Guitar shops making lowball offers

[Edgar Poe]

If I understand your post correctly. You advertised to sell your guitar, and a shop gave you a price lower than you expected. The ball is in your court, counter offer, they may accept it. They are naturally going to offer you as low as possible, they have no idea who you are, or if you even care about, or know about the value of a guitar.

Ed

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by pagedr

Often the lowballers are the same people who initially ask a million questions, want additional pictures, etc.

Hi pagedr

I used to do a lot of buying/selling of instruments, and it's typical to ask too high, counter too low and work our way to an acceptable middle ground.

I ask a lot of questions, because If I'm flipping an instrument I have to make money.

I have also told people they asked too little and offered them a fair price.

[frankmcr]

Originally Posted by pagedr

Often the lowballers are the same people who initially ask a million questions, want additional pictures, etc.

So, people who do what most posters on AGF advise prospective buyers to do.

[tadol]

Originally Posted by frankmcr

So, people who do what most posters on AGF advise prospective buyers to do.

Precisely - and are generally told they may be at fault if they don’t -

[BudHa]

Originally Posted by DesertTwang

Except that I don't remember ever seeing a guitar advertised for MSRP at GC or Sweetwater. The price is always much lower than that. What am I missing?

I think this addresses your question. I have a Martin HD-28 (2004) and a Martin 000-28EC (2013). I bought both new for 40% off the MSRP. The HD-28 came from a small mom & pop shop in Tennessee. The 000-28EC came from a relatively small online dealer in PA. I did not need to negotiate any to get this price. It was and probably still is that Martin will not allow dealers to advertise a price lower than a certain percentage (around 20% off I believe). But if you go to the right dealer you will get ~40% discount on most Martins with an MSRP over $2500.

I don't know about brands other than Martin. But the rule of thumb I use for pricing Martins is 40% of MSRP for new, 50% off MSRP for used recent issue in excellent condition. My experience with Guitar Center is they will offer 50 - 60% of what they think they can sell a guitar for. I often see Guitar Center listing recent issue used Martin guitars for more than you can buy the same model new.

[lowrider]

If you think about it, a shop has to offer a low price to buy from you. They want to re-sell the guitar. So, they offer what could be considered ''wholesale price'' so they can sell the guitar at a profit

[UncleJesse]

Originally Posted by DesertTwang

Except that I don't remember ever seeing a guitar advertised for MSRP at GC or Sweetwater. The price is always much lower than that. What am I missing?

MAP Pricing. So Sweewater advertises the D18 for $2459. Guy negotiates for a "Deal" and his SW rep quotes him 2200. He goes to sell for 2k a year later. Meanwhile we at AGF get those D18s new for $1860 and so we suggest $1500, since they are only $1860 new, and they flip out saying it's impossible to find a new D18 for $1860.

Like BudHa mentioned above, frequently I see GC pricing used guitars higher than they can be purchased new from one of our AGF sponsors. The average joe GC customer has no idea so his whole idea of pricing is skewed.

[pagedr]

Originally Posted by frankmcr

So, people who do what most posters on AGF advise prospective buyers to do.

I don't care if someone asks a bunch of questions or for very specific pictures. But if you ask for those things and then ask for 40%+ off what the guitar is listed at then you're wasting my time.

[pagedr]

Originally Posted by lowrider

If you think about it, a shop has to offer a low price to buy from you. They want to re-sell the guitar. So, they offer what could be considered ''wholesale price'' so they can sell the guitar at a profit

Of course they do. I completely understand why shops offer lower amounts than what an individual might. The point of the original post was more that they were unsolicited offers from shops, and that I hadn't really noticed this happening until the last month or two.

[frankmcr]

Originally Posted by pagedr

Of course they do. I completely understand why shops offer lower amounts than what an individual might. The point of the original post was more that they were unsolicited offers from shops, and that I hadn't really noticed this happening until the last month or two.

Yes, that does seem kind of strange - if somebody was in a hurry to sell regardless of price they'd just go to a store in the first place, right?

I suppose it could be considered the electronic equivalent of a store owner driving around to scout flea markets & garage sales & such.

Maybe there's a trade journal for used guitar shop owners - "Tip of the Month: read your local Craigslist and offer less than the asking price."

