What does a Cedar top guitar sound like strummed?

[RussL30]

The beautiful thing about cedar is I can get mine to sound as loud as my spruce topped guitars while not having to strum near as hard. Took some getting used to, but I absolutely love cedar now.

I’ve learned that any guitar can be strummed properly if you learn how to coax the particular guitar. I’ve missed out on several good guitars by thinking small bodies and cedar tops couldn’t be strummed from what I’ve read here. I still regret not buying a 714ce cedar top 13 years ago because I read on here cedar can’t be strummed.

[Rosewood99]

I don’t think anybody disputes that cedar can be strummed. The question is how hard can it be strummed compared to harder tone woods such as Sitka. Of course there are always are going to be exceptions depending on the builder, but in general it’s pretty much a fact that cedar doesn’t have as much headroom. That’s not to say it doesn’t have enough for your particular brand of playing.

[TDavis]

Let me say that, although I’ve never been able to bond with a Taylor guitar…due only to my tonal preferences, the one Taylor that’s gotten my attention is the 514ce…because of the Cedar top. The Cedar tends to “roll back” the treble-forward Taylor tone…softens it, and brings up the bottom end a bit. I like that! It takes medium strumming well too. Plus Cedar ages into a luscious, caramel color too. Very pretty.

[SRL]

Originally Posted by Rosewood99

Port orford Is technically not Cedar. It is a cypress.

Western red cedar is also a cypress. It's as much a cedar as Port Orford cedar. (Both are n the Cupressaceae family)

The only "true cedars" are genus Cedrus, and there are only four species in that genus, none of which are widely used for guitars.

By the way, if you like P/O Cedar, get it while you can because it's going extinct due to a blight disease.

[Steve DeRosa]

If my Avalon mini-jumbo is any indication, loud - very, very loud...

[bufflehead]

Cedar tops will mellow out a strum. That can be a good thing for an aggressive strummer. The cedar top allows me to put a bit more energy into a strum without blowing away the listener or, more importantly, overshadowing my voice.

I think that sometimes talking about cedar's "headroom" misses the point. Cedar has a different personality than sitka. I can't imagine doing without either.

[para_adams]

My cedar/rosewood Breedlove American Concert (AC25/CReH) is like sipping an extraordinarily fine wine...quieter than my adi topped dreads, but I savor every note that it creates. Finger picked or strummed, its my perfect guitar tone.

[The Bard Rocks]

Originally Posted by LakewoodM32Fan

https://www.precisebits.com/referenc...ness_table.htm

First number is Janka hardness kN (kiloNewtons), second is lbf (lbs force)

red cedar, eastern Juniperus virginiana 4.0 900
red cedar, southern Juniperus silicicola 2.7 610
red cedar, western Thuja plicata 1.6 350
Spanish-cedar Cedrela spp. 2.7 600
cedar, Alaska Chamaecyparis nootkatensis 2.6 580
cedar, atlantic white Chamaecyparis thyoides 1.6 350
cedar, Port Orford Chamaecyparis lawsoniana 3.2 720
cedar, yellow Cupressus nootkatensis 2.6 580

spruce, Engelmann Picea engelmanni 1.7 390
spruce, red Picea rubra 2.2 490
spruce, Sitka Picea sitchensis 2.3 510

So no, Taylor isn't lying, Western red cedar is indeed softer than spruce. But not all cedar guitars use WRC. In fact some, like Goodall, Ryan, Breedlove, Kinnaird, sometimes use Port Orford which is considerably harder than all three commonly used spruces.

Nice, and your point is very well taken.

But someone needs to point out that neither Port Orford or Alaskan Yellow are cedars (despite the name). They are cypress.

[12barBill]

Originally Posted by The Bard Rocks

Nice, and your point is very well taken.

But someone needs to point out that neither Port Orford or Alaskan Yellow are cedars (despite the name). They are cypress.

Originally Posted by SRL

Western red cedar is also a cypress. It's as much a cedar as Port Orford cedar. (Both are n the Cupressaceae family)

The only "true cedars" are genus Cedrus, and there are only four species in that genus, none of which are widely used for guitars.

By the way, if you like P/O Cedar, get it while you can because it's going extinct due to a blight disease.

