Changing cr2032's on soundhole pickup

[kurth]

I recently acquired a Skysonic t-902. It's active so it has a cr2032 to power things up. It's got a similar predicament to other active soundhole pickups, in that the battery is on the bottom of the device, which makes changing it very difficult without removing the pickup completely every time a battery needs to be installed, and this requires loosening at least 3 strings. I notice many of these active soundhole pickups have the same flaw. I also noticed that Mojotone addressed this flaw by having the battery saddle on the accessible side. You'd think a switch could have been designed to prevent the battery just draining away while I sleep. ONe little button. While some active soundholes using cr2032's advertise a 1000 hours , the Skysonic gets on 105 hours , which ain't may days spent between battery changes...which is a pain in the arse. And not even considering the cost. So I've been looking for a cr2032 dummy battery. Amazon's got half the solution.....the battery holder with switch and leads but I can't find a dummy battery holder to solder the leads. Anyone else faced this small hurdle in the quest to use active soundholes with hidden batteries? I guess this puts Mojotone even higher on my list, even though I'm quite pleased with the Skysonic's tone. On sale for $50 I guess I shouldn't complain that the savings will be eaten up by buying a cr2032 every 4 days, but things are things. Even LRBaggs M1 uses a battery every month ie. every 40 days and that's still 10 batteries a year. I see one solution would be to use passive and a preamp, but that's not what I've got. thanks for any help/k

[jricc]

Hi kurth,
I don't want to state the obvious, but are you unplugging when you aren't using the guitar. Most active soundholes are turned on when you plug in, when you unplug the battery is in effect, off.

I'm thinking you know this, but in case you don't.

FWIW, my Baggs M80 and M1a both last a decent amount of time before battery changes. I'm using mine 14-17 gigs a month with no changes.

[Goat Mick]

I'm changing the cr2032's in active soundhole pickups about twice a year even after gigging 2-3 times a week. The battery only activates when a guitar chord is plugged into the guitar. Other than having a guitar cable plugged in all the time, I have no idea why you would be running through batteries so quickly.

[kurth]

Originally Posted by jricc

Hi kurth,
I don't want to state the obvious, but are you unplugging when you aren't using the guitar. Most active soundholes are turned on when you plug in, when you unplug the battery is in effect, off.

I'm thinking you know this, but in case you don't.

FWIW, my Baggs M80 and M1a both last a decent amount of time before battery changes. I'm using mine 14-17 gigs a month with no changes.

...well, I have guitars that have this type of activated jack built in, and since I'm not a M1 owner , which gets 1000 hours from their cr2032's, I didn't read the owners manual....but I now see the M1 has this circuit. That's good to know. But an activated jack wasn't mentioned in the t902 literature and I'd be hardpressed to think it has one. I'd love to be wrong, but how many cr2032's will it cost to find out ? The most prominent skysonic review says they think the battery continues to drain , only less....in his comments. And I find that hard to believe because what's to differentiate when it's being played and when it's just sittin' there? But thanks for the heads up possibility. I'll figure out a solution even if I have to solder leads to the pickup's battery saddle directly.
https://www.amazon.com/LAMPVPATH-cr2...%2C134&sr=8-33

[Rick Jones]

If you are unplugging the lead and the battery is still draining, then you are shorting to ground somewhere. I’m puzzled as to how this can happen. Doesn’t seem right at all.

If you’re unplugged, there shouldn’t be any way that the pickup is ‘on’.

[kurth]

Originally Posted by Snorse

If you are unplugging the lead and the battery is still draining, then you are shorting to ground somewhere. I’m puzzled as to how this can happen. Doesn’t seem right at all.

If you’re unplugged, there shouldn’t be any way that the pickup is ‘on’.

Reading up on the lrbags m1, it has a special endpin jack. Maybe others do as well. However I think I've discovered the downside to the skysonic t902. Sounds great for about 50 bucks, but it doesn't have an endpin jack with a switch activated by plugging in the cord, which is a pain. I'm assuming, but still open to being corrected, that the endpin would have to have some type of switch activated by the plug. We might be able to make some assumptions. One, it would require more than one wire. The M1 looks to have more than one wire cause it's got a trs connection. The t902 only has one apparent wire...for carrying signal. None for current. Is this incorrect ?

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by kurth

Reading up on the lrbags m1, it has a special endpin jack. Maybe others do as well. However I think I've discovered the downside to the skysonic t902. Sounds great for about 50 bucks, but it doesn't have an endpin jack with a switch activated by plugging in the cord, which is a pain. I'm assuming, but still open to being corrected, that the endpin would have to have some type of switch activated by the plug. We might be able to make some assumptions. One, it would require more than one wire. The M1 looks to have more than one wire cause it's got a trs connection. The t902 only has one apparent wire...for carrying signal. None for current. Is this incorrect ?

