Comparing American and Non-American Steel-String Lutherie

[mafoofan]

I was recently re-reading Somogyi's insightful history of the steel-string guitar. Having largely originated as a factory-made instrument intended for mass consumption, and only relatively recently becoming accepted as a "high" craft worthy of skilled luthiers, the steel-string strikes me as a distinct anamoly. Most material goods move in the opposite direction, starting as handmade, individualized works requiring high levels of skill concentrated in a single craftsman, and only later evolving into commoditized products produced at exponentially lower cost through technological advancements.

Consequently, we are said to be in the midst of a "Golden Age." The likes of Olson, Somogyi, Ryan, etc., are spearheading the rapid flourishing of steel-string lutherie. The "tradition" of the craft is being defined right this moment.

A unique effect of this reverse timeline is that Americans are starting off on at least even footing versus their European counterparts. Unlike in many other crafts, the former do not seem particularly bound to the customs and traditions of the latter. Yes, classical guitar making is far more established in Europe, but for purposes of this discussion, the steel-string might as well be its own species: rarely does a maker of classical guitars excel at making steel-strings, and vice-versa.

This has led me to wonder whether there are any broad differences in style or quality comparing the steel-string guitars made by American luthiers versus others. On the one hand, regional craftsman in other fields tend to adhere to certain ways of doing things that distinguish them. Causes for this phenomenon include: tradition and custom, the cultural environment, size of the professional community, and market dynamics (size, demand, competitiveness, etc.). Yet, we are an increasingly globalized world. As recent as the origins of steel-string lutherie are, the factors that typically lead to regional distinctions of craft may simply not be relevant anymore.

Out of my own curiousity, I have tried learning more about non-American steel-string luthiers, but without much luck. There are a few discussions here and there, but talk of American makers dominates the English-language internet. Why? Are there far fewer non-American steel-string luthiers? Are the discussions simply happening in other languages? Are American-made steel-string guitars preferred, even globally? Do people prefer to work with luthiers geographically closer to them?

Very much looking forward to your thoughts.

[SJ VanSandt]

Interesting questions. I've seen a number threads about luthiers in other English speaking nations here on AGF, but they are all much smaller than the USA, population-wise, so that may account for most of the difference (though Canada seems to punch far above its weight, at least on this forum). The language barrier, shipping distances, local musical traditions, and good old American chauvinism might be factors as well.

[Bruce Sexauer]

The American advantage, if there is one (there is), rests on our community. The European tradition is a Master/apprentice relationship with most serious information withheld to a large extent until late in the process. The Violin community continues to be like this even in America, but the guitar community is much more open with very few luthiers withholding information from their peers. This sharing has allowed the state of the art to be widely held and relatively developed, a work in progress as we speak. IMO, of course.

I personally have so far been willing to answer any question posed as long as it is well considered, to the point ("How do you build a guitar" is NOT a good question), and I have the information. Those who do not understand the issues are unlikely to ask the pertinent questions are not going to understand the answers, which has shielded much of our treasure from being exported.

[vintageparlors]

There are some serious British, Euro, Australian quality builders out there. Don't miss out on the good stuff.

[theEdwinson]

Two of our sponsors here on the AGF are London guitar dealers who specialize in acoustic guitars from North America- The North American Guitar, and the Acoustic Music Co., UK.
This leads me to believe that high-end acoustic guitars built by USA and Canadian luthiers are held in particularly high regard on the other side of the Atlantic. I hope Michael and Trevor will chime in with some thoughts on this.

I have always had a great admiration for Stefan Sobell and Roger Bucknall (Fylde), two English builders of great talent and skill. And of course, the Northern Ireland builder, George Lowden, is among the world's greatest and most highly regarded.
Over here in the US, luthiers have become as common as ants at a picnic. But I'm guessing that is not so over in the EU.

[kirkham13]

It would be interesting to place on a map of the world, established steel string builders, past and present, and have a blurb attached as to what type of guitar they strive for.... Or maybe a website would make more sense.

