New to Recording - Setup Suggestions

[natx]

Dear all,

I am looking to do some "better" quality guitar recording. I currently have a Macbook Pro and have been using the line in all along but have had quite unfavorable results (i.e. distortion when gain is set slightly higher, not vibrant enough when gain is set lower, as well as quite a handful of noise)

So I have been wondering if any of you could point me in the right direction as to what audio interface I should be using? My current setup is Guitar > LR Baggs Venue DI > Line In.

I have considered Fast Track Pro and Firewire Solo as I can get them off ebay for a good price used.

Comments? Thoughts? (= Thanks in advance guys and gals! (=

[Fran Guidry]

Originally Posted by natx

Dear all,

I am looking to do some "better" quality guitar recording. I currently have a Macbook Pro and have been using the line in all along but have had quite unfavorable results (i.e. distortion when gain is set slightly higher, not vibrant enough when gain is set lower, as well as quite a handful of noise)

So I have been wondering if any of you could point me in the right direction as to what audio interface I should be using? My current setup is Guitar > LR Baggs Venue DI > Line In.

I have considered Fast Track Pro and Firewire Solo as I can get them off ebay for a good price used.

Comments? Thoughts? (= Thanks in advance guys and gals! (=

I see two issues based on your description of your situation.

"(i.e. distortion when gain is set slightly higher, not vibrant enough when gain is set lower, as well as quite a handful of noise)"

After about 10 years of fooling with recording and reading forums on the internet, I think the single most troublesome point is recording levels. It's natural to think that our recordings should sound as loud as commercial recordings, but they don't, won't, can't, and shouldn't. Commercial recordings don't sound as loud as commercial recordings at the tracking stage. After tracking they're mixed then mastered, and both processes change the sound tremendously.

So the first thing to learn about recording - don't try to record too hot. Don't get near clipping. Leave plenty of heardroom. Sure, it will sound wimpy and "not vibrant." Our ears are not linear with respect to volume. That's why you have a volume control. Turn up the playback level.

Second issue: " My current setup is Guitar > LR Baggs Venue DI > Line In."

DI guitar is what we have to put up with to get a decent volume on stage. It's not what we use when we want to record acoustic guitar. Get a preamp and a mic (or two) and record the acoustic sound of your acoustic guitar. Or get an audio interface and a mic or two.

Fran

[natx]

Thanks for the tips! (= but what if I want to tweak the sound? I use my DI as an EQ as well. Also, what interfaces do you guys recommend and what is the advantage of firewire over USB?

Thanks!

[Fran Guidry]

You tweak your sound with software in the mixing stage.

Firewire had a big advantage over USB 1 in performance. USB 2 and FW400 are about even in performance. USB 3 hasn't happened yet and FW800 never really took off.

Firewire has been dropped from production Macs and from PC laptops as a rule.

Firewire has significant issues with poorly implemented LSI parts resulting in unreliable performance for audio connections. This has resulted in many many headaches for many many people. The usual prescription is to disable any onboard Firewire and add an adapter card known to use one of the functional chipsets. The advice is usually "get an adapter with a TI chipset" and that usually fixes things.

I've used interfaces from M-Audio, Presonus, and Echo. I prefer Echo, but they haven't entered the USB market yet, so you have to put up with Firewire to use their boxes.

Fran

[natx]

I have firewire on my Macbook Pro (FW400) so Echo is an option at this point. Any reason why Echo is "better"? Or rather why do you prefer Echo? Thanks for the tips on USB and firewire performance (and known issues)

[endpin]

I use a MOTU Ultralite with a Macbook Pro in which the audio interface is powered solely by the FIREWIRE connection. It doesn't get much simpler than this.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Fran Guidry

So the first thing to learn about recording - don't try to record too hot. Don't get near clipping. Leave plenty of heardroom.

What would be your rule of thumb for the maximum level to allow on the master bus: -4db? -6db? more?

[runamuck]

Originally Posted by moon

What would be your rule of thumb for the maximum level to allow on the master bus: -4db? -6db? more?

For recording, when using 24 bits (and you should be) -14db is good.

There is just no sense in recording hotter than that and you're not losing
any fidelity at all at 24 bits.

Jim McCarthy

[natx]

The ultralite looks really good! You've got what looks like a nice set up there dude, love the cans (=

Unfortunately I am not willing to spend so much right now and even though I am looking for a more affordable solution right now, the MOTU ultralite looks like something I am to get in eventually (=

[anton]

I have a Presonus Mobile. $250 on Ebay. its firewire bus powered, two XLR ins with Pre's, 6 more quarter inch ins. Its been working great so far. Might be worth checking out.

If you are looking for a DAW I like Reaper alot. www.reaper.fm Cant argue with the price.


Anton

[moon]

Another even cheaper but powerful DAW (no midi) is Ardour. On the Mac, you can even buy a mixbus version, a collaboration with Harrison which gives you some of the same software as used in their high-end consoles - all for only $80.

[Fran Guidry]

Originally Posted by natx

I have firewire on my Macbook Pro (FW400) so Echo is an option at this point. Any reason why Echo is "better"? Or rather why do you prefer Echo? Thanks for the tips on USB and firewire performance (and known issues)

The Echo drivers are solid and reliable on the PC, the preamps are clean and quiet and deliver plenty of gain.

Since I've only used a PC, my experience may not match yours, but the Echo has been much more trouble free and delivered better features and performance than my other FW interfaces.

Fran

[Fran Guidry]

Originally Posted by moon

What would be your rule of thumb for the maximum level to allow on the master bus: -4db? -6db? more?

I let the master take care of itself. I track around -20 dBFS RMS, so that means peaks are probably around -8 to -10 dBFS. Since almost all my stuff is solo acoustic, the whole project is one stereo track.

Fran

[gimme789]

I picked up a BOSS BR800, and it came with SONAR 8.5 LE.

http://www.bossus.com/gear/productde...ProductId=1068

It can be used standalone, or as a front end to SONAR. The SONAR program is awesome too. I have been having a lot of fun with it. I got 20% off with a MF coupon, and it is one of the coolest pieces of gear I ever bought. Highly recommended.

[Yoder]

Originally Posted by Fran Guidry

Firewire had a big advantage over USB 1 in performance. USB 2 and FW400 are about even in performance. USB 3 hasn't happened yet and FW800 never really took off.

Firewire has been dropped from production Macs and from PC laptops as a rule.

I am not sure what you mean by "production Macs?" All Mac Book Pro's, iMac's, Mac Pro's, and the Mac Mini's come with FW800. After using it for the last 18 months, all I can say is that I am hooked. FW800 (800 Mbps) is far faster than USB 2.0 (480 Mbps), has a wider band width, can travel over longer distances, and has a higher powered-bus than USB. FW800 also uses 8B10B coding that results in less signal distortion, has true plug-n-play, and you can daisy chain a very large number of devices without any problems.

The only transport that can compete with FW800 is USB 3, but it can only be found in higher-end computers and there are not many components that support it. Why FW800 is not widely used in Windows based computers can only be attributed to one thing...Firewire is an Apple technology, and Microsoft does not like to play with Apple.

Personally, I am a true believer of FW800 and will use it for years to come. I have never run into latency problems with FW, but have with some USB devices. You will find that there are plenty of quality FW interfaces out there In fact, there are more high-end FW interfaces than USB, and the video production industry lives by FW. FW just provides superior speeds/bandwidth to current USBs. FW800 is backward compatible with FW400.