String Quest for my RainSong Shorty

[moondoggie999]

This started as part of the Martin Monel strings on a Rainsong thread but I wanted to add some more strings into the mix and it felt like I'd be hi-jacking that thread.

I got my Shorty last year sometime and kept the original Nanoweb 80/20 lights on it for months, and then bought another pack of the same and used that for a few months.

I had had good luck with Martin Retro Monels on my arch-top (Tony Rice mediums) so I decided to try those for awhile but in the lights (12's) and compare it to the Nanoweb 80/20's. The Monels had wonderful tone, so much more fundamental sound than the Elixirs (to my ear) but after a couple weeks, I noticed that I was missing that acoustic jangle chimey high end component that I wanted to hear and no matter how hard I hit those Monels, they felt "topped out" to me. So I tried the Martin SP Phosphor Bronze lights and that was the sound I was looking for.

I made a video comparing all three strings...

https://youtu.be/gjIeve2btEU



I had also tried the D'Addario EXP PB lights and the Elixir Nanoweb PB lights during this process but I didn't gel with either of those two sets. The EXP's had a bizarre clanging noise/tone and the Nano PB's had a kinda boxy tone. That's to my ear, so hopefully that doesn't offend anyone, but I knew that wasn't gonna work for me.

I thought the SP's were going to be the string to keep for awhile but I had noticed during my use of the Monels and SP's that my forearms were hurting, especially on my fretting hand. I have played Elixirs almost exclusively for the last few years and I think because of how easy the Elixirs are to play and how little finger squeak there is, I got used to playing in a certain way that the Elixirs allow. Switching over to non-coated strings caused me to really have to adjust my technique back to dealing with string/finger noise and my forearms were/are feeling the results.

So today I bought and installed some Elixir Polyweb 80/20 lights to see how my forearms and ears like the switch away from the Martin SP's. My hope was that the Polyweb 80/20's would be a little less high end crunch compared to the Nanoweb 80/20's and to my ears they are. I'll leave these on for awhile but in the meantime, I ordered some interesting coated strings to try:

Wyres Phosphor Bronze coated lights
Rotosound Nexus PB lights
DR "Black Beauties" Black coated PB lights

The plan is to do another video comparing this latest batch of strings. I'm hoping to find a coated string I really like and if not, I'm just gonna have to bite the bullet and deal with uncoated (and correct my coated string sloppiness haha - ugh - sigh)

So I thought a few of you might be interested in these comparisons, too.

[Finger Stylish]

I have tried many sets in the 2 years I've had my H DR1000.
Currently (2 weeks now) I'm playing the Retro's 12-54's. I still like the personality it gives my guitar, with one exception, and that is a sympathetic howl I get at times on the open A, which didn't happen until about 10 hours into the strings.
My string search has brought me full circle on 3 occasions, bringing me back to the Polywebs 12-53, and the Ernie Ball med-Light EarthWoods 12-54(straight bronze)
Strings I have tried:
Nanowebs 12-53
Polywebs 12-53
Martin Retro 12-54
D'Addario PB 12-53
D'Addario Bluegrass 12-56
Tony Rice Monels 13-56
Ernie Ball EarthWoods 12-54
Ernie Ball PB slinky 12-54
John Pearse Nickle
The ones in Red are my 2 go to's.
My local Best Buy stocks D'Addario-EJ16's, Elixier- Nano & Poly's, and Ernie Ball at very low prices which is a plus that I don't have to order them if I need em quickly.

[sirwhale]

Please try the:

Ernie Ball Earthwood Silk and Bronze "soft" -Gauges .011 .015 .022w .030 .042 .052

Tension is great for me, not too much, not too little

and let me know what you think of them on carbon fibre

[Finger Stylish]

Originally Posted by sirwhale

Please try the:

Ernie Ball Earthwood Silk and Bronze "soft" -Gauges .011 .015 .022w .030 .042 .052

Tension is great for me, not too much, not too little

and let me know what you think of them on carbon fibre

Thank you for the suggestion. Just ordered a set & I will try them

[AZLiberty]

My Shorty shipped with 80/20 Elixir Nanowebs.