[ewh2]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

Consequently, we are said to be in the midst of a "Golden Age." The likes of Olson, Somogyi, Ryan, etc., are spearheading the rapid flourishing of steel-string lutherie. The "tradition" of the craft is being defined right this moment.

A unique effect of this reverse timeline is that Americans are starting off on at least even footing versus their European counterparts. Unlike in many other crafts, the former do not seem particularly bound to the customs and traditions of the latter. Yes, classical guitar making is far more established in Europe, but for purposes of this discussion, the steel-string might as well be its own species: rarely does a maker of classical guitars excel at making steel-strings, and vice-versa.

Out of my own curiousity, I have tried learning more about non-American steel-string luthiers, but without much luck. There are a few discussions here and there, but talk of American makers dominates the English-language internet. Why? Are there far fewer non-American steel-string luthiers? Are the discussions simply happening in other languages? Are American-made steel-string guitars preferred, even globally? Do people prefer to work with luthiers geographically closer to them?

When it comes to nylon strung guitars, USA luthiers are coming along, guys like Robert Ruck, Lester DeVoe are regarded up with the very best of Europe.

I think American luthiers dominate the market aside from tradition, economics - the market for steel string acoustic guitars is so much bigger in USA than Europe.

Something which I have considered for why this is, there seems to be a greater tradition of learning woodwork, my presumption is that students at high school can learn woodwork which prepares them for better grounding if they move to luthiery. I can't speak for the rest of Europe, but in the UK there's little to nothing at schools for learning woodwork.

It might sound boring, but I think economics are the main reason why American Luthiers dominate the market historically. The acoustic guitar culturally has been central in the public artistic gaze. From the 1920's onwards, with country and western growing hugely as well as blues/ragtime, later on there was the singer songwriter/folk movement.

The acoustic guitar has been a central part of American culture for around 100 years and luthiers have excelled and evolved to meet it. In Europe although the acoustic guitar has been important, the market demand due to population and culture has never been as significant.

Nonetheless there are some great European luthiers of steel string guitars, Lowden, Sobell, Andy Manson, Bill Kelday, Fylde which are all in the British Isles who have been around for a while. When it comes to mainland Europe I'm struggling to think of that many who have been around for a while, Lakewood is the only one I can think of. Again I think this is down to demand.

In mainland Europe, there is a market for Selmer style gypsy jazz guitars with known/established luthiers including Dupont, Busato etc. The gypsy jazz form and music style is something which has a greater cultural association to Europe, although it has roots in American music it developed in Europe.

[Mooh]

I don't think it necessarily follows geographical or political borders.

[M19]

Here's George Lowden's Story.

http://www.georgelowden.com/page29/page36/story.html

He tells it in several YouTube videos too, like this on design:

[Michael Watts]

A subject very dear to my heart. The North American Guitar (TNAG for short) takes its name from what we specialise in. Guitars that were born in North America (the steel string flat top, electric solidbody, archtop etc). The modern guitar (to distinguish it from the Classical/Flamenco and Manouche instruments is a North American creation. Its story closely mirrors musical, cultural and sociopolitical trends and it's a fascinating subject.

Here are some direct comparisons:

UK luthiers:

Lowden



Ralph Bown



Stefan Sobell



N. American Luthiers:

Froggy Bottom



Jason Kostal



Michael Greenfield

[Trevor Gore]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

Out of my own curiousity, I have tried learning more about non-American steel-string luthiers, but without much luck. There are a few discussions here and there, but talk of American makers dominates the English-language internet. Why?

You're looking in the wrong places. Try here (the deep south).

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by SJ VanSandt

The language barrier, shipping distances, local musical traditions, and good old American chauvinism might be factors as well.

Never underestimate American chauvinism.

Originally Posted by Bruce Sexauer

The American advantage, if there is one (there is), rests on our community. The European tradition is a Master/apprentice relationship with most serious information withheld to a large extent until late in the process. The Violin community continues to be like this even in America, but the guitar community is much more open with very few luthiers withholding information from their peers. This sharing has allowed the state of the art to be widely held and relatively developed, a work in progress as we speak. IMO, of course.

