Advice: Bourgeois or Goodall

[smpetty]

There is a 12-fret Goodall Long Dread on the AGF buy/sell forum that may make a nice compromise for you. The 12-fretters are warmer and the long dread has a more Martinesque tone than most Goodalls. The guy selling it is as good as they come - I've bought 2 Goodalls from Larry and they were both better than described. He knows more about Goodalls than most on this forum.

I have owned two Goodalls (a walnut/engelmann standard cutaway and a rosewood/Sitka concert jumbo) and a Bourgeois VOM (rosewood/Adirondack). The Bourgeois is a beautiful guitar, but the tone is very dry, very balanced, and to my ears somewhat uninspiring. The Goodalls, on the other hand, are lush and rich and full. It really comes down to what you like... they are on the opposite ends of the acoustic tonal spectrum IMO.

Scott

[Tony Burns]

Id wait till the right Goodall comes along rather than just switching your gears and getting the bourgeois . im not knocking them their just a different animal . Im not one of their fans. Goodall do have a simalar sound or a relationship to each other thats quirky ( i like that ) maybe look for a Standard in EIR -but then again im a big believer in trying something before you buy it -could you make a road trip to a goodall dealer maybe make a trade or at least play some guitars .

[Backpocketnj]

From my experience, I've preferred the Goodalls I have played over the Bourgeios I have played. They were not all the same woods and sizes, but overall, a blind buy for me would be a Goodall.

[zplay]

Originally Posted by wcap

Here is something that might actually be more useful than anything else. This guy on YouTube plays several different Goodalls. Aside from the fact that he plays better than me , the sound you hear in these recordings is amazingly like what I hear from my Goodall:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJA6rLHeChU

and

http://www.youtube.com/user/agustinamigo (not all the guitars he is playing are Goodalls though)

Apparently he tends to do his recordings really dry, and then add some reverb and such. But the end result in these YouTube videos is an amazingly accurate reproduction of what a Goodall can sound like played live with no amplification or anything. Like I said, there is a clarity to the notes along with a deep almost three-dimensional richness to the sound.

If you like the sounds in these videos you might like playing a Goodall. If you are a bluegrass flatpicker you might prefer a different guitar.

The only problem here though is that if you buy a Goodall it won't come with Agustin Amigo to play it!

I agree that this guy does some nice recordings with nice guitars and is well worth listening to. As a Lakewood owner, I've paid more attention to those recordings he's done with Lakewoods and feel that they also pretty well capture their essential tone. I'm a Bourgeois owner - have had several different models - and agree most are on the drier, traditional side, but vary between models. My Lakewood is more toward the Goodall side, but I think splits the difference nicely and would be worth considering if you're into sampling the continuum.
Agree with others here who suggest arranging test runs with these very different guitars, if possible. There are also significant differences between them in terms of neck carves which is also an important consideration.

[SOR]

Originally Posted by AshrafO

I totally forgot about this thread, but much thanks to every one and their responses I quite enjoyed them. I've been through a few guitars by now, but I am still jonesin' for a Goodall.. or even perhaps a Bourgeois!

I've had five Goodalls and currently have both a Goodall and a Bourgeois. The Bourgeois is a excellent example of a traditional OM with great build quality and a bit more contemporary neck profile than the equivalent Martins I've had, I also prefer it's finish since I'm not a fan of nitro. I consider Goodalls in a different league however, certainly for my playing style. As others have said you can't go wrong with either but only the Goodall still amazes me every time I play it. Good luck.

[Charlie x]

Hi, ...you mention 'high end Martin' and I am also trying to decide between Dana and James.
What is a 'high end Martin'? If I have a D 28...is this the same as the high end D 45 but without the bling?

Is a 6k Martin really a 1k guitar plus 5k of inlay work?

Or are there actual differences when you go up the line? Just asking here...

[DenverSteve]

Originally Posted by AshrafO

...I'm selling my Mcilroy A30 (it's on ebay right now) so I can buy another guitar in that price range. I've never played a Bourgeois or a Goodall (and I live a few hundred kms from the closest place where I could try them) but those are the choices I've come down to for what I want to buy, mainly because I know they'll be good, and they have good resale value, so I can sell them easily if I want to try something else again soon.

Okay - First of all there's no such thing as a "Bourgeois" or a "Goodall". Every Bourgeois I've owned or played sounded completely different from each other. You've not indicated whether you would be considering a Bourgeois 00 against a Goodall GC or Dread or....... what? Every Goodall I've owned or played sounded different from each other. Some have been fantastic and others, not so much. Therefore, there is no Bourgeois or Goodall expectation (just like every other manufacturer) other than they will sound different from not only each other but also every guitar will sound different. To me it always comes down to a specific guitar.

