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  #16  
Old 07-15-2019, 09:15 PM
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min7b5 min7b5 is offline
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Originally Posted by catdaddy View Post
Thanks for those suggestions guys! I started watching Joshua Carney's introductory video on youtube last night. Very helpful, and I'm seriously considering purchasing the groove3 tutorial. The more I can educate myself on using Logic the better the results are bound to be.

Do both for sure. I've also watched Joshua Carney's, and it's great also. Doesn't hurt to get different points of view, and redundancy is a good thing. Could just be me, but I need to watch these things over and over. Also, the other great thing about Groove3 is that it's just gigantic. These lots of Logic stuff, but also every other DAW... And then just lots of vids on other aspects of recording, like room treatments, microphones, interviews with seasoned engineers, etc. Even guitar lessons. I'm addicted
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  #17  
Old 07-15-2019, 09:34 PM
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Do both for sure. I've also watched Joshua Carney's, and it's great also. Doesn't hurt to get different points of view, and redundancy is a good thing. Could just be me, but I need to watch these things over and over. Also, the other great thing about Groove3 is that it's just gigantic. These lots of Logic stuff, but also every other DAW... And then just lots of vids on other aspects of recording, like room treatments, microphones, interviews with seasoned engineers, etc. Even guitar lessons. I'm addicted
Sounds incredibly comprehensive, and I'm more of a methodical learner than a quick study so I can also envision watching them over and over. I just wonder if my wife and friends will miss me.
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  #18  
Old 07-16-2019, 08:45 AM
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Sounds incredibly comprehensive, and I'm more of a methodical learner than a quick study so I can also envision watching them over and over. I just wonder if my wife and friends will miss me.
Just remember IMO the important thing is to focus on the the basic tasks of getting Logic loaded and up and running and focus on just the basic recording first . Get familiar with Logics basic workflow and do a couple very basic recordings . Then move into the more feature rich aspects slowly as per needed.
Coming from a more limited consumer type DAW to a full featured professional DAW can at first glance appear to be hopelessly overwhelming and complex .
But in reality the basics of all DAWs is pretty much the same in terms of just getting some audio signals (like guitar and or vocals etc. ) into the digital realm and back out
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  #19  
Old 07-19-2019, 01:51 PM
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Sounds incredibly comprehensive, and I'm more of a methodical learner than a quick study so I can also envision watching them over and over. I just wonder if my wife and friends will miss me.
Doesn't absence make the heart grow fonder???
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  #20  
Old 07-20-2019, 10:41 AM
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I'll be interested in this thread too. Same basic situation as you. One addition I've been happy with, in lieu of garage band yet, is an external hard drive, dedicated only to music recording. I got a decent one, and it has helped keeping up with multi tracks, etc.. Speeds everything up and keeps the data safer, I believe. I got a glyph 1 tb.
I’m running GarageBand (GB) on an older iMac and run into latency issues almost every time I record. Also “slow disc” error messages. Until I inevitably(?) have to get a new machine. Maybe your method would help with my problems.

How exactly do you use the external drive while recording; is it simply a matter of storing all your files there, and GB accesses them from your computer's hard drive, or do you move the whole app to the external disc?

Last edited by upsidedown; 07-20-2019 at 01:50 PM.
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  #21  
Old 07-20-2019, 02:33 PM
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I’m running GarageBand on an older iMac and run into latency issues almost every time I record. Also “slow disc” error messages. Until I inevitably(?) have to get a new machine. Maybe your method would help with my problems.

How exactly do you use the external drive with GarageBand; is it simply a matter of storing all its files there, or are you running GarageBand .. I’m so computer illiterate that I can’t properly frame the question! So, “how do you do it?”
I hope one of our more knowledgable members will respond to you with better info than I can provide (as I've only been doing computer-based recording for about 6 months) but I'll mention a few things I've learned about recording latency while working with Garageband:

First, the quality of the recording interface is important. Some of the cheaper ones have inherent latency issues. I'm using a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 which the manufacturer claims has close to zero latency.

I've seen mentioned in other forum discussions that using a lot of high CPU draining plugins in Garageband can contribute to latency issues. One suggestion I saw was to inactivate those plugins in your project when recording to lessen or avoid latency problems.

The amount of RAM that your iMac has will play a large role in how quickly recording data can be processed. From what I've read at least 8MB of RAM is needed for adequate recording performance in Garageband.

Finally, if your iMac's internal hard drive is above 80% of its capacity its speed will start to decrease significantly, thus creating latency and other issues.

