Do woods matter as much with electric guitars?

[terrapin]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

But I thought it was all in the pickups?

I think you've helped me make my point

And that point was??? I never said it was all pickups.

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by terrapin

And that point was??? I never said it was all pickups.

Oops - sorry that I wasn't more clear. What I meant was, that you picked up immediately that there are significant construction differences between these two guitars. The fact that they have the same neck pickup is far from the only distinguishing feature. There are certainly different woods in the fretboards, possibly in the body, and there are certainly other mechanical differences which affect how the strings vibrate, and thus affect the signal presented to the pickup.

Yet, there are those (unlike you and I) who still believe that it's all in the pickups.

[mischultz]

Taking an end around:

Playing unplugged, there is as much variety among electric guitars as acoustic. Scale length, neck joint, construction type and wood selection all play a role.

*All* those factors can be diminished in impact by a wide variety of influences. Pickup gain (even more than type) is probably the single most dominant variable because of its impact on the electrical relationship between the guitar and amplifier downstream.

But to say that any of them (including materials/wood questions) are non-existent, hype or snake oil is, I think, failing to appreciate the construction of the instrument as something other than a note conveyance.

Michael

[terrapin]

My bottom line theory is that we are talking about an ELECTRIC guitar! The electrical signal path is strings-pickups-pedal effects-amp. A lot of little factors add their own small contribution along the way, but the core is the electric signal path.
David, your point is well taken.

[myersbw]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

Now, notice that most of the sounds I was searching for in these examples were low-gain sounds. Yes, you can gain up to the point where there is less difference between the guitars. But that isn't the range of sounds I'm going for.

Bob

I think that's the reason for the majority of differences here. Go for metal and the amp/pickup combo has the greatest effect. but, clean it up for jazz and even two identical guitars will sound different.

Even a vast difference on a chambered vs. traditional weighted Les Paul...you'll hear & feel it.

BradM

[Davis Webb]

Originally Posted by myersbw

I think that's the reason for the majority of differences here. Go for metal and the amp/pickup combo has the greatest effect. but, clean it up for jazz and even two identical guitars will sound different.

Even a vast difference on a chambered vs. traditional weighted Les Paul...you'll hear & feel it.

BradM

This. Agreed. Its once you are running a clean boutique sound that it starts to come out.

[terrapin]

Originally Posted by ewh2

Woods don't matter as much for electric guitars as they do for acoustic guitars.

For electric guitars, the body/neck materials are important but not as important as they are for acoustic guitars.

Ampeg made a amazing acrylic/clear plastic body guitar, Travis Bean's steel body guitar. Electric Guitar Company make amazing guitars pretty much without a sight of any wood.

For electric tone, pickups are very important, then as obvious as it might sound, the amp is very important. The material used to construct the electric guitar will have impact on tone but not as much impact as amp/pickups.

The size/shape of the body of a electric is very important eg if it's semi hollow/hollow/solid for tone. But a solid body guitar be it a Telecaster whether the body is made from maple/mahogany/alder/ash won't make as impact on tone as a P90/Single Coil/Humbucker or whether it goes through a High Gain distortion Mesa Boogie or a clean Jazz Chorus amp.

What he said....

[LouieAtienza]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

Actually, aluminum-necked...

The body, too? Thought it was just the neck, just like SD Curlee and Kramer....

[LouieAtienza]

Having played and made electrics with different woods, I say yes it DOES matter, to a point.

One can make a body out of basswood and it could be a bit dark sounding, and the same body out of maple can be very bright and punchy. Or basswood can be capped with maple. On electrics I prefer maple necks and fretboards because I feel it has a quicker attack, whereas a rosewood board would make the note swell.

There are players who prefer basswood since it interacts well with bridge pickups which on harder woods can tend to be too bright. Steve Vai and Allan Holdsworth are two that play very fast and played basswood bodies early on (Charvel.) Van Halen's signature guitars from the 90's to today are prediminantly basswood with maple cap. Guys like George Lynch preferred solid maple bodies, they really do cut through and sustain. The Les Paul sound is very identifiable through the likes of Page, Slash, and others. After Van Halen popularized Strat-shaped guitars with bridge humbuckers, companies like Charvel, PRS, Hamer, Anderson, Schecter, Boogie Bodies, made Strat-shaped guitars using maple/mahogany construction to give the "sound" of a Les Paul in a smaller, more "comfortable" package.

