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  #46  
Old 08-27-2018, 04:10 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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I wonder if Bose will come out with a subwoofer for the Bose S1? It could be the lightweight Bose B1 Subwoofer with a Bose PackLite Amp built-in (or a lesser-powered, newer-design amp built-in). The B1 Active Subwoofer would be lightweight, compact, and could compliment not only the Bose S1 but also the Bose L1 Compact. It would be neat to have a small PA comprised of one or two Bose S1 Active Speakers with a Bose B1 Active PackLite Subwoofer! The cost would likely be around $1800 for a Dual Bose S1/Single B1 Active system and that puts it in the price-range of a Bose L1 Model S without a T1 ToneMatch, so maybe a Dual Bose S1/Single B1 Active Subwoofer price-point wouldn't appeal to many players? Then again, maybe a Single Bose S1/Single B1 Active Subwoofer System would?
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  #47  
Old 08-28-2018, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryM View Post
Anyone using the tone match with two s1's? need a power cable to the first and then link the two as I understand.
You need to power both and then link them with a "jack"-"jack" cable.

You could also use the 2 outputs from the tone match, I would suggest. Just remember the Aux output will not have reverb. You can add it directly on the S1 connected to the Aux. This way you have more control on what/how much you send to each S1 in a kind of stereo.
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  #48  
Old 08-29-2018, 02:12 AM
Peter Z Peter Z is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpruceTop View Post
I wonder if Bose will come out with a subwoofer for the Bose S1? It could be the lightweight Bose B1 Subwoofer with a Bose PackLite Amp built-in (or a lesser-powered, newer-design amp built-in). The B1 Active Subwoofer would be lightweight, compact, and could compliment not only the Bose S1 but also the Bose L1 Compact. It would be neat to have a small PA comprised of one or two Bose S1 Active Speakers with a Bose B1 Active PackLite Subwoofer! The cost would likely be around $1800 for a Dual Bose S1/Single B1 Active system and that puts it in the price-range of a Bose L1 Model S without a T1 ToneMatch, so maybe a Dual Bose S1/Single B1 Active Subwoofer price-point wouldn't appeal to many players? Then again, maybe a Single Bose S1/Single B1 Active Subwoofer System would?
I don't think Bose will come out with a sub for the S1 or the L1 compact.
When I had my compacts I used a cheap, small & light Behringer B1200d subwoofer.
It is active, has built in xover, a phase switch and a (rather unnecessary) bass boost. It is more than sufficient for 2 compacts. I even sent a kick drum and a double bass from time to time into it. I think this is what you're looking for.
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  #49  
Old 08-29-2018, 03:16 AM
Groovekings Groovekings is offline
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Default Bose already makes this

Bose already makes the equivalent of 2 S1's and a sub. It's called the L1 Compact. The S1 serves a focused narrow purpose. If you need more buy an L1 Compact or two powered speakers. I'm reminded of the old saying " when all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail "
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  #50  
Old 08-29-2018, 03:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groovekings View Post
Bose already makes the equivalent of 2 S1's and a sub. It's called the L1 Compact. The S1 serves a focused narrow purpose. If you need more buy an L1 Compact or two powered speakers. I'm reminded of the old saying " when all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail "
It's not the same concept. We are talking of 2 speakers (S1) VS 1 line (Compact).
2 S1 allows you to make a "stereo" in the point of view of "placing" the different instruments. Imagine you have 2 guitars and 2 voices, you can send a guitar on one side, the other on the other side, even if you are not in a usual PA system (place the speakers behind the musicians)
The L1 can be placed only in one place >> all together >> not so clear to ear yourself. (of course 2 L1 will be completely different)
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  #51  
Old 08-29-2018, 04:15 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groovekings View Post
Bose already makes the equivalent of 2 S1's and a sub. It's called the L1 Compact. The S1 serves a focused narrow purpose. If you need more buy an L1 Compact or two powered speakers. I'm reminded of the old saying " when all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail "
The Bose B1 goes down to about 40 Hz @ -10 dB and the Bose L1 Compact is only good for 65 Hz with a similar dB down spec, so there isn't any comparison when it comes to better amplifying the bassier frequencies. I still think a Bose B1 Active would make a nice addition to the Bose S1 and Bose L1 Compact.
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  #52  
Old 08-29-2018, 04:31 PM
lkingston lkingston is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpruceTop View Post
The Bose B1 goes down to about 40 Hz @ -10 dB and the Bose L1 Compact is only good for 65 Hz with a similar dB down spec, so there isn't any comparison when it comes to better amplifying the bassier frequencies. I still think a Bose B1 Active would make a nice addition to the Bose S1 and Bose L1 Compact.


Low E on a guitar is around 82 Hz. I do a lot of drop-D which goes down to 73Hz. No need for a sub with just guitar and vocals.
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  #53  
Old 08-30-2018, 02:37 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Originally Posted by lkingston View Post
Low E on a guitar is around 82 Hz. I do a lot of drop-D which goes down to 73Hz. No need for a sub with just guitar and vocals.
You're correct but with other instruments of greater frequency range added to the mix or to just pump out between sets canned music, a B1 would add greatly to the amplified tone of a system. There's no need to add a subwoofer to the Fishman SA330 system either if only playing a solo vocal/guitar act but it's available for those who desire to add more bass response to their gig for whatever reason.
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  #54  
Old 08-30-2018, 03:28 AM
Groovekings Groovekings is offline
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First, the frequency range of the S1 needs to be considered with how fast the db drop off at the low end. Yes they say it goes down to 40 hz, but not at the same db as the rest of the frequencies, in other words they drop off quickly negating any perceived low end. Also, as the poster mentioned , guitar and voice don't go that low. Also, most people's hearing is not good at the low end.

