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Old 03-06-2018, 07:55 PM
nazump nazump is offline
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Default Aggregate Device in Mac OS

I've been using an Apogee One for a while now, and I wanted to get a second microphone to record vocals and my guitar simultaneously using separate mics. When setting up the aggregate device in audio devices, I can bind them together, but I'm only getting one microphone to record. They are both set to the same sample rate (44.1 kHz), however the Apogee One is 1 ch 24-bit integer and the Blue Yeti is 2 ch 16-bit integer. Does this make them incompatible to use together? I simply can't figure out why it's not working...

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
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Old 03-06-2018, 09:49 PM
Joseph Hanna Joseph Hanna is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nazump View Post
I've been using an Apogee One for a while now, and I wanted to get a second microphone to record vocals and my guitar simultaneously using separate mics. When setting up the aggregate device in audio devices, I can bind them together, but I'm only getting one microphone to record. They are both set to the same sample rate (44.1 kHz), however the Apogee One is 1 ch 24-bit integer and the Blue Yeti is 2 ch 16-bit integer. Does this make them incompatible to use together? I simply can't figure out why it's not working...

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
At least in the older versions of Pro Tools Native (pre Pro Tools 2018) you couldn’t combine aggregate devices with recognized interfaces. It was a limitation of the software not the hardware. You needed to choose one or the other. Haven’t tested that in the 2018 version yet. The easiest solution for a two mic setup is a two channel interface.
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Old 03-07-2018, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Joseph Hanna View Post
At least in the older versions of Pro Tools Native (pre Pro Tools 2018) you couldn’t combine aggregate devices with recognized interfaces. It was a limitation of the software not the hardware. You needed to choose one or the other. Haven’t tested that in the 2018 version yet. The easiest solution for a two mic setup is a two channel interface.
Thanks for the response! I'm using Logic Pro X and all signs point to being able to use 2 mics at once.

Do you know if the different bitrate would affect compatibility at all, assuming the software allows 2 inputs?
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Old 03-07-2018, 08:28 AM
paulp1960 paulp1960 is offline
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Bit depth is set as a general Logic Pro X setting eg. 16 bit, 24 bit.

Bit rate is set at the project level eg. 44.1 khz, 96 khz etc.

I don't think Logic Pro X will be able to record 2 inputs with different bit rates at the same time.
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Old 03-07-2018, 08:58 AM
Joseph Hanna Joseph Hanna is offline
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Yes if the Yeti and Apogee One are fixed and different bit-rates I’d guess that to be a problem. Easy enough to prove the theory though. Create a 24 bit project and see if Logic will see the Yeti as a solo device. If Logic is not willing to dither to accommodate the Yeti then you wouldn’t be able to use both mic’s/interface.
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Old 03-07-2018, 09:11 AM
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I use an aggregate mic on a mac of 2 USB micsS- a Shure MV51 and an Apogee iMIC - here are the instructions for setting it up and I did have to fiddle around to get garageband to use it, but not much, and it records two tracks, one for each mic now.

https://www.macworld.com/article/208...crophones.html
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Old 03-07-2018, 10:00 AM
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I have not used a USB mic. Nore the Apogee One

But beside the different bit rates involved


Seems to me you would want to first determine (if ) the Apogee One or the Yeti, has its own internal clock, if so then you may also encounter an unsynced clocking issue ....... unless

#1 they both use the computer's clock

#2 you can select what clock to use in the device setup menus
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Old 03-07-2018, 11:26 AM
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Wow, thanks everyone for the detailed information! I truly appreciate it. Unfortunately I still can't get it working... After trying everything below, the Yeti is still the only one getting picked up by Logic. I know the Apogee One is receiving signal as the level indicator on the device lights up when I speak into it, so I'm stumped.

For reference, here are the individual mic settings as well as the aggregate setup. Note there are two selectable Yeti microphones, but they are the same one - it appears one is just for the input and one is for the output. I've chosen the input one for all my tests.







Quote:
Originally Posted by paulp1960 View Post
Bit depth is set as a general Logic Pro X setting eg. 16 bit, 24 bit.

Bit rate is set at the project level eg. 44.1 khz, 96 khz etc.

I don't think Logic Pro X will be able to record 2 inputs with different bit rates at the same time.
I'm a novice when it comes to the terminology, so forgive me if I'm making mistakes. I believe I can choose the bitrate for each microphone at either 44.1 kHz or 48.0 kHz, but it's the bit depth that is different. The Apogee One has a depth of 24 bits and the Yeti is 16 bits (please look to the above pictures)

So since both can be set to the same bitrate, perhaps this shouldn't be a problem?

