Group equipment ownership - how do you handle it?

[Steve DeRosa]

Question for all the AGF'ers who have ever bought "group" equipment with the intention of sharing the overall expense:

My wife and I recently purchased a PA package from one of the major online dealers, with the full advance knowledge and consent of the other band members (we paid for it with our own credit card in order to take advantage of the company's warranty extension offer). There seems to be a sticking point over allocation of individual financial responsibility, whether the overall expense should be shared on an "individual" (each member contributes an equal share) or "interest" (each household foots an equal share of the bill) basis; the main arguments are:

• Individually-based contribution lessens the outlay for the two other members but leaves the two of us with a 50% share/expense;
• Interest-based contribution gives the other two members equal footing (one-third) but increases their individual outlay;

FWIW this isn't by any means a question of any member's ability to pay, and the amount in question in either case would be no more (and probably less) than the cost of dinner and drinks for two at a decent big-city restaurant...

I've done this on another occasion (as has our bass player) with no difficulties (in my own case, a simple buyout when leaving the group) and the controversy centers around one member who, although quite talented, has no real experience in the "business" end of a band; suffice it to say that things are reaching a boiling point, and with a couple commitments within the next few weeks I'm extending my diplomatic skills to the limit trying to avoid implosion...

Your experiences/suggestions...?

[Mr. Jelly]

Each band member should pay their share.

[RedJoker]

Im not sure in fully understand your question but I'll try. In other groups I've been a part of, it's individual. If two individuals happen to be married, that doesn't enter into it.

Does that make sense?

[buddyhu]

If I were in your band, and you hadn't floated the idea of the cost being split per household, I wouldn't be quite surprised to hear that you thought that was the way things were to be done. I would have been assuming the cost would be split per individual in the band. That doesn't mean it's the correct way to do it...just sharing what I would have assumed.

[Tele1111]

Hey Steve,

Amazon may recognize your “household”, but in my experience it doesn’t exist in a band situation.

Each member of the group foots an equal share.

Mark

[Golffishny]

If the others are unwilling or unable to help cover the cost, maybe get a cut of your gig $ for the equipment rental?

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by Steve DeRosa

Question for all the AGF'ers who have ever bought "group" equipment with the intention of sharing the overall expense:

My wife and I recently purchased a PA package from one of the major online dealers, with the full advance knowledge and consent of the other band members (we paid for it with our own credit card in order to take advantage of the company's warranty extension offer). There seems to be a sticking point over allocation of individual financial responsibility, whether the overall expense should be shared on an "individual" (each member contributes an equal share) or "interest" (each household foots an equal share of the bill) basis; the main arguments are:

• Individually-based contribution lessens the outlay for the two other members but leaves the two of us with a 50% share/expense;
• Interest-based contribution gives the other two members equal footing (one-third) but increases their individual outlay;

FWIW this isn't by any means a question of any member's ability to pay, and the amount in question in either case would be no more (and probably less) than the cost of dinner and drinks for two at a decent big-city restaurant...

I've done this on another occasion (as has our bass player) with no difficulties (in my own case, a simple buyout when leaving the group) and the controversy centers around one member who, although quite talented, has no real experience in the "business" end of a band; suffice it to say that things are reaching a boiling point, and with a couple commitments within the next few weeks I'm extending my diplomatic skills to the limit trying to avoid implosion...

Your experiences/suggestions...?

Well basically what you are talking about are the typical issues that can be associated with " partnerships"

And if I understand your question correctly then the answer should be fairly simple, based on gig revenue split.
If your wife and you take home 50% of the gig revenues, than you should pay 50% of the equipment purchase and maintenance costs.
If you take home 1/3 then 33% of the costs should be your equipment liability. Even a novice in business should get that simple concept.

[PorkPieGuy]

I've bought group band equipment before, but we did it a really, really crazy way - we played a lot of really crummy gigs, never paid ourselves, saved our money, and bought EVERYTHING in cash. We never went into debt for anything. I'd rather pay more and be debt free and miss "a deal" as opposed to taking on debt. In regards to whatever happened to that band equipment, no members ever left; we simply dissolved for about a half dozen reasons all at once (very long story). When we broke up, we sold it as one big lot and divided the money 4 ways. It was easy.

