to show his error.

I have seen a lot of recreations of airliner crashes that have happened over the years and they are never done for blood and gore but for education. Usually it's a flight sim and you see the controls and sometimes you hear the actual audio that was said. From what I have seen there are 3 major reasons for accidents. Pilot error, mechanical failure and bad maintenance on the ground. I remember one airliner that was ready to land in Chicago in the middle of the night and when they put the gear down one of the lights did not light. So the captain asked to be able to fly in a holding pattern while they did some trouble shooting and that was granted. He was very fixated in taking the bulb out and re-seating it again. He was using pliers. He did send the flight engineer down into a compartment to see if he could see the gear down. He came down and said it was too dark to tell and the pilot sent him back down again and said look for a row of lights on the side of the gear that should light up. In the meantime the co-pilot did a button push that tested all the lights on the control panel and they all lit up except for the one landing gear. So that was telling them that the bulb was no good but the pilot still wanted to pull it out and reseat it. This airplane had a safety feature that if you tapped a certain area of the control panel it would shut off the auto pilot. While the captain was so fixated on the bulb he accidentally tapped that area and turned off the auto pilot. For some reason it did not notify him that auto pilot was off. So while he fussed with that bulb the plane was slowly losing altitude and by the time it gave the pull up warning it was too late.

And an example of maintenance error was when a plane had been washed the day before and the guy who washed it used plain gray duct tape to cover the sensor vents. He was supposed to use fluorescent orange but was out of it. When he was all done he forgot to remove one piece of tape that covered the altitude sensor. The next day when the plane was ready to fly and the co-pilot did his walk around he did not see the tape because it was gray and way up there. So when the plane did take off after a bit they were getting crazy readings and then it calmed down but the readings were wrong and it led to a crash.

I have all the respect for any pilot of any kind. In many of those airline crashes where it was pure mechanical failure there were some real heros where pilots remained calm and hung in there right to the end when they knew what was coming.

There is one guy who has a channel where it's nothing but audio and some of the exchanges between atc and some very bad pilots are priceless. I heard one the other day where a pilot flew into Bravo Airspace without permission and the female atc was upset with him and told him to leave until he gets permission. He acted like a total baby and actually did not leave so he had to make a phone call at the end.

And then theres Harrison Ford and his landing with his Husky Aviat at Los Angeles. Are you familiar with that one??

[Kerbie]

Originally Posted by Huskyman

I have seen a lot of recreations of airliner crashes that have happened over the years and they are never done for blood and gore but for education. Usually it's a flight sim and you see the controls and sometimes you hear the actual audio that was said.

Yep... I've seen a ton of those. Almost every recurrent training session for airline pilots has a featured section about a recent incident or accident in the same aircraft. It's an excellent way to learn.

Originally Posted by Huskyman

From what I have seen there are 3 major reasons for accidents. Pilot error, mechanical failure and bad maintenance on the ground.

There are a lot of different statistics covering different time periods, aircraft size, pilot experience, etc. I would think you'd usually see weather in those lists too.

Originally Posted by Huskyman

In many of those airline crashes where it was pure mechanical failure there were some real heros where pilots remained calm and hung in there right to the end when they knew what was coming.

Yeah, pilots fall back on their training and keep trying to solve the problem... all the way down if necessary.

Originally Posted by Huskyman

And then theres Harrison Ford and his landing with his Husky Aviat at Los Angeles. Are you familiar with that one??

I think Ford has had several problems in aircraft. He crashed onto a golf course in Santa Monica, caused a safety incident by crossing a runway improperly and he landed on a taxiway at John Wayne. And that list may not be complete.

[1neeto]

Always wanted to be since I was a kid. Still a bucket list.

[Kerbie]

These days it costs almost as much as another college education, but there are some creative ways to do it. The flight simulators that folks can build at their computers are pretty sweet too... and much less expensive.

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by Kerbie

These days it costs almost as much as another college education, but there are some creative ways to do it. The flight simulators that folks can build at their computers are pretty sweet too... and much less expensive.

And to think I could have gotten my private ticket for $200 in the Civil Air Patrol back in the '70s.

Bob

[Kerbie]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

And to think I could have gotten my private ticket for $200 in the Civil Air Patrol back in the '70s.

Bob

$200? What a steal! Mine wasn't that cheap, but it wasn't nearly as much as another college degree. Think that makes me an old pilot?

[HodgdonExtreme]

I got my PPL in 2017. Spent $13k all up, including books, headset, tests/examinations, CFI time and time in the Piper. I think I got my ticket with 55 hours in the logbook, which isn't "fast".

Not cheap, but most people could afford it if they prioritized it over other expenditures for a couple years. nice(r) cars, going out to eat, booze, vacations, guitars, etc.

Flying jets, on the other hand - that's serious money.

[Kerbie]

Originally Posted by HodgdonExtreme

Flying jets, on the other hand - that's serious money.

Indeed it is. That's why many use the military to get there.

[Huskyman]

Originally Posted by Kerbie

I think Ford has had several problems in aircraft. He crashed onto a golf course in Santa Monica, caused a safety incident by crossing a runway improperly and he landed on a taxiway at John Wayne. And that list may not be complete.

Crashed a helicopter also but like the golf course incident it may have been mechanical failure. The wrong runway thing was pretty bad though. I never realized that before it happened he had some odd transmissions with atc. When he first requested landing clearance he stated he was a helicopter but quickly caught his mistake.

Maybe it's time to sit in the right seat and let that wookie do the flying??

[Fogducker]

Seems like the self-important folks feel like they have a better handle on things. John Denver messed up the fuel selector, John Kennedy Jr. flew into weather he couldn't handle and lots of doctors, lawyers and business men that HAVE to get home before Monday. The laws of physics, weather and airplanes are not to be messed with and hence are unforgiving.

Fog

[HodgdonExtreme]

This one hurts to watch. No injury or gore - just appalling airmanship!

Love how he turns off the GoPro at the end:



Dude was not ready to solo...

[Kerbie]

Ouch! He was downwind of the extended centerline from the first moment you can see the runway. Looks like he doesn't quite understand landing in crosswinds yet. That can be a bit tricky.

Might need to work on his flare too.

Got some more of those, HE?

[HodgdonExtreme]

He wasn't really even on an "approach" - his airspeed is 90+. You can see he actually pushes the yoke forward to descend, instead of throttling/trimming the airplane onto a nice stabilized glideslope.

When he floated in ground effect, he really really ought to have throttled up and gone around. He had plenty of airspeed and runway to do it.

Easy to Monday morning quarterback these things, though. Who knows what other factors were involved? Glad he didn't seem hurt. The Cessna is another story, but an old 172 isn't *that* great a loss...

Regarding the crosswind landing - my it took me a LOT of practice to learn to slip the airplane correctly, and control it naturally. My CFI honed in on that deficiency and trained me HARD on it.

I'll dig up a few more ouchies I've come across, tonight.

[Huskyman]

Originally Posted by HodgdonExtreme

This one hurts to watch. No injury or gore - just appalling airmanship!

Love how he turns off the GoPro at the end:



Dude was not ready to solo...

Was there some damage done?