UK Bans Petrol, Diesel & Hybrid Cars By 2035

[Jobe]

I think with mandates forcing the marketplace to adapt you may see various alternatives. Current battery tech does not seem like the end game. Always thought hydrogen would be the answer but I guess it is not easy to harness. Too bad as there is plenty of it out there and it only gives up water dribbles out of the exhaust. GM has already built a hydrogen prototype and that was years ago. Pretty cool. The 'fuel' was carried in the frame base of the vehicle. For now, I will attempt to enjoy my 1994 Mercedes station wagon whose quiet exhaust pipe sends out gentle fumes into the atmosphere and creates new stars. I will miss the good old days of good combustion and smelly oil rags. Sigh.

[Silurian]

One should remember that Mr Johnson has spent a large part of his career as a journalist and knows the value of an eye catching headline.

[Silly Moustache]

Leaving aside any comment about Mr Johnson, I'm assuming that the "ban" petrol/diesel fueled vehicles applies only to the sale of "new" ones ???

This leads me to wonder whether it would be best to rid ourselves of non electric vehicles as soon as possible, or to hang on to them for as long as possible?

This is unlikely to encourage the retention of vehicle Japanese and French vehicle manufactures in the UK.

[RalphH]

Originally Posted by boombox

Besides which, electric cars are not the best solution: they are only so if the electricity needed is sourced differently.

We're already at 30% renewable and coal only accounts for 2% - the rest is natural gas, which is still better than petrol (gasoline).

So even now, battery electric vehicles in the UK produce about half the lifetime CO2 of a traditionally fuelled car, even when their battery production is taken into account. And we have targets to improve further to 50% by renewables by 2025 and then onwards and upwards to 2035, so we're much better placed to take advantage of electric cars than somewhere like china where coal is closer to 70%. Then you've got a car that 70% runs on coal and I agree - that is a step backward.

That said, I don't see myself buying an electric car any time soon - I drive about 2000 miles a year so suspect I'll not live long enough to 'payback' the environmental damage of making an electric car as things currently stand (my petrol car already exists, so there is zero environmental impact by keeping it, except for the fuel, and I only get though about 55 gallons a year!!).

Of course if technology improves and production impact is reduced then sure. I've already done long-distance journeys in a friends electric car. Having to have a 15min toilet & coffee break every 200 miles is really not that inconvenient and that'll only improve over time.

Kerbie is right it's close to the wind as a topic - let's keep politics out of this or it'll be shut down. Opinions on individual politicians is definitely 'political'. The realities of are they cheaper to run, really better for the environment etc is far more useful.

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

LThis leads me to wonder whether it would be best to rid ourselves of non electric vehicles as soon as possible, or to hang on to them for as long as possible?

I doubt something like a Ford Focus will go up in value much after they're banned, but rarer cars like a Ford Mustang, Aston Martin, Ferrari, etc, etc will probably see their values go up considerably, even when you need buy petrol mail-order in 1L bottles

[buddyhu]

The new long range version of the Tesla model Y will go 315 miles on a charge. Elon Musk says hey will last 40 or more years, as opposed to maybe 20years for a higher end Toyota. Minimal maintenance on the Tesla: no oil change every 3000 or 6000 miles, no spark plugs to replace.

The estimated MPG equivalent for a Tesla is about 148....that varies depending on the sources to produce the electricity (coal, hydro, wind, solar, or oil).

I think the ongoing impact of of a car that uses fossil fuel is much higher than usually estimated, and the impact of manufacturing batteries is overstated.

As to outlawing petrol, diesel, and hybrid car sales in the future: I think it is an intelligent and wise move.

[tbeltrans]

So it truly is the end of an era:




...and



...and



...and plenty more where these came from. Oh well, it had to happen sooner or later.

Tony

[12barBill]

Does this relate to passenger vehicles only? If its a total ban on diesel fuel what's going to happen to the trucking industry and the ability to supply the market place with every item imaginable? What is going to happen to construction without bulldozers, earth movers, backhoes, etc.? What about aviation fuel?

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Bill Sims

...If it's a total ban on diesel fuel what's going to happen to the trucking industry and the ability to supply the market place with every item imaginable? What is going to happen to construction without bulldozers, earth movers, backhoes, etc.? What about aviation fuel?

Although there's still enough track in use here on the North American continent, once you get outside the major urban areas the predominant mode of locomotion for both freight and passenger trains is diesel-electric - and while it's reported to be an improvement in terms of fuel consumption versus net cargo weight/volume over a typical 18-wheeler, you're still effectively back to square one...