An external hard drive such as the Glyph that Cory mentions can take some of the burden off of your iMac's internal HD and give you better performance. With Logic Pro you can store all of the library sounds and loop library data on an external drive to free up space on your internal HD, thus potentially improving performance. I'm not sure if you can do that with Garageband, but I think there's a chance given it's basic similarity to Logic.

I just checked out some of the Glyph HDs, and they seem to be designed specifically for things like audio and video recording. The ones I saw all had 64MB of RAM which should allow for very quick processing, and would allow you to avoid "slow disc" messages. The Glyph HDs also have backwards compatible Firewire, USB and eSATA connectivity so you can plug them into any port of that type that your iMac has. The downside to the backward compatibility is that if your iMac has a USB 2.0 port even though the Glyph HD can work at speeds up to USB 3.0, you will be limited by the iMac's slower USB 2.0 port speed. Also, the specs on the Glyph HDs that I looked at mentioned that they were compatible with OSX 10.4 and above. If your iMac is running an older OSX version the Glyph HD may not work.

I hope some of that makes sense and is helpful in some way. It might help other members to respond with specific suggestions to your post if you can mention what OSX version you are using, how much RAM your iMac has and what type(s) of connectivity ports you have available.
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  #22  
Old 07-20-2019, 04:28 PM
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Just to clear a few things up from Cats post above

He is correct in that the better the latency handling (faster/lower ) rating for the interface used the less noticeable it will be.

Yes the use of plugins while recording can increase latency and Cat is correct the more processing intensive the plugin the more the latency (But some interfaces and some full featured DAWS offer direct input monitoring ) but that usually by passes plugins.

Most full featured DAWs offer the selection of of sample number/size setting in the Buffer based on session sample rate and bit size etc. Which can affect perceived latency also. Especially above 128



Also IMO I would not mess with an External Hard Drive I would look for an external SSD drive and appropriate adaptor/cable for your machine. The data transfer rates for an SSD will be way way faster and will usually be limited by only the speed of the connection protocol of your machine

Here is a brief but concise article on this subject and referencing Logic specifically

https://medium.com/@seankimzey/under...g-7dd76db35caa
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  #23  
Old 07-20-2019, 05:01 PM
Trevor B. Trevor B. is offline
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Here is a brief but concise article on this subject and referencing Logic specifically

https://medium.com/@seankimzey/under...g-7dd76db35caa
Super little article!!! Thanks for posting the link.
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  #24  
Old 07-21-2019, 06:38 AM
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I’m running GarageBand (GB) on an older iMac and run into latency issues almost every time I record. Also “slow disc” error messages. Until I inevitably(?) have to get a new machine. Maybe your method would help with my problems.

How exactly do you use the external drive while recording; is it simply a matter of storing all your files there, and GB accesses them from your computer's hard drive, or do you move the whole app to the external disc?
If you are planning to use an external hard drive to improve performance I would recommend you get an external SSD rather than a spinning disk.

Even better it should be possible for you to swap the internal system disk in your iMac with a larger SSD. Of course you would probably have to reinstall the OS. But this would make your machine seem much faster.

Regarding latency I'm running my cheap Behringer UMC202 and UMC404 audio interfaces with a 32 sample buffer and I don't usually have any issues with that. I also have a RME Babyface interface and that would go down to 48 samples.
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  #25  
Old 07-21-2019, 01:30 PM
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Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed replies to my thread hijack.

CAT, like you, my interface is a Scarlett, though it's a 2i2. I don't use any plug-ins at all while recording and my internal HD is NOW something just over half full (last year when I thought my ol' iMac was on its last legs, I downloaded/subscribed to CleanMyMac and have been systematically freeing up space; I had been down to like, almost nothing. The improvement is remarkable). And I have 8 gigs of RAM.

When I occasionally record on my wife's macbook pro, I have no latency issues whatsoever, so I *think* the issue is a slowly spinning disc on my machine.

KEV, the closest thing to "sample number/size setting" in my version of GB (10.2) preferences is a click on or off box for Audio Recording Resolution. It's either 24 bit on or off. And I have no clue what the "off" setting would be. Looking forward to reading the article you linked. Thanks.

PAULP, I'd never heard of an SSD, so I'll do my homework. Thanks.
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  #26  
Old 07-21-2019, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by upsidedown View Post
Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed replies to my thread hijack.

CAT, like you, my interface is a Scarlett, though it's a 2i2. I don't use any plug-ins at all while recording and my internal HD is NOW something just over half full (last year when I thought my ol' iMac was on its last legs, I downloaded/subscribed to CleanMyMac and have been systematically freeing up space; I had been down to like, almost nothing. The improvement is remarkable). And I have 8 gigs of RAM.