This is a fascinating angle. What do you suppose underlies the difference? Generally, I'd expect partcipants in an increasingly saturated market to become increasingly protective of competitive advantages.

Originally Posted by ewh2

I think American luthiers dominate the market aside from tradition, economics - the market for steel string acoustic guitars is so much bigger in USA than Europe.

Something which I have considered for why this is, there seems to be a greater tradition of learning woodwork, my presumption is that students at high school can learn woodwork which prepares them for better grounding if they move to luthiery. I can't speak for the rest of Europe, but in the UK there's little to nothing at schools for learning woodwork.

Interesting point. However, there is certainly less of a cultural emphasis on handcraft and artisanship in the U.S. than in Europe. I would think fewer Americans than Europeans grow up with an openness to entering such a trade as lutherie.

Originally Posted by ewh2

Nonetheless there are some great European luthiers of steel string guitars, Lowden, Sobell, Andy Manson, Bill Kelday, Fylde which are all in the British Isles who have been around for a while. When it comes to mainland Europe I'm struggling to think of that many who have been around for a while, Lakewood is the only one I can think of. Again I think this is down to demand.

I've heard of most of those makers. How do they compare to American luthierss? More or less the same, but just across the pond? Or are there meaningful differences?

Originally Posted by Michael Watts

A subject very dear to my heart. The North American Guitar (TNAG for short) takes its name from what we specialise in. Guitars that were born in North America (the steel string flat top, electric solidbody, archtop etc). The modern guitar (to distinguish it from the Classical/Flamenco and Manouche instruments is a North American creation. Its story closely mirrors musical, cultural and sociopolitical trends and it's a fascinating subject.

I can't watch your videos at work, but I appreciate the examples! Do your European buyers place a premium on steel-strings from U.S. makers or are they just viewed as more guitars to choose from?

[ewh2]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

I've heard of most of those makers. How do they compare to American luthierss? More or less the same, but just across the pond? Or are there meaningful differences?

Ralph Bown & Bill Kelday make Martin reproductions which are supposed to be superb.
There's the Sobell type of guitar which has a voice of it's own, different to American guitars in voicing with European luthiers of NK Forster, Taran being influenced by that (the influence has crossed to the other side of the Atlantic too, with Buck Curran and I think Laurent Brondel being influenced by Sobell).
Lowden has it's sphere of influence too, upon others in the UK including McIlroy and Avalon. Lowdens have a different sound to the traditional American guitar sound (eg that of Martin, Gibson, Larson Bros etc).
The others of Fylde, Manson, Brook etc, I would say they do have a different voice to traditional American guitars.

I think there are great guitars being made on either side of the Atlantic (and Pacific, but that's another question/issue), I think as a consumer we live in golden era of choice, pretty much whatever budget one has there is a wide range of available options to find the most suitable instrument for the player.

[SJ VanSandt]

Michael those are fantastic videos: I believe I can discern a distinct flavor to each group, though of course each instrument has its own voice. I though I would prefer the English guitars for the celtic-flavored works, until I came to the Kostal! And I thought I liked the Froggy Bottom least until you started playing the bluegrass style, for which it is perfectly voiced. Stellar guitars all, and beautiful playing, as always. Thanks for the contribution!

Don't want anyone to think I'm being anti-American by mentioning American chauvinism: all cultures have an element of that and probably should. But the US being the biggest market for guitars, that's bound to be a factor in the lack of discussion of non-American luthiers. I'm very proud of America's contributions to the musical culture of the world, and my favorite luthiers are all American - so far!

[PeterF]

Another factor is the VAT in Europe. I think it was Trevor that told me he didn't sell European guitars because as a business with a high turnover, he would have to charge VAT, whereas an individual luthier wouldn't. Therefore it doesn't make sense for luthiers to sell through a store in Europe, because they'd have to charge 20% more than if they were selling them themselves.