NGD 000-28 2018 Hurrah. Buzzing. Boo! Resolved. Hurrah!

[Coler]

Originally Posted by canyongargon

I suspect if you ask nicely, Martin would be willing to mail you a new tuner given the circumstances. At very least they’d send a new one out to an authorized repair center. If you like the guitar there’s absolutely no reason to return over a faulty tuner. Easy fix.

There shouldn't be I agree. But that's what I'm being offered by the vendor (it's a new guitar)

I would need 6 tuners. All mine are lose. I'll update when I hear back from Martin.

[JayBee1404]

Originally Posted by Coler

Oh sorry, I'm in Ireland. I ordered this in online. It sounds so good and plays so nicely otherwise I'm reluctant to send it back. I havnt seen the 2018 000 28 in a shop here.

Aaaahh! No Authorised Service Centre in Ireland of course!

Are you the original owner of the guitar? If so, and if you’ve registered your ownership with CFM, I’d hope that, given your location, they would send a set of replacement tuners direct to you.

If the instrument is S/H, you might be on your own. There are a number of luthier/techs in Ireland who might be able to help you - I just Googled ‘luthiers and guitar techs in Ireland’ and got half a dozen possibilities.

I really hope this works out for you, it’s a frustrating situation to find yourself in. Keep us informed how it goes?

EDIT: Looks as though we cross-posted! Have you registered yourself with CFM as the guitar’s original owner? I’d hope they will see you OK on this.

[Coler]

^ Yes I'm the first owner from new. I can't register for warranty with CFM however, as it was bought outside US/Canada. I get this when I input my serial number:

"Model is not eligible for warranty

Martin Guitar limited lifetime warranty is not available for instruments purchased outside the US or Canada. Please contact your Martin dealer for details of international warranties."

I'm awaiting a response from an email I sent yesterday and will be interested to see what they say about it. The Company has a strong reputation for customer service so I'd be hopeful that they would be willing to send me a new set of tuners.

There are indeed a number of good techs/luthiers near me and I have one lined up to do a set-up on it and address the issue by installing a replacement set of tuners which I will source myself if I have to. I'm going to go for the same Glovers as are on my D17M if it's left to me. They're not exactly expensive.

I've become somewhat more sanguine about this. Yes it is irritating but in context, I'm incredible fortunate to be able to indulge myself by buying this amazing musical instrument to enjoy what is a hobby for me. This doesn't spoil anything for me and there's no way I'm sending the guitar back to the dealer just because of this!

Thanks for all your interest and responses folks - much appreciated - I took out charter membership solely to recognise the assistance I'm getting in this thread.

[JayBee1404]

Aaaahh, I bought my current Martins, plus one that I’ve recently moved along, from MFG in the States, so I had no problem with warranty registration. And yes, you’re restricted to the dealer’s warranty if you purchased outside the US (that’s one year, replace or repair in the UK - USers please note!).

I have Waverly Vintage Ovals on my Martins - very good, but very expensive. My recently-purchased British-built Brook OM has Grover Sta-Tite 18:1s on it - perhaps not quite as good as the Waves, but perfectly functional nonetheless, and they look fine.

Good luck with getting this one sorted, I hope you’ll come back and tell us everything worked out. And pics - don’t forget The Golden Rule, without pics it never happened!

[Coler]

Originally Posted by JayBee1404

Aaaahh, I bought my current Martins, plus one that I’ve recently moved along, from MFG in the States, so I had no problem with warranty registration. And yes, you’re restricted to the dealer’s warranty if you purchased outside the US (that’s one year, replace or repair in the UK - USers please note!).

I have Waverly Vintage Ovals on my Martins - very good, but very expensive. My recently-purchased British-built Brook OM has Grover Sta-Tite 18:1s on it - perhaps not quite as good as the Waves, but perfectly functional nonetheless, and they look fine.

Good luck with getting this one sorted, I hope you’ll come back and tell us everything worked out. And pics - don’t forget The Golden Rule, without pics it never happened!

Vey nice (the Waverleys). I think if I have to replace mine I'll just go for what I have on the D17M (Grovers). They look fine and I've never had an issue with them on that guitar.

I will do a happy NGD thread with some pictures and update this thread in due course with the response from Martin. My dealer is saying they will take the guitar back and address any manufacturing issue. I'm saying to them that I don't want it to be shipped over and back for something like this which is such an easy fix locally.

I asked whether they would throw me a set of Grover tuners for free. I'm not optimistic but it's not going to break my heart to buy them myself if I have to. I did tell them I'd be reluctant to buy anything close to this value from them again if this is the way it has to be.

[JayBee1404]

Originally Posted by Coler

I asked whether they would throw me a set of Grover tuners for free. I'm not optimistic but it's not going to break my heart to buy them myself if I have to. I did tell them I'd be reluctant to buy anything close to this value from them again if this is the way it has to be.

That seems a very reasonable POV to my way of thinking. Let’s hope the dealer steps up to the plate.

I do find it really annoying that CFM are happy to take money from us ‘aliens’ who buy their guitars, but they refuse to grant us the same warranty that they give to their North American buyers - effectively treating us as ‘second-class customers’. Seems very unfair.

Anyway, rant over!

Good luck with the tuners, looking forward to hearing you’re fixed up.

[Coler]

So I am working with the dealer - they asked to be sent a video and this is with a view to doing something about replacement tuners, which I appreciate. I've just been too busy in work to actually do what they asked for.

Martin have failed to respond to two emails I sent through their website, over the last 8 or 9 days. I'm disappointed with that as my impression was that they are decent people with a good attitude to customer service. Unfortunately my experience currently is that I'm being ignored.

