The Acoustic Guitar Forum

Go Back   The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Build and Repair

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 02-04-2022, 10:18 AM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default Truss rod issue on brand new Guild

I bought a Guild D-120 online and it arrived the other day. It was all good.
Then I checked the saddle and it was pretty high (6 mm) while the action was just right, so I used some sandpaper on the saddle and lowered it to about 4.7 mm. I tuned it all up and there was some minor buzzing. I therefore checked the neck relief and it was basically straight, so I turned the truss rod (it's a double action) by about 1/4 of a turn: no difference. I added another 1/4 of a turn: still no difference. This was a about 5 hours ago and I just checked it again: still no relief.

What does this mean? I didn't feel anything weird while turning the truss rod, it just felt like any other truss rod I ever turned. The humidity where I live stays at 50-60% all year long.

Thanks

Last edited by angelo_; 02-04-2022 at 02:51 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-04-2022, 10:28 AM
Tony Burns Tony Burns is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: middle of no where
Posts: 8,030
Default

Have you taken off the tension , by loosening the strings ?
__________________
---------------------------------
Wood things with Strings !
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-04-2022, 10:30 AM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Burns View Post
Have you taken off the tension , by loosening the strings ?
When sanding the saddle, yes. When turning the truss rod, no.
When I measured the relief of the neck, the guitar was tuned up.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-04-2022, 12:17 PM
L20A L20A is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Roy Utah
Posts: 7,514
Default

Are you turning the truss rod the correct direction?
__________________
Happiness Is A New Set Of Strings
L-20A
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-04-2022, 01:07 PM
KevinH's Avatar
KevinH KevinH is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Tacoma, WA
Posts: 3,344
Default

Yes, check to be sure you're turning the truss rod in the correct direction. Clockwise, looking down the length of the truss rod to lessen relief, counterclockwise to add relief.

Quote:
Originally Posted by angelo_ View Post
..Then I checked the saddle and it was pretty high (0.6 mm) while the action was just right, so I used some sandpaper on the saddle and lowered it to about 4.7 mm. I tuned it all up and there was some minor buzzing....
I'm curious - if the action was just right, why sand the saddle? The normal procedure is to check/adjust the relief first, then nut slot height if needed. Then if the action is high, sand the saddle.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-04-2022, 01:07 PM
Robin, Wales Robin, Wales is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Eryri, Wales
Posts: 4,571
Default

When adding relief, even with a double action truss rod, you are possibly going to be relying on string tension and the plasticity of the neck wood for certain adjustments. . Particularly if you are somewhere near the zero point of the rod.

You may find that you have to go slightly beyond where you would like to set the relief and then put the rod under tension again to bring the neck back to your desired point.

I doubt if there is anything actually wrong with the truss rod.
__________________
I'm learning to flatpick and fingerpick guitar to accompany songs.

I've played and studied traditional noter/drone mountain dulcimer for many years. And I used to play dobro in a bluegrass band.



Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-04-2022, 01:17 PM
DCCougar DCCougar is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: North Idaho
Posts: 2,941
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by angelo_ View Post
I bought a Guild D-120 online and it arrived the other day. It was all good.
Congrats! Those are Asian-made Guilds, of course.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinH View Post
I'm curious - if the action was just right, why sand the saddle?
Exactly my thought! Like, if it ain't broke.....
__________________

2018 Guild F-512 Sunburst -- 2007 Guild F412 Ice Tea burst
2002 Guild JF30-12 Whiskeyburst -- 2011 Guild F-50R Sunburst
2011 Guild GAD D125-12 NT -- 
1972 Epiphone FT-160 12-string
2012 Epiphone Dot CH
 -- 2010 Epiphone Les Paul Standard trans amber 

2013 Yamaha Motif XS7

Cougar's Soundcloud page
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-04-2022, 01:34 PM
dnf777's Avatar
dnf777 dnf777 is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: NW Pennsylvania
Posts: 3,655
Default