As pointed out above.

[Shishigashira]

About a year and a half ago I had the same question about cedar tops. After some internet sleuthing I ran into Glen Hansard and his guitar named horse which is a cedar topped Takamine. Well that answered all questions I had. A lot depends on the specific guitar build, but cedar can have just as much headroom as possibly needed. I ended up getting an Eastman E2D-cedar and to my ears it's louder than my Eastman E20D with the adi top.

Anyways, here's a link to a Hansard video where he strums "Horse" and shows that a cedar top can indeed be strummed with abandon. He seems to treat that guitar about as well as his vocal chords which... well he doesn't hold back. Hope that answers the 'cedar' top for strumming question. Fast forward to right around the 2:15 minute mark where he really starts to go nuts.

[jojobean39]

Originally Posted by Shishigashira

About a year and a half ago I had the same question about cedar tops. After some internet sleuthing I ran into Glen Hansard and his guitar named horse which is a cedar topped Takamine. Well that answered all questions I had. A lot depends on the specific guitar build, but cedar can have just as much headroom as possibly needed. I ended up getting an Eastman E2D-cedar and to my ears it's louder than my Eastman E20D with the adi top.

Anyways, here's a link to a Hansard video where he strums "Horse" and shows that a cedar top can indeed be strummed with abandon. He seems to treat that guitar about as well as his vocal chords which... well he doesn't hold back. Hope that answers the 'cedar' top for strumming question. Fast forward to right around the 2:15 minute mark where he really starts to go nuts.

I saw Hansard in concert a while back. His Takamine sounded really good, despite a top that’s half gone. But then he brought out a Froggy Bottom and… oh my. The sound was incredible.

Hansard is amazing and his playing is killer.

His fellow Irish buddy Damien Rice has what I believe is a cedar topped Japanese Lowden in similar condition. He beats the crap out of that guitar and provides the best live show I’ve ever seen.

IMG_9834.jpg

[Guitarplayer_PR]

Originally Posted by Ozarkpicker

Let me say that, although I’ve never been able to bond with a Taylor guitar…due only to my tonal preferences, the one Taylor that’s gotten my attention is the 514ce…because of the Cedar top. The Cedar tends to “roll back” the treble-forward Taylor tone…softens it, and brings up the bottom end a bit. I like that! It takes medium strumming well too. Plus Cedar ages into a luscious, caramel color too. Very pretty.

Play a Taylor with a mahogany top.

[rollypolly]

Thanks for the info and video. I've heard many conflicting descriptions of cedar but I think that comes down to word choice more than anything, and probably the different bracing and build techniques that are unique to each maker. I had never tried a cedar top guitar until recently when I got an Eastman OM. It's one of their more affordable guitars but it's very solidly constructed.

I can say on that guitar the cedar lands itself somewhere between spruce and mahogany. It has some warmth and smoothness to the tone that reminds me of my OM-15. Strumming sounds just fine on it, like a spruce top guitar to my ears. I admittedly might not have the best ears for differentiating tone woods. They all usually sound good to me if the build is good.

[Eucatastrophe]

Originally Posted by rollypolly

Thanks for the info and video. I've heard many conflicting descriptions of cedar but I think that comes down to word choice more than anything, and probably the different bracing and build techniques that are unique to each maker. I had never tried a cedar top guitar until recently when I got an Eastman OM. It's one of their more affordable guitars but it's very solidly constructed.



I can say on that guitar the cedar lands itself somewhere between spruce and mahogany. It has some warmth and smoothness to the tone that reminds me of my OM-15. Strumming sounds just fine on it, like a spruce top guitar to my ears. I admittedly might not have the best ears for differentiating tone woods. They all usually sound good to me if the build is good.

Agreed! Players’ and manufacturers’ descriptions sometimes make it seem like you need to wear white gloves while playing a cedar-topped guitar. Taylor says Western Red Cedar is “a true performer for those with a lighter touch.” But what does that really mean? Anecdotal evidence often suggests cedar is best (only?) for fingerstyle.

Of course the best way to find out if Cedar is versatile enough for you is to try multiple guitars and builders

[MBee]

I have a yellow cedar Avalon that is great for gentle fingerpicking, but can really come alive with hard strumming.