When I occasionally record on my wife's macbook pro, I have no latency issues whatsoever, so I *think* the issue is a slowly spinning disc on my machine.

KEV, the closest thing to "sample number/size setting" in my version of GB (10.2) preferences is a click on or off box for Audio Recording Resolution. It's either 24 bit on or off. And I have no clue what the "off" setting would be. Looking forward to reading the article you linked. Thanks.

PAULP, I'd never heard of an SSD, so I'll do my homework. Thanks.
An SSD is a Solid State Drive ( all electronic signals ) there is no mechanical spinning disk like on a HDD (Hard Disc Drive) . More reliable and faster data transfer speeds
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  #27  
Old 07-21-2019, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by upsidedown View Post
Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed replies to my thread hijack.

CAT, like you, my interface is a Scarlett, though it's a 2i2. I don't use any plug-ins at all while recording and my internal HD is NOW something just over half full (last year when I thought my ol' iMac was on its last legs, I downloaded/subscribed to CleanMyMac and have been systematically freeing up space; I had been down to like, almost nothing. The improvement is remarkable). And I have 8 gigs of RAM.

When I occasionally record on my wife's macbook pro, I have no latency issues whatsoever, so I *think* the issue is a slowly spinning disc on my machine.

KEV, the closest thing to "sample number/size setting" in my version of GB (10.2) preferences is a click on or off box for Audio Recording Resolution. It's either 24 bit on or off. And I have no clue what the "off" setting would be. Looking forward to reading the article you linked. Thanks.

PAULP, I'd never heard of an SSD, so I'll do my homework. Thanks.
If you uncheck the box next to 24 bit, the recording resolution defaults to 16 bit. Might be worth a try to see if it improves latency. Of course, doing so will result in poorer recording quality.

One thing that does effect latency for certain is the I/O buffer sample size. The higher the buffer sampling rate the more latency can occur when recording (the opposite is true when playing back or mixing). So ideally you want a low rate when recording and a high rate when playing back. Unfortunately, Garageband doesn't allow you to control the I/O buffer sample rate. I don't know what the default setting is in Garageband. In Logic you can set the sample rate at 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, or 1024, and change it at any time.

Your 2i2 Scarlett interface is a good one, and should minimize any possible latency on that end. Likewise the 8GB of RAM, and a HD that is only 50% full (I've heard great things about the CleanMyMac app- I've thought about buying it) should be more than adequate to avoid being the cause of latency issues. Do you happen to know what the speed and type of CPU processor your iMac has? As you suggested, it does seem like that could be the problem since you have no issues using your wife's MacBook Pro (coincidentally my wife has one as well- it has a 2.3GHz Intel Core i5). FWIW my iMac has a 3.4GHz Intel Core i5 processor. Check your processor speed on your iMac to see if it might be close to those speeds.

Another advantage to Logic over Garageband is that Logic has a meter that will display your computer's CPU usage during recording and playback so you can monitor how well your computer's processor is keeping up. My iMac handles everything I've tried when using Logic with lots of processing power to spare according to the meter and I've never had an issue with latency.
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  #28  
Old 07-21-2019, 09:25 PM
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Latency is really only an issue when you are recording and (i) are listening through headphones to what you are recording at the same time or (ii) are listening to previously recorded tracks while recording another instrument at the same time.

Latency is not an issue if your are recording without headphones or when mixing.
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  #29  
Old 07-22-2019, 05:59 AM
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Latency is really only an issue when you are recording and (i) are listening through headphones to what you are recording at the same time or (ii) are listening to previously recorded tracks while recording another instrument at the same time.

Latency is not an issue if your are recording without headphones or when mixing.
Of course, you're correct. I was wrong in stating that a too low I/O buffer sample rate would contribute to latency on playback/mixing. There are problems associated with having the sample rate too low for mixing, such as possible sound anomalies or dropouts, but not latency. Still, the main point that I made about the ideal I/O buffer sample rate being lower for recording and higher for mixing is correct.
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  #30  
Old 07-22-2019, 12:00 PM
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Latency is really only an issue when you are recording and (i) are listening through headphones to what you are recording at the same time or (ii) are listening to previously recorded tracks while recording another instrument at the same time.

Latency is not an issue if your are recording without headphones or when mixing.
Latency is also an issue when you play sounds from a keyboard generated on the computer. Eg soft synths, sampler library sounds like piano.
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