“It was all good”
“..the action was just right”

Why touch the saddle or truss rod in that situation?
__________________
Dave F
*************
Martins
Guilds
Gibsons
A few others
2020 macbook pro i5 8GB
Scarlett 18i20
Reaper 7
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02-04-2022, 01:54 PM
rmp rmp is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 6,897
Default

you actually want the neck as straight as possible.

that you lowered the action and now get buzzing, is not surprising.

there's no going back but there are shims,... you can lift the saddle a bit with one of them..
__________________
Ray

Gibson SJ200
Taylor Grand Symphony
Taylor 514CE-NY
Taylor 814CE Deluxe V-Class
Guild F1512
Alvarez DY74 Snowflake ('78)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 02-04-2022, 02:16 PM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by L20A View Post
Are you turning the truss rod the correct direction?
I'm pretty sure I did. The truss rod can only be accessed from the soundhole with a pretty long Allen wrench. I put the guitar on a table and sat behind the body with the headstock away from me. I inserted the key in the hole and turned it counter-clockwise (from the high E to the low E).
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 02-04-2022, 02:41 PM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinH View Post
Yes, check to be sure you're turning the truss rod in the correct direction. Clockwise, looking down the length of the truss rod to lessen relief, counterclockwise to add relief.
Yeah that's what I did.

I'm curious - if the action was just right, why sand the saddle? The normal procedure is to check/adjust the relief first, then nut slot height if needed. Then if the action is high, sand the saddle.
Because the saddle was too high (6 mm) and the string height from the top of the soundboard was also too high (1.4 cm).

Last edited by angelo_; 02-04-2022 at 02:51 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 02-04-2022, 02:44 PM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin, Wales View Post
When adding relief, even with a double action truss rod, you are possibly going to be relying on string tension and the plasticity of the neck wood for certain adjustments. . Particularly if you are somewhere near the zero point of the rod.

You may find that you have to go slightly beyond where you would like to set the relief and then put the rod under tension again to bring the neck back to your desired point.

I doubt if there is anything actually wrong with the truss rod.
I was mainly surprised by the fact that the turns I made on the truss rod had no effect on the relief of the neck. Since it's a double-action rod, there should be even more effects with less turns.

Anyway, I've contacted a very good local luthier. I'll ask him. If I have to, I'll send it back and get another.

It's a shame becasue I really liked it.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02-04-2022, 02:49 PM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DCCougar View Post
Congrats! Those are Asian-made Guilds, of course.
So? I don't care where it's made as long as it's well done, and many Asian products are ahead of their western counterparts.

Exactly my thought! Like, if it ain't broke.....
The saddle was too high (6 mm) and the height of the strings from the top of the soundboard was also too high (1.4 cm).
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02-04-2022, 02:51 PM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnf777 View Post
“It was all good”
“..the action was just right”

Why touch the saddle or truss rod in that situation?
Guys, it's the fourth time I have to repeat myself...
The saddle was too high (6 mm) and the height of the strings from the top of the soundboard was also too high (1.4 cm).
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02-04-2022, 02:55 PM
angelo_ angelo_ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmp View Post
you actually want the neck as straight as possible.

that you lowered the action and now get buzzing, is not surprising.

there's no going back but there are shims,... you can lift the saddle a bit with one of them..
Of course, I knew that the strings might start buzzing, and they did. That's why I worked on the truss rod, but to my surprise it had no effect on the relief of the neck. That's what surprised me and that's the reason I opened this thread.

I know that if I lower something, I'll have to raise something else, but the fact that a truss rod can't change the relief of a neck after over 1/2 of a turn, is pretty concerning to me. The rod might be broken, and I don't want it to be broken.
Reply With Quote
Reply

  The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Build and Repair

Tags
guild, problem, truss rod

Thread Tools





All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:56 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, The Acoustic Guitar Forum
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=