The easiest test would be to go to the local music store and try a PRS Custom 22 with a solid mahogany body, and one with a mape cap. The all mahogany is very noticeably darker than the maple capped guitar. There are some Teles with mahogany bodies; I have one such bidy and it's definitely warmer sounding in all pickup configurations compared to my ash Tele. Sure it's more subtle than an acoustic guitar, but it's there.

[Rodger Knox]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

I have two inexpensive electric guitars. One is a Squier '51, the other an OLP MM4.

Both are 25" scale. Both have maple, bolt-on necks. The Squier has a maple fretboard, the OLP, rosewood. Both have bodies made from some mystery wood, as is typically used in lower-end guitars. I have no idea how many pieces of wood in each - the paint on the OLP suggests that it might be 3. I can't tell with the Squier.

The Squier has a hard tail bridge, not string-thru. The OLP has a standard Strat-style term, locked down to the body with 5 springs at maximum tension.

Both have Fender Noiseless pickups in the neck position. The Squier's is screwed to the body, with just a piece of foam underneath it. The OLP's is suspended from the pick guard in the usual Strat fashion. Both have single volume and tone controls. I'm not anal enough to pull the panels to check capacitor values - for my listening purposes, both volume and tone controls were wide open, neck pickup only.

They sound quite, quite different. The Squier is bold and fat. The OLP is round and sweet. One's a brat, the other one is honey. This is at low volume, no effects - just trying to get an honest eval of the sound of the guitar.

They also feel and respond quite differently. The Squier doesn't give me a lot of physical feedback - it's solid. The OLP is significantly more resonant and acoustically responsive.

So, the question is - if it's all in the pickups, what accounts for the difference?

One pickup is screwed to the body, the other is just hanging around. That makes them sound different, at least according to EVH. With the tone all the way treblle, the cap values don't matter.

[j3ffr0]

Originally Posted by myersbw

I think that's the reason for the majority of differences here. Go for metal and the amp/pickup combo has the greatest effect. but, clean it up for jazz and even two identical guitars will sound different.

Even a vast difference on a chambered vs. traditional weighted Les Paul...you'll hear & feel it.

BradM

I'll buy this. I think you and Bob have nailed it. Back when I was playing a lot of electrics, it was all high gain stuff. The main difference I could hear was single coil vs dual and pickup position. I had maple, poplar, Les Paul, semi-hollow, plenty of variety. I could notice small differences between them, but I could make all of them scream because of the amp.

I will say now that I can hear a pretty big difference between my Les Paul and Hammer Californian clean.

[AA&E]

Originally Posted by JoeCharter

The impact of wood type is hugely overrated -- and even more so with electrics.

Of course, rosewood versus maple for acoustics is kind of obvious -- but most of the conversations found on forums is much closer to the pedantic side of things.

Wood choice is nothing compared to technique, attack -- and in the case of electrics, pick-ups, amps, effects, etc.

Any sales guy or luthier who tries to convince me otherwise will lose a sale pronto.

This is pretty much my feelings on the matter as well.

[alnico5]

I'm of the opinion that electric guitar wood is a very minor part of the sound compared to the electrical components. Les Pauls and Stratocasters are frequently compared. The Fender's pickups are suspended in a sheet of plastic above a routed body. They are "floating" above the wood. Why are there no discussions about the effect of the pick guard material on tone? Mellow jazzy 335s? Ah the smokey sultry tone of plywood.

[stratokatsu]

I wonder if an electric guitar wood combination can be overcome and made to sound differently, that meaning differently as if it had different woods, by simply changing the pickups?

I've had 3 Strats at the same time, all with bodies of different words, but the same pickups. They did sound differently from one another, just slightly to my ears, but definitely different from one another.

I believe wood matters.

[Garthman]

Originally Posted by alnico5

I'm of the opinion that electric guitar wood is a very minor part of the sound compared to the electrical components. Les Pauls and Stratocasters are frequently compared. The Fender's pickups are suspended in a sheet of plastic above a routed body. They are "floating" above the wood. Why are there no discussions about the effect of the pick guard material on tone? Mellow jazzy 335s? Ah the smokey sultry tone of plywood.

Precisely. Excellent post!

(& LMAO - "Ah, the smokey sultry tone of plywood" ROLF- nice one)