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Originally Posted by Joseph Hanna View Post
Yes if the Yeti and Apogee One are fixed and different bit-rates I’d guess that to be a problem. Easy enough to prove the theory though. Create a 24 bit project and see if Logic will see the Yeti as a solo device. If Logic is not willing to dither to accommodate the Yeti then you wouldn’t be able to use both mic’s/interface.
I don't know if I understand how to do the test you're describing.

Again, I think the bitrates can be set to the same as each other on each mic.

In Logic I see that I can change the project to 44.1, 48.0, 88.2, 96, 176.4, or 192 kHz (I've kept it in 44.1 as that's what my aggregate device is set to) seen here



As well as being able to choose recording at 24 bits seen here



I tried ticking 24 bit on and off, and both times it's only picking up the Yeti.

Quote:
Originally Posted by slide496 View Post
I use an aggregate mic on a mac of 2 USB micsS- a Shure MV51 and an Apogee iMIC - here are the instructions for setting it up and I did have to fiddle around to get garageband to use it, but not much, and it records two tracks, one for each mic now.

https://www.macworld.com/article/208...crophones.html
Thank you for sending this to me!
I actually found this online as well and that's essentially the process I tried with my mics, but since I'm using Logic the settings are a little different than in Garageband, so I can't follow it verbatim.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
I have not used a USB mic. Nore the Apogee One

But beside the different bit rates involved


Seems to me you would want to first determine (if ) the Apogee One or the Yeti, has its own internal clock, if so then you may also encounter an unsynced clocking issue ....... unless

#1 they both use the computer's clock

#2 you can select what clock to use in the device setup menus
Looking at the first two pictures I posted, each mic's clock source is set to "default." When looking at the aggregate device, I have the option of setting the clock to either the Apogee One or the Yeti and it will then tick the "drift correction" box in whichever mic isn't being used for the clock. Choosing either one still only allows the Yeti to be picked up in Logic.
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Old 03-07-2018, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nazump View Post
Wow, thanks everyone for the detailed information! I truly appreciate it. Unfortunately I still can't get it working... After trying everything below, the Yeti is still the only one getting picked up by Logic. I know the Apogee One is receiving signal as the level indicator on the device lights up when I speak into it, so I'm stumped.

For reference, here are the individual mic settings as well as the aggregate setup. Note there are two selectable Yeti microphones, but they are the same one - it appears one is just for the input and one is for the output. I've chosen the input one for all my tests.

I'm a novice when it comes to the terminology, so forgive me if I'm making mistakes. I believe I can choose the bitrate for each microphone at either 44.1 kHz or 48.0 kHz, but it's the bit depth that is different. The Apogee One has a depth of 24 bits and the Yeti is 16 bits (please look to the above pictures)

So since both can be set to the same bitrate, perhaps this shouldn't be a problem?

Again, I think the bit rates can be set to the same as each other on each mic.

I tried ticking 24 bit o and off, and both times it's only picking up the Yeti.

Looking at the first two pictures I posted, each mic's clock source is set to "default." When looking at the aggregate device, I have the option of setting the clock to either the Apogee One or the Yeti and it will then tick the "drift correction" box in whichever mic isn't being used for the clock. Choosing either one still only allows the Yeti to be picked up in Logic.
For starters I do not use Logic or an aggregate device so I may be of limited help.

As far as terminology you appear to understand the concepts and it is not a big deal but for clarity
There is bit depth (24 and 16) And then there is sample rate (44.1, 48 ,88,96.192) but there is no bit "rate"

Also for this discussion about aggregate device don't think of the the Yeti and One as microphones, what we are really discussing is the interface capabiltiy of those units


Also I do not think you are choosing the bit depth "for the microphone" You are choosing the bit depth for the Logic project



And as far as the clocking it does appear that you can select either the Yeti or the One and sinc the other to it ' which is good .

So the thing that strikes me curious and could possibly be part of the problem is the aggregate screen shot "Yeti and One" is only showing 2 outs But in the separate ones it shows the Yeti showing 2 outs and the One is showing 2 outs
So one would think the aggregate should be showing 4 outs ???
So since you are trying to bring at least 3 channels into logic it does not add up . The aggregate I would think, would have to be showing at least 3 if not 4 outputs
Again I don't know Logic But in PT there is an I/O window that shows a grid for all the possible inputs and outputs
What does the Logic I/O window show for the device/s ? it should be showing both the Yeti and One and should be showing all 4 possible outputs from the two devices .


Also I am assuming you have either one stereo and one mono channel, or 3 mono channels set up in your Logic project correct ?
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Old 03-07-2018, 03:48 PM
nazump nazump is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
For starters I do not use Logic or an aggregate device so I may be of limited help.