I liked them, but there were a bit to "tinny" for my taste. Tried EXP 16's which I like on all my rosewood instruments and decided that they were a bit too dark and quiet on the Shorty.

Hmmn. Broke down and bought an expensive set of Elixir Phosphor Bronze, just right. I guess I'll just have to live with their nasty habit of shredding.

[moondoggie999]

So I just took the Polywebs off today and installed the DR Black Beauties. My initial impressions of the DR's are not great but its early. Did you ever play those black colored Nylon strings when you were learning guitar? They were sort of a low tension student model nylon string? OK, initially these Black Beauties have a plastic feel and sound to them that remind me of those black nylon treble student string sets. The low E string has less bass response than the Elixirs and when pushed with some hard strumming, there is an overall plastic sound to the set. To the touch, with the coating, they almost feel like nylon, with some similar sound characteristics (lower volume, don't really like being strummed hard) I will keep them on for at least a week and see how they break in.

I do have to say the DR Black Beauties LOOK so cool with the Black Shorty they are easy to play but a bit more finger squeak than the Polywebs, in fact, the coating initially seems to be grabbing my fingers/tips. Interesting to note, the black coating is also present on the trebles and it is kinda rough feeling.

OK thats all the initial impressions, more in a week or two... (and yep, I'll do a comparison vid between all these strings)

Edit - day2 with DR- last night I was ready to rip these black beauties off they sounded like a cheap kids toy from Walmart. This morning enough settling in time and they have changed a bit so I will leave them on for awhile but that first day was really bad wow lol. They still remind me of nylon strings in feel and sound quite a bit but not so much in a bad way now. More almost like Savarez not so much like black treble student models.

Edit 4/22/15: Got the comparison recording done for Black Beauties (still reminded me of nylon strings and for some applications that might be just what the doctor ordered but not quite what I am looking for) and installed the Wyres (PTFE coated PB's) today - initial impression is a little on the quiet/dark side (compared to SP's) but a nice tonal character

Edit -day2 with Wyres- interestingly the darkness is less noticeable (almost seems to come and go? Weird) as they have brightened up some but not quite as bright as elixirs. They are on the soft side both in volume and feel. If the Martin SP's were on the bold robust side of the scale, these Wyres could be described as gentle sounding with lots of subtle almost sophisticated tonal character, a soft complex warmth. Very interesting.

Edit 4/24/15 Got the Wyres recordings done and installed the RotoSound Nexus strings. Wow what a different sound, I can only describe it as a dry open woody sound, very cool tone. To the touch, they feel like Nanowebs but you cannot see the coating. They do not seem to be equivalent in volume to the Elixirs but I could be mistaken, maybe only slightly less volume, I think these would be my coated string of choice instead of Elixirs, so much better balance wise, much more well rounded tone compared to Elixirs. The website says these are a coated version of RotoSounds Jumbo Kings which I have never played but it might be interesting to compare the two (coated and uncoated) will do the recording in a few days after they settle in.

~

[drjond56]

I don't have a Shorty, but on my studio parlor, after much trial and error, I have come to prefer D'Addario 80/20 EXP New York Steel strings. Of coated strings I have used Elixir, DR, and Black Diamond, and I like these D'Addarios the best. I really can't say what is different about the "New York Steel" compared to prior EXPs but I like the sound better.

Jon

[moondoggie999]

OK, got the video done and posted

https://youtu.be/FWytU5tRUHA



Quick thoughts:

I did like the polywebs better than the nano's.
The DR's were like nylon strings in feel and sound, not quite what I was after.
The Wyres were good, if a touch on the quiet side.
The RotoSound Nexus were excellent with a unique tonal character, almost a dry woody open sound.
Ended up with the Martin SP's on again to compare after hearing all these other strings, want to see how long they'll last for me and then put on a set of SP LifeSpans to compare longevity.

SP's still seem like the best fit for me at this point.

Looking to try the Nexus' on my Breedlove as possible replacement for the EXP's.