Yes, incorrect.

The automatic switching of power for an active pickup system is done by switching the battery connection for the preamp when a standard guitar cable is inserted. It has nothing to do with a TRS connection.

No manufacturer in their right mind would manufacture a pickup system that featured active electronics that did not automatically disconnect when the plug was removed from the end pin jack.

The entire Skysonic T-902 is listed on the main supplier website for $27. I can't believe anyone would consider putting this ca-ca in their guitar.

If you have somehow found some oddball system you need to replace it with something else. The concept of a battery that doesn't disconnect automatically is really beyond any reasonable comprehension.

[kurth]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

Yes, incorrect.

The automatic switching of power for an active pickup system is done by switching the battery connection for the preamp when a standard guitar cable is inserted. It has nothing to do with a TRS connection.

No manufacturer in their right mind would manufacture a pickup system that featured active electronics that did not automatically disconnect when the plug was removed from the end pin jack.

The entire Skysonic T-902 is listed on the main supplier website for $27. I can't believe anyone would consider putting this ca-ca in their guitar.

If you have somehow found some oddball system you need to replace it with something else. The concept of a battery that doesn't disconnect automatically is really beyond any reasonable comprehension.

Well your 'incorrect' might be premature. What someone might want to consider, and what someone 'needs' are usually two separate things....and, apparently 'reasonable comprehension' is a variable as well. According to this article the connection is made by connecting to ground by inserting the plug, and would need a type of connection like or similar to a trs to connect for power. I've got more than one guitar where the battery stays connected with or without having a guitar cable plugged in. These have been easily accessible 9v types, where I simply install the battery when I want to amplifier. But my suspicion about the t902 is based on two things....one , there's not multiple wires running from the jack to the device, which means there's no second circuit to engage, and two, battery drain was mentioned in the comments on the most googled video on the pickup.....which you might watch before jumping to conclusions. Of course, it's not western elite technology but it cost closer to the cost of actual materials, vs....with most western manufacturers paying 20 to 50 times the cost it actually took to fabricate it. And most likely that $27 dollars is what it cost in China, without western tariffs.

https://www.premierguitar.com/diy/gu...ar-jack-wiring

""A stereo jack is similar to a mono jack, but it's equipped with a third lug and a second (shorter) bent flange. The latter acts as a power switch for active pickup systems by connecting and disconnecting the third lug when a standard 1/4" plug is inserted or removed from the stereo jack. For example, when the black (negative) wire of a battery snap is soldered to the third lug, inserting a 1/4" plug into the jack engages the battery by connecting the negative battery wire to ground and completing the circuit.""
All those 'lugs' have separate wires so that's why I'm counting wires....thanks anyway.

[Rick Jones]

My friend, you have this completely wrong.

The M1 active (and others like it) has a TRS jack but the short tab is empty, so that you can wire a second source to it. That's why they're spec'd with a TRS jack. It's got nothing to do with battery on/off. If that were the case, you'd never see active pickups in dual source rigs like the Powertap Earth we spoke about.

The only TRS jacks that have power (rather than signal out) on the shorter lugs are for phantom power to come IN or, in the case of MiSi, to charge the batteries (still power IN).

On your pickup, there is one wire running to your jack, and it contains the live centre and the shielding around the outside.

With nothing in your jack socket, the circuit is open, and any current (including that from your battery) has nowhere to go.

That's just like when a switch is 'off', the current stops because the circuit is broken.

When you insert a jack plug into your socket, the circuit is closed, the loop completed, and the current can flow to the ground (the longest tab which is soldered to the shield portion of your pickup wire).

So from a battery-usage view, your pickup is only ON (and using battery power) when there's a plug in the socket.

There is no manufacturer that would wire your battery straight to ground, permanently on. That would be madness.

[MarkF_48]

Most of my guitars have a TRS type of jack that when the 'ring' connection is grounded by the sleeve of a TS plug it completes the battery circuit. This is probably the most common method of enabling battery power to an onboard preamp.
I did have one guitar (an Ibanez I think) that the TRS jack was wired incorrectly and it ate 9 volt batteries in a very short time.