As a kicker - I'm trying very hard not to let this get to me - my friendly local guitar shop got a 000 28 in and is selling it for 200 euro less than what I paid. I am avoiding the shop as if I play that one and it's nicer than mine and/or doesn't have the problem I have I'll be properly irritated.

That said, I ran mine past my guitar teacher and he felt, as did I, that it was an outstanding instrument with just this apparently easily resolved buzzing to resolve.

[Coler]

Well, the position is the dealer says they don't accept it's a defect and should be addressed with a set-up and Martin have not replied to my two emails sent over the last couple of weeks.

I'm not sending it back to the dealer. I do love the guitar and they are clearly not going to work with me on this so what's the point.

I could still return it but I'll shoulder some charges there and I'd prefer to spend the money on the (very simple) fix that's needed to get this beautiful instrument playing perfectly.

Happy Christmas all and see you in 2020, when I will post a happy NGD, once this is sorted. The plan is to splurge on a set of Waverleys and have my tech install them.

[Jobe]

Hello Coler. All will work out. You said, "properly irritated". I find that endearing. Here in the States we use harsher language that is not allowed on this forum but it can get results. I like your way better. I will remember that. I trust this will have a good outcome. The next time I speak with my car mechanic I will tell him I am properly irritated. He will give me a funny look. That is fine.

[scoden]

Just to be certain are you sure the neck isn’t back bowed.
Open strings up to fret 5 tend to buzz if the rod needs a little loosening.

[Jaden]

I’m very surprised your new (2018 model?) 000-28 did not come with open gear Grover tuners - I hope Martin doesn’t switch away from those on the Standard Series in the near future. The exception has been the new D-35, but I’m not thrilled with the absence of the open gear Grovers on that guitar either.

[Coler]

Well, an encouraging update.

I contacted Martin in December gone and explained the position. They were a little slow getting back to me, but Christmas and all that so no big deal. They sent me a nice email asking for some more information and directing me to Westside Distribution as the UK distributor.

That was on 2 January, and I myself was remiss in not being more active on the issue. Today I got an unprompted email from Westside, who had been contacted proactively by Martin and requested to engage with me, which is great customer service by both Westside and Martin. So I've obviously put Westside in the picture now and am waiting to hear back.

Meanwhile the guitar continues to play beautifully, aside from the issue of the buzzing. I'm fairly confident that there'll be a good resolution on that now. My intention is to ask for a set of Grover open-tuners as a replacement, assuming we get that far. I have those on my other guitar and they're great. The troublesome tuners on the 000-28 are Schallers and I really don't like the feel of them, although that's just me and perhaps others enjoy them, aside from the buzz.

I'll then have the replacements fitted by my tech when I bring the guitar in for a set-up, which I'm just about ready to do now that it has settled in at home and I have played it pretty extensively.

Thanks for all comments and advice.

Originally Posted by scoden

Just to be certain are you sure the neck isn’t back bowed.
Open strings up to fret 5 tend to buzz if the rod needs a little loosening.

Thanks for this input. I don't believe so but that's based on eyeballing it, no intonation issues and the buzzing is limited to three strings across the range. I'll look into it further though and thanks again.

[SlopeD]

Originally Posted by Coler

I took delivery of a really good 000-28 last week. In short I love it. However it suffers from buzz at the headstock on open E, A and G. I am sure this is from the seemingly notorious loose washer problem that seems to regularly come up. I can actually hear the rattling when I gently shake the guitar (in a quiet room with my ear to the headstock) and I can feel it by tapping the tuners.

So otherwise it's great. I don't want to send it back not least because it seems any replacement might have the issue too, and as I say this is a great guitar in every other way.

I'm thinking of just getting replacement tuners and installing them myself at the next string change. Waverleys seem to be a good option for this.

I don't consider myself particularly handy but if the washer removal option is very easy I would probably give that a go first. Can anyone comment?

I'll also be taking it for a set-up in the new year - maybe I should just ask my tech to remove the washers?

Just a small vent - my amazing D17m (2012 from memory and that guitar is sweet as a nut) came with lovely Grover open back tuners. Seems pretty weird that the more expensive 28 comes with these bloody things.

have a tech/luthier look at it, probably a 5 minute fix or just do it yourself. Those tuners are just fine and decent quality

[Coler]

Originally Posted by SlopeD

have a tech/luthier look at it, probably a 5 minute fix or just do it yourself. Those tuners are just fine and decent quality

The one's that are on it are fine?

[Coler]

Further update, more good news.

Martin's UK distributor (shout out to Westside Guitars/Distribution here) have offered to send me some replacement tuners free of charge.

They explained that this problem, exactly as described by UncleJesse, has come up from time to time with the Schaller tuners:

Originally Posted by UncleJesse

If they're the schallers take your finger and tap the S on the back of the open gear tuners. If you hear it click when you tap it you have the same problem I've had with two sets now.

No amount of tightening will fix this. It will require replacement.

They also said that they have had success fixing the issue by placing a bead of superglue in under the S backplate using a pin, which I though might be useful information for anyone else who encounters the problem.

For myself, I asked for Grovers, which I prefer the feel of in general anyway.

I contacted the vendor to me to update them, mainly for the benefit of any other customer of theirs who is affected by the issue.

I also wanted to let them know that I would not be happy to make this kind of purchase with them again, given they rejected out of hand that this was a defect in the tuners, despite my sending a detailed description and video.

All I was asking for from them was a set of replacement tuners. They did offer to take the guitar back (it was within the 30 day return period) but that was not a good solution for me as I wanted to keep the guitar - it is absolutely lovely.

NGD with pictures coming once I get Buzz (I've never named a guitar before but...) set up with the new tuners.