Taylor Zero Fret

[guitar george]

Originally Posted by chistrummer

What's with the blacked out guitar body?

Looks like it might be a Taylor cigar-box guitar?

[Otterhound]

I have spent countless hours learning to make a flawless nut . Zero frets are junk . I believe that there may be something to this .

[mercy]

Most builders and factories cant do a good nut job so a zero fret takes care of that in spite of its own drawbacks, so no not junk, just second best in an ideal world. This is not the first thread about zero frets.

[Otterhound]

Originally Posted by mercy

Most builders and factories cant do a good nut job so a zero fret takes care of that in spite of its own drawbacks, so no not junk, just second best in an ideal world. This is not the first thread about zero frets.

OK . What makes a zero fret second best ?

[ChalkLitIScream]

Originally Posted by DenverSteve

Here is a clear shot of Andy at last year's NAMM show. I think what is seen in the bad photo is a reflection just below the nut. But, anything's possible.

Attachment 17559

the reflection at the nut seems very similar to the frets-my guess is a zero fret🤷
If have expected the black nut reflection to be different than the fret shine.

We shall find out.

[Mandobart]

Originally Posted by Spyvito

I have a zero fret archtop and ditto. Here is what will be touted: sound of open strings exactly the same as fretted. Friction of string for tuning substantially reduced.

I' m with Mr. Beaumont on this. I have 5 zero fret instruments. The open strings still are louder and have more sustain than fingered notes. Its nice not having to mess with nut slots when changing string gage.

[Rudy4]

It's pretty obvious the photo has a reflection shown.

I have zero fret instruments and there's nothing wrong with them, and actually can have beneficial effects.

FYI, Bob Taylor recently was asked about the zero fret in "Wood and Wire" and responded that there's nothing inherently wrong with zero frets, but Taylor chooses not to use them because they are a hard sell for their customers, who prefer a "traditional" look.

[JayBee1404]

Originally Posted by Otterhound

Zero frets are junk

Try telling that to Roger Bucknall (Fylde Guitars, one of the UK's top builders). Every one of his instruments (guitars, mandolins, octave mandolins, citterns) has a zero-fret, and he makes a very good argument for the zero-fret on his website.

He has built custom instruments for such luminaries as Eric Clapton, Martin Simpson, Gordon Giltrap, Martin Carthy, Davey Graham, Nic Jones, John Renbourn, Ritchie Blackmore, Eric Bibb, and many others. If a zero-fret is good enough for a recognised top builder and supreme professionals like those guys, I really struggle to understand how it can be summarily dismissed as 'junk'. 'Not to an individual's taste' certainly, but 'junk'? Really?

The usual disclaimers apply......IMHO, YMMV etc.

https://www.fyldeguitars.com/index.html

https://www.fyldeguitars.com/sw-zerofrets.html

[AndrewG]

I had an old Eko Ranger XII with a zero fret which, on a 12-string, made setups really simple and guaranteed a comfortable action and even tone. Although in the case of Eko 'tone' is a subjective and debatable quality!

[JayBee1404]

Originally Posted by AndrewG

I had an old Eko Ranger XII with a zero fret which, on a 12-string, made setups really simple and guaranteed a comfortable action and even tone. Although in the case of Eko 'tone' is a subjective and debatable quality!

LOL! A lady performer I know still has one of those - she loves it. And it actually sounds rather nice!

[ataylor]

It’s not a zero fret.

[mercy]

Otterhound asked what disadvantages I meant so at the risk of going off topic Im answering:
Adjusting the action of a zero fret is more difficult, and replacing a worn zero fret is harder than popping off a traditional nut and gluing a new one in its place. The zero fret is going to need replacement as it wears out (string grooves) and starts to cause buzzing. Needless to say, that's harder than just swapping a nut. A zero fret wears faster than a nut. When the zero fret starts wearing, it can interfere with string bending. The same nut height, zero in this case, is not optimal for all players
Paul Woolson has said “intonation would be better as well as being a bit adjustable with a nut. Once the zero fret is cut, that's it, you've got not options. With a nut, you can, and I do on every guitar, reduce the distance between nut and 1st fret by about .015" to intonate it better. Then if you need to work the other way, the slots on the nut can be beveled in a way that the termination can happen anywhere along the 1/4'' width. To replace the zero fret it has to be exact, it pretty much needs a complete fret dress. Otherwise the builder/tech has no way to gauge the proper height of the zero fret. If you like that particular action of a zero fret, you are golden. But if you prefer something different, higher for example, you are stuck. Heavy handed players also tend to like a higher nut so that they can really hit the low E hard. With a bone nut, you can swap it out and adjust to your heart's content.”
If you tune down you’ve got a problem. You can get away with a lower nut height if you never tune your low E down to D or C.
With a zero fret, the neck had better be right. If some neck work is needed the zero fret is a bummer
And I don't care for the way they look, No science involved.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by mercy

Otterhound asked what disadvantages I meant so at the risk of going off topic Im answering:
Adjusting the action of a zero fret is more difficult, and replacing a worn zero fret is harder than popping off a traditional nut and gluing a new one in its place. The zero fret is going to need replacement as it wears out (string grooves) and starts to cause buzzing. Needless to say, that's harder than just swapping a nut. A zero fret wears faster than a nut. When the zero fret starts wearing, it can interfere with string bending. The same nut height, zero in this case, is not optimal for all players
Paul Woolson has said “intonation would be better as well as being a bit adjustable with a nut. Once the zero fret is cut, that's it, you've got not options. With a nut, you can, and I do on every guitar, reduce the distance between nut and 1st fret by about .015" to intonate it better. Then if you need to work the other way, the slots on the nut can be beveled in a way that the termination can happen anywhere along the 1/4'' width. To replace the zero fret it has to be exact, it pretty much needs a complete fret dress. Otherwise the builder/tech has no way to gauge the proper height of the zero fret. If you like that particular action of a zero fret, you are golden. But if you prefer something different, higher for example, you are stuck. Heavy handed players also tend to like a higher nut so that they can really hit the low E hard. With a bone nut, you can swap it out and adjust to your heart's content.”
If you tune down you’ve got a problem. You can get away with a lower nut height if you never tune your low E down to D or C.
With a zero fret, the neck had better be right. If some neck work is needed the zero fret is a bummer
And I don't care for the way they look, No science involved.

The beauty of the zero fret is... it's just another fret. If your guitar is designed and set up correctly it's simply an extension of the 12th root of 2 formula that equal temperament is based upon.

So it's actually all about science.

If you want higher clearances to your first fret simply swap out for a taller wire. You're not "dead in the water".

I've been using zeros for many years and I don't notice any particular wear. Maybe if I used a whammy bar on my Lowden...

What's wrong with a neck being "right"?

I've built and repaired instruments for 45 years and I always enjoy seeing someone denegrate zero frets.

Ther's nothing wrong if you want a traditional nut, but the "proofs" don't hold water.

[Spyvito]

So Taylor says it is not a zero fret but a reflection.
How come when I take a picture the reflection I get does not look like a metal fret?

[Spyvito]

Originally Posted by Spyvito

So Taylor says it is not a zero fret but a reflection.

How come when I take a picture the reflection I get does not look like a metal fret?