How to knock the bass back a bit to improve balance

[RalphH]

I'm really getting into this Epi. I still love the tone of my taylor for solo guitar playing - it's so alive and sparkly, but for singing and playing I suddenly find my taylor obnoxiously bright, like I'm competing with it, and really prefer the mellow sounds of my epi. I think I'll put the titanium pins in the epi and get some rosewood ones for the taylor to knock it back a bit.

It's amazing. My taylor had the voice of an angel until I spent two days playing the hell out of this new guitar, now at least when I'm singing, I really prefer mellower.

I remember reading a review saying the Koa Mini is great for fingerpicking but a bit bright for strumming. I didn't agree with that assessment in the slightest before but I might see what they meant

[vindibona1]

Originally Posted by RalphH

SOLVED IT! -- Well, greatly improved matters anyway.

Right hand techique helped a bit, but it occurred to me it's the 2-5k range where it was really lacking, not the high open strings range. It just had no sparkle

The action was REALLY high and the piezo REALLY crummy sounding - I'd never have used it, so I thought "hmmmm"..

And took it out. The action is now down to a better height and still no buzz anywhere (it really was that high before!) and it sounds more sparkly. The Piezo was very rubbery. I think it was stripping a lot of the really high frequencies out of the sound.

Glad to hear you're further along. Still, if you try some different strings you may be even more pleased. One set that gets overlooked are the D'Addario Nickel Bronze. Well balanced with a lot of clarity. I think John Pearse PB's might be a good choice, but a different sound again. If you want more warmth, Gibson Masterbuilt PB's (the old version).

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by RalphH

…I'm wondering if a wooden sound hole plug (I've seen them around) would knock the bass back a bit, but less so, and balance up the sound a bit more.

Hi Ralph

I own both Big-Black-Rubber-Plugs and LuteHole covers for my guitars (LuteHole covers look classier when playing weddings and funerals).

The LuteHole covers are matched to each of my three very different main guitars, and they don't change the tone of any guitar…just the output volume (and knock back some feedback).

For students, I've recommended pick weight and stroke path between the sound hole and bridge. The closer you get to the bridge (further from the sound hole) the gnarlier it sounds, so there are limits to it's effectiveness.

Let us know what you discover!

Hope this adds to the discussion.

[RalphH]

Ok, did a bit of an experiment and tap-tested the guitars, recorded it with a microphone and plotted their resonances.

(basically stuffed padding under the strings to mute them, aimed a microphone at the soundhole and taped on the top beneath the bridge to make the guitar ring)

Just a bit of fun - I found it interesting; it's not about the balance between bottom E and top E strings (82 & 330 hz), the difference is all the resonance the Taylor has above 1khz (all the way up to 20khz) - which the epi just has none of - that makes the difference in the sound - that's why the Taylor has so much 'air' and shimmer in the sound and the epi just doesn't.



This is not as much as a 'the taylor is better' scenario as you might think though; the epi can sit easier in a mix with the narrower space it takes up in the spectrum, and while you can EQ amplified sound, you can't EQ acoustic sound. It's probably why I actually prefer the Epi for some songs if i'm trying to sing over it, though a really soft pick like a thick nylon pick (or a carpet sample) would probably soften the taylor a bit

[RalphH]

Originally Posted by vindibona1

Glad to hear you're further along. Still, if you try some different strings you may be even more pleased. One set that gets overlooked are the D'Addario Nickel Bronze. Well balanced with a lot of clarity. I think John Pearse PB's might be a good choice, but a different sound again. If you want more warmth, Gibson Masterbuilt PB's (the old version).

OMG, completely solved now; putting PB strings on it was the last piece of the puzzle.

Having only used PB strings before getting this guitar, which came with 80/20s, I hadn't appreciated just how different PB's and 80/20s are. To my ears it's almost as dramatic as the difference between steel and nylon.

With 80/20s, you just get the note you're playing and that's it. With PBs, there's all this extra metallic harmonic shimmering that I'm used to from my PB equipped Taylor. I'd just read that 80/20s were 'a bit brighter' and PB's 'balanced'

It sounds completely different now and almost exactly what I was hoping for - if anything it was a little too lively to start with, but it's settled down now after a couple of hours of playing. Maybe I can stop hankering after a gibson dreadnought, at least for now

[Gordon Currie]

Originally Posted by DenverSteve

Then only buy guitars that have the balance and tone you seek.

Since I require a balanced response, I learned long ago that even considering anything that wasn't in that range was going to be wasted time and money.

Sometimes there are tweaks one can do, but for me custom strings and custom right hand approach is adding too much effort. I have enough variance moving between multiple acoustics, mandolin, classical, electric and fretted/fretless bass. The more commonalities I can define the better.

[RalphH]

I actually got off lucky - once I took out the terrible piezo and put my regular strings on it, it sounds more or less like I want without worrying about changes to right hand approach.

I was buying a 'cheaper' guitar as something I could take to more places and have around the (young) children without worrying, so I just bought the best sounding one within budget. I'm pleased with how the sound has turned out.