That said, where I see the real impact is in maritime, whether pleasure/commercial/military - one with which I'm extremely familiar given both my geographic location, and the fact that my father worked for a well-known steamship company that went under in the early-70's; other than nuclear power (potentially problematic in its own right) current technology doesn't support the massive propulsion systems required, and we're not likely to develop them in the next 10-15 years - simply put, short of a Nobel Prize-worthy breakthrough (and the requisite technical/industrial infrastructure to implement and support it) things come to a grinding halt in short order. I see the operative word here being patience - remember that it took a full century to develop a nominally viable electric car - and while we should in no way abandon our quest IMO a more gradual interim solution, based on current technological methods/prospects, would perhaps be a wiser path as we develop a more efficient successor...

[TomB'sox]

Potentially possibly in a country as small as England of course, much more difficult here. I have an electric and someone mentioned a supercharger can charge in a much shorter time. Good luck finding one that is functioning and open. People park, plug in and leave. There is a lot of infrastructure needed to make this even possible. I have never once been able to charge anywhere than my garage.

I have thought, and still do, Hydrogen fuel cells would be the answer. You still fill at a regular station like with petrol. Honda and I believe Chevrolet have had them for several years. Mostly in California, but again trying to find a place to refuel is the issue for widespread adoption of any technology.

[619TF]

Originally Posted by TomB'sox

Potentially possibly in a country as small as England of course, much more difficult here. I have an electric and someone mentioned a supercharger can charge in a much shorter time. Good luck finding one that is functioning and open. People park, plug in and leave. There is a lot of infrastructure needed to make this even possible. I have never once been able to charge anywhere than my garage.

I have thought, and still do, Hydrogen fuel cells would be the answer. You still fill at a regular station like with petrol. Honda and I believe Chevrolet have had them for several years. Mostly in California, but again trying to find a place to refuel is the issue for widespread adoption of any technology.

As with the Hydrogen cars, California is making access to "fuel" for electrics far more available than many other places. That proves that it's possible no matter what the country size might be. It's a matter of local/federal governments making it so which seems to be the stumbling block in most locales. CA has, I believe, the highest rate of e-car adoption in the country. Partially, if not probably because of the sheer number of places you can charge. It seems like every supermarket I go to has at least 4 charging stations and malls have closer to 10 or 15.

But, just to show I have no skin in this game myself...

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

So it truly is the end of an era:

[edited links for space]]

...and plenty more where these came from. Oh well, it had to happen sooner or later.

Tony

And so it begins...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uukZgfHZIoc

[frankmcr]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

So it truly is the end of an era:

<>
...and plenty more where these came from. Oh well, it had to happen sooner or later.

That's what they said when . . .

[KevWind]

The reality is if you debunk the massive misinformation surrounding EV's Electric Vehicles. They are fast becoming the future for basic typical commuting.
My son in law's commute is right at about 100 mi. round trip. He just got a Nissan leaf gets 225 or so miles per full charge

First UK is talking about sales of (New vehicles) and has no impact on existing vehicles

In general
We find that the tech for EV's gets better exponentially every year and the "range" is and will continue to increase
Yes the buy in costs currently are higher (but not only that will improve) but currently the overall cost and end costs are lower for EV and will also improve with advancing tech.

Also there is no logical reason to believe that Electric motors are not exponentially longer lived. The battery life is the only valid question.
for example I worked on the railroad for a two year period and three of the 4 late 40's early 50's era, diesel/electric yard loco's, the electric motors were on 2 + million plus, miles

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by frankmcr

That's what they said when . . .

It just evolved and got colder





And for those of us out here in the wild west that have completely lost our minds, here is what I did for a few years as the skier, and even won twice. Hint ! a fast horse is the key (what is not as obvious is that you get routinely pelted with a snow claud's being kicked up by the horse )

[ManyMartinMan]

Originally Posted by 619TF

As with the Hydrogen cars, California is making access to "fuel" for electrics far more available than many other places.

That's correct but mainly for "coastal" California. Don't forget most of the state is inland and not heavily populated. About 70% of the U.S. is rural and would all need the same recharging (regardless of specific technology) capability. I look forward to the time in the future where we commit to such infrastructure.

[Dirk Hofman]

Originally Posted by 619TF

As with the Hydrogen cars, California is making access to "fuel" for electrics far more available than many other places. That proves that it's possible no matter what the country size might be. It's a matter of local/federal governments making it so which seems to be the stumbling block in most locales. CA has, I believe, the highest rate of e-car adoption in the country. Partially, if not probably because of the sheer number of places you can charge. It seems like every supermarket I go to has at least 4 charging stations and malls have closer to 10 or 15.

Correct. It's simply a chicken and egg situation. Require all cars to be electric, and amazingly, businesses will innovate and solve for that new reality.

Good on the UK and Europe. I"m glad the bulk of the western world is focused on problem solving.