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  #16  
Old 11-10-2019, 05:58 AM
Ncbandit Ncbandit is offline
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Originally Posted by BoneDigger View Post
I know I have been asking a lot of questions lately and I appreciate the replies!

My reference tracks (professional recordings) tend to have an airiness to them that my recordings do not. I think this has a lot to do with stereo width, recording quality, and EQ, but I just can't seem to get that airy feeling to them. I have been working with some compression, plus using some good VST plugins for EQ and panning, but still just can't get there.

Ideas?
I know I'm late to the party but thought I could share my experience. If I understand you correctly your talking about the overall depth, clarity, and roomy sound. I found for vocals, guitar, and bass it helps to duplicate every track then offset the 2 tracks ever so slightly, then experiment with different panning.

If you offset them too much it sounds like 2 different instruments, but when done the correct amount it creates a natural reverb effect which gives it that airy feel. Panning is critical to achieve this. Pan 1 track left and the other right the same amount. I find the % you pan sometimes is best at 30 something and sometimes up to 70 something.

For vocal chorus parts I found it better to actually double track (singing twice instead of just copying the track). I will then sometimes copy 1 of the 2 tracks and follow the above and leave the other track single. This also creates a nice airy sound with the 3 tracks.

Last edited by Ncbandit; 11-10-2019 at 06:07 AM.
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  #17  
Old 11-10-2019, 09:40 AM
Brent Hahn Brent Hahn is offline
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Originally Posted by Ncbandit View Post
... for vocals, guitar, and bass it helps to duplicate every track then offset the 2 tracks ever so slightly, then experiment with different panning.
What happens when you listen in mono? Which is more or less what happens when you hear it from the next room, or even a ways back in the same room.
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  #18  
Old 11-10-2019, 06:07 PM
Ncbandit Ncbandit is offline
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Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
What happens when you listen in mono? Which is more or less what happens when you hear it from the next room, or even a ways back in the same room.
Great question. I just listened to the guitar on one of my songs with headphones. Track 1 is panned 71 left and obviously when listening solo stereo it is left ear dominant. When clicking on mono it went directly to center. Same with the right track and with both together. When switching to mono all 3 scenarios sounded identical.
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  #19  
Old 11-11-2019, 07:49 AM
MikeBmusic MikeBmusic is online now
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Originally Posted by Ncbandit View Post
Great question. I just listened to the guitar on one of my songs with headphones. Track 1 is panned 71 left and obviously when listening solo stereo it is left ear dominant. When clicking on mono it went directly to center. Same with the right track and with both together. When switching to mono all 3 scenarios sounded identical.
What you need to watch for when doing this is phase problems. In mono, this will become apparent - the duplicated track may be lower in volume, or may fluctuate as the 2 tracks combine.
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  #20  
Old 11-11-2019, 08:11 AM
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For a number of years when I had only one SD condenser I would use the slip technique on a duped guitar track.

BUT it was only to simulate having a stereo recording so as to be able to spread the guitar out as noted 50 to 70 % R and L and have the vocal up the middle for more separation. And while this does increase the Left to Right spread of the the soundfield and can make the recording sound bigger or perhaps "wider", I personally do not think it really helps with the airyness, clarity, or 3 D' ness found in pro recording .
To my mind that is much more a function of good mic, pre, converters, good rooms and monitoring gear, and knowledgeable use in mixing of EQ and Compression to eliminated mud , frequency buildup, and bring presence, just IMO however.
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  #21  
Old 11-11-2019, 10:27 AM
Ncbandit Ncbandit is offline
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Originally Posted by MikeBmusic View Post
What you need to watch for when doing this is phase problems. In mono, this will become apparent - the duplicated track may be lower in volume, or may fluctuate as the 2 tracks combine.
I appreciate the advice.

I just listened to a couple of my songs in their entirety in mono and didn't notice any phase problems. It maybe since the duplicated tracks are always at an identical volume and I am offsetting them such a tiny amount. On grid line spacing of 1/128 and when zooming way in I may move 1 track only 1.5 grid lines. Even this tiny amount makes a big difference in stereo but appears to have no negative affect in mono.
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  #22  
Old 11-11-2019, 12:15 PM
Brent Hahn Brent Hahn is offline
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Originally Posted by Ncbandit View Post
I appreciate the advice.

I just listened to a couple of my songs in their entirety in mono and didn't notice any phase problems. It maybe since the duplicated tracks are always at an identical volume and I am offsetting them such a tiny amount. On grid line spacing of 1/128 and when zooming way in I may move 1 track only 1.5 grid lines. Even this tiny amount makes a big difference in stereo but appears to have no negative affect in mono.
When you do a mix with all these micro-delayed elements, does the balance change much when you switch between stereo and mono?
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  #23  
Old 11-11-2019, 01:48 PM
Ncbandit Ncbandit is offline
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Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
When you do a mix with all these micro-delayed elements, does the balance change much when you switch between stereo and mono?
I'm not sure if this answers your question but in stereo the song is full,rich and airy and in mono everything goes to the center.This is probably the case with any song when going from stereo to mono.

I would recommend trying this technique on a track since it only takes a few minutes to duplicate a track, nudge it, and experiment with the panning. I always start at 36 range and go from there.

I discovered this technique through research when I was learning my DAW. I definitely didn't invent the idea.

For my songs it works so well I hardly ever add reverb to a track.
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  #24  
Old 11-11-2019, 01:59 PM
Brent Hahn Brent Hahn is offline
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Originally Posted by Ncbandit View Post
I'm not sure if this answers your question but in stereo the song is full,rich and airy and in mono everything goes to the center.This is probably the case with any song when going from stereo to mono.
I get that, but my question is about balance. Proportions. How much guitar versus bass versus vocal versus whatever. To me, making that consistent matters a lot more than stereo or "space" or any of that. Just speaking for myself.
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  #25  
Old 11-11-2019, 02:05 PM
Ncbandit Ncbandit is offline
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Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
I get that, but my question is about balance. Proportions. How much guitar versus bass versus vocal versus whatever. To me, making that consistent matters a lot more than stereo or "space" or any of that. Just speaking for myself.
LOL!! Ok, I'm with you now. I just carefully listened again and the balance stays consistent when switching to mono.
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