Second, after 50 years playing, nobody I know runs their system in stereo. It's simply not practical. All audience members don't sit in the middle to get the stereo image effect so that's wasted. Most run mono for that reason. Live sound and recording are totally different.

As I said before - L1 Compact. No different than 2 S1's and a sub
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  #55  
Old 08-30-2018, 04:24 AM
Peter Z Peter Z is offline
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It is a matter of what you need. I agree that with just acoustic guitars and voices you will not need a sub. It would stay unemployed or send useless infomation (noise).
Also canned background music works fine with a S1. Of course a DJ will not be happy.
If you need to amplify a kickdrum the S1 failes completely. And also the L1 compacts fail completely - I had 3 of them. An upright bass can be taken very very softly with a compact, not with the S1.
The compact goes a little deeper and is a little bit more powerful but not very much.

The S1 is a very nice product if you use it in the correct way. Busking, background music, a little fun speaker for whatever - without a power cable.
Using it for kickdrums, bass, dance music etc. is not the right application - with or wothout a sub. There are cheaper and much more powerful speakers. Think Yamaha DBR10 with subs, just to mention one of them. Of course that would mean investing in another sound system.

If you really want a sub to widen the possibility of usage of the S1, I cannot recommend the Bose B1/B2. Those are subs taylored to the L1 system with special processing. The S1 is a complete different speaker. Take a small powered 12" sub with an internal crossover (like the little Behringer mentioned above or something similar) and free the S1 from 100Hz and below. Try that and you will see you will get what you want - within reasonable limits. Not a real powerful PA but much closer.

Grooveking, stereo is more common that you might think, and very useful. Art music orchestras, that normally play without amplification have to move out sometimes of their concert houses to open air festvals. They are mixed stereo. There are also operas doing the same. All in stereo. Musicals. And a lot of acoustic music.
Also the Bose idea with one speaker close to one musician is stereo or more than that. It creates a very organic seperation of the sounds. It works.
Of course you have to take care that everything is audible everywhere in the event. But that can be done.
Then there are other events where mono or dual mono is perfect - as you say. It just depends ....
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  #56  
Old 08-30-2018, 04:30 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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I guess I was considering that Bose could modify the B1 to make it active or design something specifically for the S1 system for those wanting a fuller frequency response.

When I had my Bose L1 Model II with ToneMatch and two B1 woofers, it handled the bass frequencies easily with a clarity and fullness of tone for both live music or canned music.
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 09-01-2018 at 07:46 AM.
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  #57  
Old 08-31-2018, 04:53 AM
Murphy Slaw Murphy Slaw is online now
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I've been thinking about 2; S-1's for an acoustic duet, one for each of us.

We both sing and play guitar, and swap mandolin duty, then I also play resonator and banjo. I would use 2 mics probably.

Then a pair of (high) powered (quality) speakers on a pole for larger gigs and the S-1's would serve as monitors and would simply line out to the larger more powerful "mains" and the S-1's would still be spreading around if they were set up behind us.

And, it would (sorta) be in stereo.
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  #58  
Old 08-31-2018, 06:46 AM
Peter Z Peter Z is offline
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Murphy,
while I often love stereo in a live event, I'm afraid your solution will be too much stereo.
With "high-power" speakers in a typical arrangement (left and right infront of you) there is the danger that one half of the audience will hear very different things than the other half.
I think you should add a little mixer with 2 pre fader aux sends. They are cheap.
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  #59  
Old 08-31-2018, 07:27 AM
MikeBmusic MikeBmusic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Z View Post
Murphy,
while I often love stereo in a live event, I'm afraid your solution will be too much stereo.
With "high-power" speakers in a typical arrangement (left and right infront of you) there is the danger that one half of the audience will hear very different things than the other half.
I think you should add a little mixer with 2 pre fader aux sends. They are cheap.
A small mixer is the easiest solution for using any combination of S1s and other speakers - stereo or mono.
As I said before, and Peter says again - a stereo set up with spread-apart speakers may not work well. IF the speakers are close by (like two S1s or L1 sticks within a few feet of each other behind the players), the 'stereo' is not a problem, in essence you've got a mono sound happening that way, just using two speakers.
If you're unclear about the whole stereo effect, go home and play a song from a CD or album with high stereo separation and sit in front of one speaker on your home system and hear what it sounds like. I suggest the drum solo from 'In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida'! That's what the audience may hear in a room where the 'stereo' system doesn't get the sound from both speakers to the audience evenly.
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  #60  
Old 08-31-2018, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBmusic View Post
If you're unclear about the whole stereo effect, go home and play a song from a CD or album with high stereo separation and sit in front of one speaker on your home system and hear what it sounds like.
When I used to mix a live stereo image, I'd place the knobs at 10 and 2 rather than maxing them. Having some of the sound present on both speakers is absolutely necessary to avoid what you're talking about.

I still have a very clear recollection of seeing a national act who had chosen to use the house sound man, to very bad effect. One guitar player on the left speaker stacks, the other on the right. Being on the left side of the stage, I never heard one note from the far guitar player except for when he started a song without the rest of the band. Once the band kicked in, he was gone.
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