#1
|
||||
|
||||
Breaking down the Robbins/Martin Cowboy sound?
I realize this could easily go in "general", but since the archtop group tends to be more into jazz and similar sounds, I want to post this here. As a big fan of Marty Robbins cowboy music, I have come to love his album Cowboy Ballads and Trail Songs. My understanding is that the lead "ranchero" style guitar was played by Grady Martin on archtop, while I "think" much of the rhythm was Robbins on a flat top (I could be wrong here).
I am also a fan of western swing music (Asleep at the Wheel, Bob Wills, etc.). I know there are a few videos on western swing, but not a ton. It seems like the comping and chord work in western swing isn't too far removed from jazz. So, in relating to the sound I am looking for, is learning the basics of jazz helpful here? Or should I concentrate solely on WS music? Or should I scrap both and concentrate on Ranchero Mexican music? Thoughts? As a young 51 year old, I don't want to spend years of intensive jazz study and am more interested in learning the basics to build on. I'm just not sure WHICH basics to build on!
__________________
https://www.mcmakinmusic.com |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
I'd look into Ranger Doug, from "Riders In The Sky" and "The Timejumpers":
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_B._Green He has some instructional material available and is in general a great introductory resource to cowboy music (and how he differentiates it from Texas Swing). -Douglas C. |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
Hi Bone Digger, I sympathise.
I own three archtops primarily to learn western swing style, and yes I was influenced by Ranger Doug and even have his DVD on playing style although I didn't find it very helpful. .... and thus far, I've failed. However, I believe it is effectively comping. With the chording following the running bass lines, using the I, III, and V (bass) notes up and down the fret board of the chords in the progression as a bass player might do but adding in in inversions from them.. . which, of course, means scampering up and down a fair bit. Knowing where the inversions and substitutions are (kinda like "CAGED") helps a whole lot. Here is the great Whit Smith working really hard to explain all this far meter than I can ('cos I'm still strugglng with it)
__________________
Silly Moustache, Just an old Limey acoustic guitarist, Dobrolist, mandolier and singer. I'm here to try to help and advise and I offer one to one lessons/meetings/mentoring via Zoom! |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Really interesting take on very simple chords and comping. Comping, to me, is rhythm foremost, and he really takes that pulse to a great level. Interest with the walking bass lines, but the kicker was the simple chords, mostly just three notes. I never thought of doing that!
__________________
Brian Evans Around 15 archtops, electrics, resonators, a lap steel, a uke, a mandolin, some I made, some I bought, some kinda showed up and wouldn't leave. Tatamagouche Nova Scotia. |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
Thanks for the video link and explanation! So, how does that compare to comping in Jazz guitar? Admittedly, I'm a beginner with all of this.
On a side note, is "comping" basically the same as what bluegrass rhythm players call "vamping"?
__________________
https://www.mcmakinmusic.com |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
That was a really “AHA!” Video for me. Fun to practice and play. Glad I was browsing in the archtop forum today.
|
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#8
|
|||
|
|||
Comping is short for accompaniment. It is the jazz equivalent of rhythm guitar, but improvised both harmonically and rhythmically, rather than banging out chords in a consistent pattern.
|
#9
|
|||
|
|||
Just a heads up for any western swing type jazz fans. A hidden gem of an album is 'Brisbane Bop' by Jimmy Rivers and the Cherokees. A virtual geyser of very cool western swing guitar.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2SeC0P4Ymg |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#11
|
|||
|
|||
I can't even hold a flat pick without carpet tape, but I have to say that he is a great teacher, and the producer did an ace job with the camera work.
However.......the two things I noticed above all: He needs a fret job desperately! It doesn't seem to be affecting his intonation, though. More glaring, though, is that it's one of the rare instances where I've seen a band-sawn cutaway on a factory non-cutaway guitar. That's an early 40's L-5, or was. Regards, Howard Emerson
__________________
My New Website! |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
If you want to hear more of Whit Smith’s playing, search YouTube for Hot Club of Cowtown. They are a great Western swing-ish band and put on a great show if you ever get the chance to see them.
And yeah, his chord changes can be blindingly fast.
__________________
Coupla Martins, coupla Gibsons, a few Taylors, and an Alvarez. "Always try to be nice, but never fail to be kind." Twelfth Doctor |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Also check out Leon Grizzard's Western swing videos on YouTube. They are very good.
|
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Great stuff above...though Marty's accompaniment is generally a bit more simple.
Here's a video I did a long time ago on the Ranchero style Grady licks. |
#15
|
||||
|
||||
This is awesome! Thanks for posting!
__________________
https://www.mcmakinmusic.com |