Selling a known commodity for an unknown is, to me, is the perfect recipe for failure at a healthy cost. While Bourgeois and Goodall's are potentially fantastic guitars, that doesn't mean you will like both, either one or neither. Additionally, you may love a Bourgeois 00 and not a slope-shoulder dread. I would take my time, research the internet, find a guitar that is the body style and sound you like from your experience and then move towards a singular guitar and not a specific builder.

[DenverSteve]

Originally Posted by Charlie x

Hi ...you mention 'high end Martin' and I am also trying to decide between Dana and James. What is a 'high end Martin'? If I have a D 28...is this the same as the high end D 45 but without the bling? Is a 6k Martin really a 1k guitar plus 5k of inlay work? Or are there actual differences when you go up the line? Just asking here...

While the questions are valid, you might start your own thread if you're interested in the many fine Martin guitars and how they differ. Otherwise, answering your excellent questions herein would be a complete unrelated hijacking of the OP's thread.

[sakar12]

Originally Posted by DenverSteve

While the questions are valid, you might start your own thread if you're interested in the many fine Martin guitars and how they differ. Otherwise, answering your excellent questions herein would be a complete unrelated hijacking of the OP's thread.

Good point. However, since the OP's thread was started in 2011, he might be okay with it being hijacked

[DenverSteve]

Originally Posted by sakar12

Good point. However, since the OP's thread was started in 2011, he might be okay with it being hijacked

Ha. Touche. I never would have posted had I noticed that. Thanks. Then, on to your question.

Yes there are real differences between Standard and "high-end" Martins. No one ever articulates specifically how much the Custom shop and 40 series guitars are different but the results are more than obvious. Now, as to what constitutes "high-end" Martins would have to be left to one's individual financial sensitivities. The Authentics, the 40's, the older GE's, and similar, to me, fall into the higher-end Martins. That said, the Standards are certainly high-end for many (maybe most) and are equal to most small-shop or boutique guitars.

[Rosewood99]

Zombie thread lives!

[sakar12]

Originally Posted by DenverSteve

Ha. Touche. I never would have posted had I noticed that. Thanks. Then, on to your question.

Yes there are real differences between Standard and "high-end" Martins. No one ever articulates specifically how much the Custom shop and 40 series guitars are different but the results are more than obvious. Now, as to what constitutes "high-end" Martins would have to be left to one's individual financial sensitivities. The Authentics, the 40's, the older GE's, and similar, to me, fall into the higher-end Martins. That said, the Standards are certainly high-end for many (maybe most) and are equal to most small-shop or boutique guitars.

Charlie's question, not mine, but I appreciate the response anyway. My great lament in being a left-handed player is that I have to buy my guitars to really try them out, and while I've owned a D-28, D-35, D-18 GE, 000-28, and 000-18, I really, really, really, would like to know for myself what makes the authentics et. al. so much better.

Cheers.

[Tnfiddler]

Originally Posted by Charlie x

Hi, Im not trying to be a dic here...but you mention 'high end Martin' and I am also trying to decide between Dana and James.
What is a 'high end Martin'? If I have a D 28...is this the same as the high end D 45 but without the bling?

Is a 6k Martin really a 1k guitar plus 5k of inlay work?

Or are there actual differences when you go up the line? Just asking here...

I played several HD28's before I bought my D-41 and while they were phenomenal guitars, My D-41 has a tone, that is just magic, that the HD-28's didn't have. Not to forget, those killer looks to go along with it. Now is it better than my Bourgeois? No, it's louder because it's a larger body and a long scale, but the Bourgeois holds its own with it and has a better balanced tone. In the front, the D-41 is a much prettier guitar, but my Bourgeois has KILLER "Fiddleback" Mahogany back and sides and is some of the nicest mahogany back and sides I've seen.

[DenverSteve]

Originally Posted by sakar12

Charlie's question, not mine, but I appreciate the response anyway. My great lament in being a left-handed player is that I have to buy my guitars to really try them out, and while I've owned a D-28, D-35, D-18 GE, 000-28, and 000-18, I really, really, really, would like to know for myself what makes the authentics et. al. so much better.

Cheers.

First the process for Authentics is very specific and the builds are done to replicate, as close as possible, builds from the '30's which are considered the "golden era" of pre-war Martins. The attention paid to bracing and materials and hot-hide glues and such contribute to superb final results. Also like Tnfiddler said, there is something magical about the 40 guitars. Some people poo-poo the benefit, or lack thereof, of the inlays around the top but the difference is obvious and that is one aspect of the differences between lower numbered (18, 28, 35....) Standards, which are world-class, and that little "something extra" that the 40's have.