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  #1  
Old 06-13-2019, 02:15 PM
Coolblueice Coolblueice is offline
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Default Recording my Cordoba GK Pro Negra guitar played fingerstyle

Hello Forum members...

Guitar: Cordoba GK Pro Negra

Problem encountered:

I can't seem to find microphones for recording that capture the natural full rich sound of this guitar. I have a pair of Samson C02 Pencil Condenser Microphones They are not expensive. The matched pair costs only about €100.

Perhaps that is the problem. No matter how I place these microphones (and I have experimented a LOT with every kamasutra position for mic placement that I can think of), the recordings always turn out to sound "thin and weak", never even coming close to capturing the warm and clear sound this guitar acoustically produces.

There are a lot of YouTube videos on miking "acoustic guitars", but 99 percent of them seem to focus on steel-string guitars, played with a pick. (Often only strumming chords). Nylon stringed guitars played fingerstyle are a completely different animal.

I envision the best mics to be those well suited for recording "classical guitar".

I specifically want to record finger-style guitar and end up with a clean yet full and rich sound.

My decision on what to buy:
I have narrowed down my choice of microphones to the Audio Technica AT4040 and the AKG C214.

Which of these two microphones would you recommend for miking the guitar mentioned above (Cordoba GK Pro Negra)? Please not I am not concerned about recording vocals... but more specifically I am ONLY concerned about getting a full and rich sounding recording from the guitar.

Can you recommend one of these two mics over the other? Or perhaps you have your own thoughts on some other mic I should consider.
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  #2  
Old 06-14-2019, 12:17 AM
sirwhale sirwhale is offline
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I have, and use, the AT2020. It works well for me and I notice large differences depending on the placement of the mic, i.e. closer to the neck, or closer to the hole. I also have a flamenco negra.

My videos in my signature are all recorded on this microphone if you are interested. You can often see the microphone and its placement. Sometimes I have it a meter or two away due to singing or playing with my wife. But you could then compare with where I have purposely placed the mic nearer.
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Guitar: Camps Primera Negra A (a flamenco guitar)
Strings: Aquila Rubino, Knobloch CX
I play: Acoustic blues & folk
Videos: https://www.youtube.com/user/sirwhale28/videos

Last edited by sirwhale; 06-14-2019 at 12:22 AM.
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  #3  
Old 06-18-2019, 02:53 AM
JonnyBGood JonnyBGood is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolblueice View Post
I can't seem to find microphones for recording that capture the natural full rich sound of this guitar. I have a pair of Samson C02 Pencil Condenser Microphones ..........No matter how I place these microphones (and I have experimented a LOT with every kamasutra position for mic placement that I can think of), the recordings always turn out to sound "thin and weak", never even coming close to capturing the warm and clear sound this guitar acoustically produces.
Hi
I have recorded and produced two CDs featuring flamenco and classical guitar and also recorded many professional demos for clients. Some thoughts which may help:

You don’t mention one of the most important things – what are you plugging the mics into? That alone could be the cause of the poor quality recordings as everything in the signal chain affects the end result and a cheap preamp, (eg plugging straight into a PC’s motherboard soundcard or via an entry level mini mixer) will place a limit on how good the result is.

But yes, even if you use a great preamp your sound will only be as good as the mics you use to capture it and your Samson mics are basic entry level. Both the mics you mention buying are far superior (I actually recorded my CDs with cheaper mics, eg Rode NT1). I see you are opting for large diaphragms which I think will help you. However, the difference between these two mics will be negligible and far outweighed by your preamp quality and your studio abilities (mic placement, setting levels, acoustics of the room). This all assumes you are capturing at a decent bit depth and there’s not something incorrectly set up in your DAW.

Are you monitoring via headphones? This is essential to get a good sound and to set up your equipment - you need to hear what the mic is capturing whilst you try different positions (so good studio headphones that don't flatter you help also). Generally for a deeper sound and to capture more bass you will want the mic closer to the guitar as bass frequencies do not travel as far, although where you place the mic will be a factor also (eg pointing at lower bout vs 12th fret).

HTH
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Jon

"The way nature seems to work is that it sends a messenger...the acoustic guitar needed to go in another direction, Michael Hedges became that messenger"
Tommy Emmanuel

Last edited by JonnyBGood; 06-18-2019 at 03:00 AM.
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  #4  
Old 06-18-2019, 04:52 AM
sirwhale sirwhale is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
Hi
I have recorded and produced two CDs featuring flamenco and classical guitar and also recorded many professional demos for clients. Some thoughts which may help:

You don’t mention one of the most important things – what are you plugging the mics into? That alone could be the cause of the poor quality recordings as everything in the signal chain affects the end result and a cheap preamp, (eg plugging straight into a PC’s motherboard soundcard or via an entry level mini mixer) will place a limit on how good the result is.

But yes, even if you use a great preamp your sound will only be as good as the mics you use to capture it and your Samson mics are basic entry level. Both the mics you mention buying are far superior (I actually recorded my CDs with cheaper mics, eg Rode NT1). I see you are opting for large diaphragms which I think will help you. However, the difference between these two mics will be negligible and far outweighed by your preamp quality and your studio abilities (mic placement, setting levels, acoustics of the room). This all assumes you are capturing at a decent bit depth and there’s not something incorrectly set up in your DAW.

Are you monitoring via headphones? This is essential to get a good sound and to set up your equipment - you need to hear what the mic is capturing whilst you try different positions (so good studio headphones that don't flatter you help also). Generally for a deeper sound and to capture more bass you will want the mic closer to the guitar as bass frequencies do not travel as far, although where you place the mic will be a factor also (eg pointing at lower bout vs 12th fret).

HTH
This is interesting. I plug my AT2020 directly, via USB, into a Macbook Pro. Despite its prestige I imagine the sound card might not be the best either. Am I right? What should I use instead?
__________________
Guitar: Camps Primera Negra A (a flamenco guitar)
Strings: Aquila Rubino, Knobloch CX
I play: Acoustic blues & folk
Videos: https://www.youtube.com/user/sirwhale28/videos
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  #5  
Old 06-18-2019, 06:01 AM
JonnyBGood JonnyBGood is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirwhale View Post
This is interesting. I plug my AT2020 directly, via USB, into a Macbook Pro. Despite its prestige I imagine the sound card might not be the best either. Am I right? What should I use instead?
Yes, you are right. A dedicated audio interface will produce superior results when capturing something as delicate as acoustic guitar via microphones and it makes no sense spending 100s of dollars/pounds on expensive mics without having a decent, dedicated interface. The quality of the mic preamps and the analogue>digital converters are key and you don't need to spend mega bucks, I used a Focusrite 24 dual channel preamp/interface for the projects I mentioned above, which is cheaper than any of the mics being discussed.

I'm afraid I am not familiar with Mac gear so I can't really make recommendations. I'm sure someone else here can, though its always dependent on budget.
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"The way nature seems to work is that it sends a messenger...the acoustic guitar needed to go in another direction, Michael Hedges became that messenger"
Tommy Emmanuel
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classical guitar, mic, microphone, nylon string, recording

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