#1
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my new K&K signal chain - please critique
so a few things up front.
guitar = taylor 324 with K&K PWMini destination is a mixer with gain and 3 band eq, or sometimes my fishman loudbox artist amp. I just got the fishman platinum pro eq and like it a lot. HOWEVER, I understand and have experience with the propensity of the K&K to put out a LOT of bass and low mid, a very hot signal that can overdrive gain circuits on first place in the signal chain when played percussively, and also understand the impedence mismatch issue between the K&K and the fishman's 10 meg ohm input. So to be clear up front, I DO subscribe to the notion, based on personal experience, that the K&K impedence mismatch thing is a real cause of less-than-consistent performance and reduced ease of use for K&K, so not looking to debate whether that's a thing... so, what I'm considering is moving my MXR 10-band (which i try to keep set flat and use a quick, visual-friendly, on-the-fly adjust in gig situations) to the front of the signal chain, so that its 1 Megohm input is first in the chain. so it would look like guitar --> MXR EQ --> fishman PlatPro (FPP) --> FPP effects send to all other effects --> FPP effects return --> FPP out to board (either xlr or 1/4 inch - yet to be determined, feel free to share opinions) All critiques / ideas / opinions welcome :-) |
#2
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Doesn't the MXR EQ have a level control? If that's the case, and if you don't use the FPP's compression, then the only big advantage of having it in the signal chain would be for a signal phase inversion if needed.
Do you know the EFX boxes input impedance? If its 1 Mohm, you could try putting it directly after the guitar and before the FPP in the signal chain - presuming you can get adequate EQ control from the FPP and the MXR EQ isn't needed. FWIW, I've used the K&K PWM in the past and do indeed recall that it was noticeably less bassy with a Boss Graphic EQ (1 Mohm input impedance) than with my old 1st generation Platinum Pro EQ. |
#3
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Also: is this the MXR unit you have? https://vidweb.aws.marketlive.com/ji...uals/M108S.pdf It looks like the input impedance is even lower than you say above (470k Ohms, not 1 M Ohm). But it does have true bypass switching, so you should be able to tell right away with a few foot taps what effect it has on the signal as opposed to going direct into the Fishman. Louis Last edited by lschwart; 05-23-2018 at 09:33 AM. |
#4
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I would ditch the FPP if you are happy with what the MXR gives you in terms of control. If not, what you are suggesting is fine. I think there are also some chromatic tuners that also have 1 MOHM which might be a good first pedal in the chain.
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"Lift your head and smile at trouble. You'll find happiness someday." |
#5
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I'm trying to leverage the collective experience base and get out in front of issues I maybe don't see to shorten the learning curve and get to the rig that's going to be most likely to work in a variety of circumstances. hope that makes sense. |
#6
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the other reason I'm leaning toward the MXR rather than a tuner is that it has 18v, which my understanding is will lend a big increase in headroom. I had another really good preamp for a while that when I used it on 9v would have terrible overload bursts when I hit the bridge during aggressive playing and when I went to 18v power on it, problem solved.... |
#7
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corrrect on the input impedence, I was just being lazy about typring and 1megohm was close enough for this discsussion ;-) |
#8
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That said, I'd only do it that way if I were experiencing a real problem going direct into the Fishman. I'd expect the trim on the Fishman to give you enough control to keep big spikes from your percussing playing from overdriving the input. But if not, then try the MXR first and see. You won't set yourself up for other problems that way. Just a more complicated set up. Louis |
#9
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I wonder if you have considered a Tonedexter rather than the two boxes, if EQ and impedance matching is the concern. The Tonedexter has its own modest Eq after the Tonedexteriztion and works very well with the K&K (I say this as a shameless Tonedexter fanboy).
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2003 Martin OM-42, K&K's 1932 National Style O, K&K's 1930 National Style 1 tricone Square-neck 1951 Rickenbacker Panda lap steel 2014 Gibson Roy Smeck Stage Deluxe Ltd, Custom Shop, K&K's 1957 Kay K-27 X-braced jumbo, K&K's 1967 Gretsch 6120 Chet Atkins Nashville 2014 Gold Tone WL-250, Whyte Lade banjo 2024 Mahogany Weissenborn, Jack Stepick Ear Trumpet Labs Edwina Tonedexter |
#10
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Speaking as an electrical engineer, nothing beats trying it both ways and going with the one you like best.
It seems the EQ pedal is exactly the K&K recommendation and the Fishman pedal is roughly 10x the 1M target. But in reality neither pedal was probably tested in manufacture for that spec and given our hearing is logarithmic, 10M is not really that far off 1M (100K to 10M is logarithmic-ally in the ball park of a 1M spec). The only thing I would state categorically is a K&K will sound bad into a typical 10K ohm line input and a 3K ohm mic input.
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jf45ir Free DIY Acoustic Guitar IR Generator .wav file, 30 seconds, pickup left, mic right, open position strumming best...send to direct email below I'll send you 100/0, 75/25, 50/50 & 0/100 IR/Bypass IRs IR Demo, read the description too: https://youtu.be/SELEE4yugjE My duo's website and my email... [email protected] Jon Fields |
#11
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__________________
"Lift your head and smile at trouble. You'll find happiness someday." |
#12
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__________________
jf45ir Free DIY Acoustic Guitar IR Generator .wav file, 30 seconds, pickup left, mic right, open position strumming best...send to direct email below I'll send you 100/0, 75/25, 50/50 & 0/100 IR/Bypass IRs IR Demo, read the description too: https://youtu.be/SELEE4yugjE My duo's website and my email... [email protected] Jon Fields |
#13
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I certainly do not qualify as a super hear-er. :-).
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"Lift your head and smile at trouble. You'll find happiness someday." Last edited by martingitdave; 05-23-2018 at 02:22 PM. |
#14
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I had the 10 band EQ and sold it almost immediately. Too much hiss for my tastes.
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Website: http://www.buzzardwhiskey.com |
#15
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reducing the amount of bass you include in a K&K signal is always a good thing both for obvious bass overload feedback but also the more intermittent "wonky" low mids that can happen sometimes and not other depending on the specifics of a given venue or night. |