[Boozehound]

Originally Posted by UncleJesse

MAP Pricing. So Sweewater advertises the D18 for $2459. Guy negotiates for a "Deal" and his SW rep quotes him 2200. He goes to sell for 2k a year later. Meanwhile we at AGF get those D18s new for $1860 and so we suggest $1500, since they are only $1860 new, and they flip out saying it's impossible to find a new D18 for $1860.

Like BudHa mentioned above, frequently I see GC pricing used guitars higher than they can be purchased new from one of our AGF sponsors. The average joe GC customer has no idea so his whole idea of pricing is skewed.

Well put. I think this is responsible for the majority of 'mainstream' high end guitars being listed far too high. In many cases people pay MAP when those in the know can purchase for ~20% cheaper. I generally just ignore those listings.

[taylorgtr]

Originally Posted by pagedr

Often the lowballers are the same people who initially ask a million questions, want additional pictures, etc.

When I've put a guitar on Craigslist, it's been well-researched on the market price (checking Reverb, actual eBay sales, etc). It's priced to sell.

I'll get the usual scam emails, the million questions, tire kickers, etc....but occasionally, I'll get the persistent low-baller who will keep sending either the same offer, or minor bumps that are still lower than the actual market value, usually accompanied by "Why won't you sell this guitar to me?"

At that point, I reply with this:

"I'm donating it....just so you can't have it."

[Earl49]

Originally Posted by taylorgtr

"I'm donating it....just so you can't have it."

I like it!

I listed three guitars on CL just last night, along with a motorcycle. Within minutes I got the inevitable text from a robot asking "Is it still available?". Of course it is - I just listed it ten minutes ago. At least now they quoted back the ad header and not just asked about "the item" so the spammers are getting a little more sophisticated.

This was followed by longer messages wanting me to enter a google code to verify that I am a human. My response was, "Try actually calling the number that you texted, and this human will answer. No voice contact, no further responses from me".

[Trinity13]

Originally Posted by UncleJesse

MAP Pricing. So Sweewater advertises the D18 for $2459. Guy negotiates for a "Deal" and his SW rep quotes him 2200. He goes to sell for 2k a year later. Meanwhile we at AGF get those D18s new for $1860 and so we suggest $1500, since they are only $1860 new, and they flip out saying it's impossible to find a new D18 for $1860.

Like BudHa mentioned above, frequently I see GC pricing used guitars higher than they can be purchased new from one of our AGF sponsors. The average joe GC customer has no idea so his whole idea of pricing is skewed.

Similar thing happened to me....and I didn't low-ball the guy..In fact I offered him $100 less than what I could buy a new Martin for and explained to him the 40% off and the shops that offer that. He basically told me I was a liar and if he called Maury's etc...they would "laugh him off the phone" If he asked for 40% off stating the website he checked was only around 22%off. I tried to calmly explain Minimum Advertised Pricing but he basically got really angry and said I was trying to screw him. That was the first and last time I am going to have that conversation with someone.

Last I looked his guitar was still on craigslist(3 months later) and he had lowered the price significantly to below what I had originally offered

[Red_Label]

I have a very close longtime friend who manages a guitar shop. I've been active on multiple guitar forums for many years, while he's always just been a "lurker". He also doesn't have a store PayPal account. So when he sees something that he'd like for the store, he'll ask me to make an offer on it. He's not unreasonable, but needs to make a profit. If I'm uncomfortable with the offer, I'll tell him. Sometimes he'll amend the offer to something I am more comfortable making. Others I'll just see if the seller is interested. It's never personal and I always understand both sides of the coin (being both a prolific buyer and seller... AND trader). Anyways... I get lowball offers on my stuff, so I really do understand how that feels as a seller. But unfortunately/fortunately... it's been a buyer's market for years. It often benefits me (as a buyer), and even more often it pains me (as a seller). It is what it is. Personally though, when I'm making an offer on something for myself... I rarely low-ball (if ever). I've always been uncomfortable playing that game. If I want something, I'm willing to pay a fair price for it and I have always hated dickering. It comes from my dad, who also hated playing those games. While other people seem to enjoy the art of the deal. I just want to get whatever new toy I'm salivating over, as quickly as possible, without games.