As far as terminology you appear to understand the concepts and it is not a big deal but for clarity
There is bit depth (24 and 16) And then there is sample rate (44.1, 48 ,88,96.192) but there is no bit "rate"

Also for this discussion about aggregate device don't think of the the Yeti and One as microphones, what we are really discussing is the interface capabiltiy of those units


Also I do not think you are choosing the bit depth "for the microphone" You are choosing the bit depth for the Logic project



And as far as the clocking it does appear that you can select either the Yeti or the One and sinc the other to it ' which is good .

So the thing that strikes me curious and could possibly be part of the problem is the aggregate screen shot "Yeti and One" is only showing 2 outs But in the separate ones it shows the Yeti showing 2 outs and the One is showing 2 outs
So one would think the aggregate should be showing 4 outs ???
So since you are trying to bring at least 3 channels into logic it does not add up . The aggregate I would think, would have to be showing at least 3 if not 4 outputs
Again I don't know Logic But in PT there is an I/O window that shows a grid for all the possible inputs and outputs
What does the Logic I/O window show for the device/s ? it should be showing both the Yeti and One and should be showing all 4 possible outputs from the two devices .


Also I am assuming you have either one stereo and one mono channel, or 3 mono channels set up in your Logic project correct ?
So I think I figured it out... If I figure anything else out I'll update it here.

I went back into the aggregate settings and did everything the same except I selected both the in and out for the Yeti, so there are "3" microphones comprising the aggregate device (but only 2 physical mics, in reality). Then in Logic when creating a new track, I chose a single track for both microphones and selected in input at 1+2. When I recorded I was getting response from both microphones, and the Apogee One was set to the Left Stereo and the Yeti was set to the Right Stereo. I then deleted that track and added 2 separate tracks. The first track I set to input 1 and the second track I set to input 2 and lo and behold, it worked! They are both recording both Left and Right.

In the current setup, the Apogee One is apparently input 1 and the Yeti is input 2. Maybe this is something I could change in the aggregate settings, but I don't really see a need to now that I've got both mics recording at the same time.

Thanks everyone for the help! I still don't completely understand everything so I'd still appreciate if this conversation went on even though it's now "solved."
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Old 03-07-2018, 04:25 PM
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i use the apogee ensemble with logic prox and have had four mics via xlr or 4 instruments via the hiz inputs utilizing the aggregate and multioutput aspects.

sometimes it may be the order in which you choose the items. i usually start with the apogee software and then open up logic. then, i can choose my aggregate and multioutput. note that i do have my multioutput set for front and/or rear monitors so that may not apply to you. i always run in 24 bit, 44.1khz.

here is an apple link that may help you set this up better, even tho you do have it working fairly well.

hope this helps.

play music!

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202000
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Old 04-11-2018, 05:32 PM
nazump nazump is offline
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Originally Posted by nazump View Post
So I think I figured it out... If I figure anything else out I'll update it here.

I went back into the aggregate settings and did everything the same except I selected both the in and out for the Yeti, so there are "3" microphones comprising the aggregate device (but only 2 physical mics, in reality). Then in Logic when creating a new track, I chose a single track for both microphones and selected in input at 1+2. When I recorded I was getting response from both microphones, and the Apogee One was set to the Left Stereo and the Yeti was set to the Right Stereo. I then deleted that track and added 2 separate tracks. The first track I set to input 1 and the second track I set to input 2 and lo and behold, it worked! They are both recording both Left and Right.

In the current setup, the Apogee One is apparently input 1 and the Yeti is input 2. Maybe this is something I could change in the aggregate settings, but I don't really see a need to now that I've got both mics recording at the same time.

Thanks everyone for the help! I still don't completely understand everything so I'd still appreciate if this conversation went on even though it's now "solved."
So I just tried recording using this method with both microphones at the same time and it was perfectly in sync. Great. But when I recorded my guitar and vocals at separate times using the two mics (yeti for guitar, apogee for vocals) the timing was crazy off. The vocals were a good .5 seconds off (from the apogee). This seems very weird to me, but I'm sure there is some scientific explanation.

Why does this happen?
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Old 04-11-2018, 09:48 PM
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So I just tried recording using this method with both microphones at the same time and it was perfectly in sync. Great. But when I recorded my guitar and vocals at separate times using the two mics (yeti for guitar, apogee for vocals) the timing was crazy off. The vocals were a good .5 seconds off (from the apogee). This seems very weird to me, but I'm sure there is some scientific explanation.

Why does this happen?
Just speculation on my part but, It sounds like there some system delay foin going on when you are doing the second take ( Perhaps because they are digital mics ?) But there should be some kind of an "Automatic Delay Compensation " option to select in Logic, that should compensate for it.
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Last edited by KevWind; 04-13-2018 at 10:06 AM.
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