Ever since then, I've simply bitten the bullet and bought the PA gear. Let me tell you, sometimes it really sucks being the PA guy AND the drummer, but I do what I gotta do to play music, so it's worth it to me. Everyone in my band knows that it's their responsibility to provide whatever equipment it takes to get their own signal(s) to the PA, and I'll take care of the rest.

I'm not trying to beat you up here (and I'm sorry if it came across that way), but musicians are a flaky bunch. I mean, the current band I'm in has been together for 2.5 years now, and although things are going well, I've been around long enough to know that our band could break up before the end of the day due to circumstances beyond anyone's control. You never know when it's going to end. I've seen waaay too many bands break up whenever there's debt involved, and believe me when I say that it turns into a huge mess. There was one local band who broke up that had quite a bit of debt, and unfortunately, A LOT of their debt was tied up in merch. I think they literally had a crate full of t-shirts, CDs, posters, etc., and they were never getting their money back. I've seen another band that was a national act decide that they were going to buy their own touring vehicle and trailer. They broke up, and guess what? Thousands and thousands of dollars in debt and no income.

If it were me in your situation, I'd just plan on buying the PA myself. From your post, it doesn't sound like everyone was on your same page whenever you bought it (either that or I've misread it or misunderstood it). Or maybe they've changed their mind after you've bought it. In any case, if you got a deal as good as you said you did, well, then you got a good deal, so maybe it wouldn't be that bad just to make the payments yourself. While you may be able to argue that it's everyone's responsibility, on paper this is your debt that you are going to have to deal with.

I've always thought in my head that I'm going to be playing music either with or without my current band, and I'm really tired of buying and selling PA gear. I found a great deal on Craigslist years ago on a used PA, bought it, and I have no regrets. If we break up tomorrow, no big deal. I keep the PA, and wait for the next band to come along. No pressure to sell anything.

I hope that this works out!

[Big Band Guitar]

I played in different bands for 55 years.

For ten years in a party band there was no "band" equipment. Everyone supplied what they used. The PA was owned by the keyboard player. When the band faded away there was no problems and no hard feelings.

When I was part of a Trio for ten years I owned the PA all the microphones, and the bass amp. Again when the trio faded away there was no issues and no hard feelings. Pay was split equally but a little from each gig was put aside for postage, promotion, web site, and so on.

So if you bought the PA just own it. It will save a lot of hard feelings later on.

[jojobean39]

If you can and if it suits you, I’d just buy the PA equipment myself. That way, it’s always yours. Because it does suck if you break up... then how do you divide the assets?

But if it is something that was discussed, then I’d suggest by band member share. Someone mentioned earlier- if you take home 25% of the revenue, then you pay 25%. Outlay should equal your share.

If you guys were flying to a gig, married members wouldn’t get away with buying one plane ticket.

As to my earlier statement... if you break up, who gets the equipment?

[RustyAxe]

None of the gear in either of my two band my bands are owned in common, all are owned by individuals. You're already getting pushback and differing opinions of how things are split up. One might not see the issue of common ownership ... until the band breaks up, and one member wants to "redeem" his share of ownership ... or you replace a member with someone new and he refuses to chip in. I'd refuse to participate flat out ... I've already invested thou$and$ in my instruments and gear.

Just don't do it.

[Big Band Guitar]

Originally Posted by RustyAxe

None of the gear in either of my two band my bands are owned in common, all are owned by individuals. You're already getting pushback and differing opinions of how things are split up. One might not see the issue of common ownership ... until the band breaks up, and one member wants to "redeem" his share of ownership ... or you replace a member with someone new and he refuses to chip in. I'd refuse to participate flat out ... I've already invested thou$and$ in my instruments and gear.

Just don't do it.

Exactly how I see it.

[Basalt Beach]

Originally Posted by KevWind

And if I understand your question correctly then the answer should be fairly simple, based on gig revenue split.
If your wife and you take home 50% of the gig revenues, than you should pay 50% of the equipment purchase and maintenance costs.
If you take home 1/3 then 33% of the costs should be your equipment liability. Even a novice in business should get that simple concept.

This^^^^^

In order to answer your question, how is the gig money split which the band plays? Is it by household or by individual member? However the gig money is distributed should be the basis for splitting the cost of equipment. Just my thoughts.

[Long Jon]

Surely your record company should pony up for ALL your gear, tour bus/plane, promotion, crew, security, all per-diems and other expenses ?

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Mr. Jelly

Each band member should pay their share.

This. The household doesn’t come into it, unless gig proceeds are divided in the same way.