#16
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With that kind of thinking we will only be listening music from 1920 till now
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#17
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...and all the orchestras in the world would be out of business.
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#18
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Really??? |
#19
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Find me one example and I'll send you one of my guitars. |
#20
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Some of this seems to be arguing about nothing. If I learn music from the dots the first thing I have to do is memorise it. The way I memorise it is to learn it by ear, from my own playing when reading it from notation. I have no intention of performing anything whilst reading dots. You have to be looking up to dodge the bottles.
Orchestral players cover a wide repertoire and aren't expected to play everything from memory but often soloists dont read from the dots. They memorise the stuff and I bet what they memorise is the sound. Not what they do with their hands but the sound the music makes. |
#21
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we have recordings of music from 1920s ...probably a little earlier
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#22
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Agreed.
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Of course listening to good recordings first enhances this process tenfold (roughly). |
#23
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And.......???
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#24
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Since we dont know what was music sounding like before early 20th century ,when we invented recording, we shouldnt play it :P. |
#25
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And that is the point of this thread. If some want to continue on without taking advantage of using their ear (by listening to recordings) to learn then that's up to them. I wonder if infant Mozart's teachers wouldn't have encouraged him to listen to recordings (had the tech been available) (whilst they weren't playing to him)? |
#26
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"Do you think modern orchestral players (that can hear) don't listen to recordings of the music they are learning?"
do they ? why? dont they have a conductor to lead them? |
#27
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It seems that a number of people in the general population (players and non-players alike), have the idea that being able to play by ear is a talent (i.e. "some gots it, some don't" as the myth goes) that only the lucky few can experience. It does seem there is enough evidence to the contrary (i.e. it is a learned skill that might initially come easier to some than others, but anyone who wants to, can learn it). Even Tomi admits it was a real struggle for him in the beginning. When you hear him now or watch one of his videos, it seems that he is a natural, so knowing how hard he worked certainly puts the skill within reach of the rest of us too. I have always been sort of midway between reading and hearing in my approach to music - I can read standard notation but not sight read (i.e. not in real time as I play, as a highly skilled reader can). I can read charts easily. I can figure out music off of recordings, lead guitar parts, some chords if not too difficult and such. Years ago, I did figure out some Leo Kottke tunes by slowing my turntable way down since there were no TABS or notation available. Currently, I play in a semi-formal jazz group (not my day job) and some solo fingerstyle acoustic stuff as the occasion arises. In the jazz group we play from lead sheet charts (Real Book, etc). I learned the skills to hold my own in that setting from Robert Conti's books and DVDs. My acoustic playing consists of either me arranging a tune on paper or getting the gist of a tune off a recording and playing that. Now, over the past several weeks, I have been working to adapt Tomi's approach into my daily activities, and can readily see how that skill will ultimately free up my playing from struggling to memorize the music to literally being it (sounds new-agey, but as I begin to experience it for myself, I can't explain it any other way). I have a long way to go in developing the skill, but I am seeing early results enough to know I am finally on the right track. Tomi's course points us in the right direction, but it is up to us to develop it into a working skill set. I know of only one other resource that teaches a true "by ear" approach, and that one is largely for teaching blind people (http://musicfortheblind.com/). I wonder why this isn't the normal way to learn music, since ultimately it is a hearing art form. Tony
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“The guitar is a wonderful thing which is understood by few.” — Franz Schubert "Alexa, where's my stuff?" - Anxiously waiting... |
#28
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Sorry for your early experiences. It really does not sound like that was a very good music school. Most classical musicians have a very good ear.
I don't see the need for doing a 180 and throwing out useful skills. Learning classical guitar music while deliberately avoiding reference to the written scores is a rather pointless way to go about it, almost futile for some of it. A lot depends on the situation you are in and the type of music you are trying to play. Without the ability to read music, some music is for all practical purposes inaccessible to you. With other music and playing situations you are better off going by ear. Don't throw things out, rather accumulate different approaches to learning and playing music.
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Derek Coombs Youtube -> Website -> Music -> Tabs Guitars by Mark Blanchard, Albert&Mueller, Paul Woolson, Collings, Composite Acoustics, and Derek Coombs "Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." Woods hands pick by eye and ear
Made to one with pride and love To be that we hold so dear A voice from heavens above Last edited by rick-slo; 08-10-2013 at 05:32 PM. |
#29
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My violin/ piano teacher could sight read, identify every note in real time and write them down and she had a classical training .
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#30
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I think you're completely missing my point, and I'm missing yours.
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