[kurth]

ok got it thanks for your explanations. I've got an Ibanez as well that eats 9v's.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by kurth

Well your 'incorrect' might be premature. What someone might want to consider, and what someone 'needs' are usually two separate things....and, apparently 'reasonable comprehension' is a variable as well. According to this article the connection is made by connecting to ground by inserting the plug, and would need a type of connection like or similar to a trs to connect for power. I've got more than one guitar where the battery stays connected with or without having a guitar cable plugged in. These have been easily accessible 9v types, where I simply install the battery when I want to amplifier. But my suspicion about the t902 is based on two things....one , there's not multiple wires running from the jack to the device, which means there's no second circuit to engage, and two, battery drain was mentioned in the comments on the most googled video on the pickup.....which you might watch before jumping to conclusions. Of course, it's not western elite technology but it cost closer to the cost of actual materials, vs....with most western manufacturers paying 20 to 50 times the cost it actually took to fabricate it. And most likely that $27 dollars is what it cost in China, without western tariffs.

https://www.premierguitar.com/diy/gu...ar-jack-wiring

""A stereo jack is similar to a mono jack, but it's equipped with a third lug and a second (shorter) bent flange. The latter acts as a power switch for active pickup systems by connecting and disconnecting the third lug when a standard 1/4" plug is inserted or removed from the stereo jack. For example, when the black (negative) wire of a battery snap is soldered to the third lug, inserting a 1/4" plug into the jack engages the battery by connecting the negative battery wire to ground and completing the circuit.""
All those 'lugs' have separate wires so that's why I'm counting wires....thanks anyway.

Firstly, your research on TRS cables and wiring has nothing to do with how switching circuits are implemented internally to the jack itself.

What runs from the actual pickup to the jack is always a piece of shielded cable. In switched designs the shielded cable contains a third conductor that goes to a lug on the jack that grounds the battery negative to complete the circuit. The jack itself sometimes uses the "ring" connection of a standard TRS configuration, but often the jack has a separate contact point for the switching of the battery negative. This is what you'll normally find in better systems where the "ring" connection is reserved for another use such as an added microphone or accessory transducer.

Unless you've removed the outer sheath of the "wire" you're visibly observing there's no way to know how many actual conductors are inside the shielded cable.

As long as you're happy with the performance of this bargain basement system then you can address the other issues you have by buying a screw driver and ordering batteries from Amazon or get them at the dollar store.

If you're absolutely positive the pickup is designed to keep the battery connected at all times then I'd suggest spending a bit more and getting something that has actual support and operates more in line with how it should.

Since this manufacturer is so adverse to having a website to download a proper manual with an operational wiring diagram I'd just chalk it up to "Pay your money and take your chances".

[MarkF_48]

If your willing to try an experiment and the 1/4" plug will fit into the jack doing this......

Using a piece of Scotch tape, wrap a single layer of the tape around the sleeve portion of the plug just behind the insulator that separates the tip and the sleeve. Ensure there are no lifted edges of the tape. When the plug is inserted the tape will prevent the portion of the sleeve that makes contact with the ring connection of the jack thus preventing the completion of the battery circuit. The active electronics should not work if it uses the TRS jack as the means of switching the electronics on and off and you will not get sound when the other end is plugged into and amp.


If you should happen to have volt meter and a TRS cable, the voltage present at the TRS jack could also be tested as shown below with the TRS cable plugged into the guitar jack. This is a Takamine GN71CE guitar that has the negative of the 9v battery on the ring connection...

Disclaimer..... I found I have two other guitars that do not appear to have battery voltage on the TRS connection. One is fitted with a Fishman Matrix Natural with its electronics in the jack and a Tak with GT-4BII electronics. These may have a mechanical switch in the jack that senses presence of the inserted plug rather than the TRS connection. I don't believe the electronics would stay active without a 1/4" plug inserted.
I did find that my old Yamaha the 9v battery was down to 7.4v doing this check and needs to be changed .

[kurth]

The pickup itself...is excellent. Skysonic T902. I've seen they've released the T903 for $180US. That's competing with the M's and the Mojotone, and SA-6. The T902's mic sound is excellent and when you add about 1/3 to 1/2 volume of the mag, it sounds like an acoustic guitar should. I've been recording Fishman piezo's or passive mag woody's, and it's a big leap forward....for 50 dollars. I still haven't had to change the 2nd battery yet so maybe they have an active plug...which might or might not leak, which even would make this pickup easily worth the money I paid, just for the tone....finally. I'll stay away from under saddle transducer wires from now on. It's not even worth double recording with fishman presys. I did some experiments and the skysonic was a far more beautiful file to have Re-guitar and Bodilizer do their magic on. Makes me want to rerecord lots of songs.