[Finger Stylish]

They all had a sound that was nice. Depending on the style you demonstrated was how I judged them. I liked each of them better than the others depending on the style.
That said, I've had Polywebs on my Rainsong more times than any other brand, and in your demo, I seemed to prefer them the least across the whole spectrum you demonstrated.
To me the Martin SP's sounded similar to the Polywebs.
The poly's and the SP's sound reminded me of an Ovation sound.

I appreciate the time and effort you're putting into these.

[steelvibe]

Thanks so much Moondog for the excellent review. I watched the whole thing with avid interest (fellow Shorty owner here). Your assessment is pretty spot on with mine. I listened to the test samples with a pair of noise reduction Skullcandy headphones that aren't the best in the world but are $65 dollar headphones- not too shabby either.

I liked the Wyres! I couldn't believe the great tone coming off of them in all styles of play, and they particularly shined in strumming and fingerstyle. I felt that the strings were best in note separation and also had great balance with a bright/ warm tone. I will buy a set and try them out based on this review alone.

The SPs sounded great and would be my second pick I think you will really like the Lifespans when you try them out, they feel really nice under the fingers but the guages are a bit weird (I think the E and D are just a tad heavier than standard lights and this may have been true on the SP set that you tried here).

The runner up to these 2 were the polywebs. The Shorty is supposed to pair up nicely with the polys, bringing down the inherent brightness of the guitar. I've yet to try them on my Shorty but have had them on my Breedlove. I have mixed feelings about Elixir- they are a bit expensive and I think there are strings that offer better tone overall at a lower cost.

I didn't care for the DR BBs- too muddy and compressed for my tastes, even if that is a good thing to tame the Shorty. The Rotos seemed the same way but had a bit more going for them tone wise- just like you said though, interesting and dry. Not necessarily a bad thing.

Thanks for a great post!

[moondoggie999]

Finger stylish, I agree, the SP's and Polys have similar tone. I think the SP's edge out the Polys by being a little better balanced and a touch more projection. But I could live with either. I'm going to leave this set of SPs on til they die. I'm kinda curious to see how long they last.

Steelvibe, I LOVED the Wyres sound, it was this complex warmth, so much character! Would you like me to mail you my set? They were on for no more than a week. I ordered mine from Elderly. Be happy to send you this set, I took them off as gently as I could. They are cut to "Shorty Size" and I always use lots of wraps so it should work... Just PM me your shipping address if interested.

You know, to go along with a comment someone made on YouTube to these videos, they said the Carbon Fiber guitars, perhaps more so than wood, are much more sensitive to different strings, well I just put the RotoSound Nexus, that were on the Shorty for this test, onto my Breedlove. Not only do I NOT hear the same characteristics that I noticed when on the Rainsong, but these Nexus strings sound so much like the EXP's did (the EXPs are the stock strings from Breedlove and I've been using them for years on this guitar) I'm not sure I could tell the two sets apart. I guess the clarity of Carbon Fiber really makes the subtle differences readily apparent.

[steelvibe]

Originally Posted by moondoggie999

Be happy to send you this set, I took them off as gently as I could. They are cut to "Shorty Size" and I always use lots of wraps so it should work... Just PM me your shipping address if interested.

That is super kind of you Moondog. Thing is, I have more strings that I know what to do with myself- including some Wyres that I have on the way! I should be sending you strings

I've always wanted to ask you how you were bonding with the Shorty. I love the tone of my Breedlove but have found the neck to be just too cramped up in the first position- part of the reason that I really like the Shorty is because of the neck (although it did take some getting used to). Tone wise it sounds amazing too, even though I always will have a love of wood acoustics. Rainsongs just have a unique voice, and stand out even in the carbon fiber world.

[moondoggie999]

Oh heck I love this shorty! Can sit and play for hours and no pain. I think they key for me is classical guitar size, short scale neck, 12 frets, cutaway, and no wood worries. Still have the other guitars to finish up current CD and then I'll sell most everything off except the shorty. Tone wise, I was amazed from the start and even happier now to find a set of strings that I really gel with, I feel truly lucky and inspired.

The Breedlove for me was a great guitar but I still had some issues ergonomically (even tho it's not a large guitar). I started on classical, went thru a couple BIG guitars (Tak and Gibson) then Breedlove and even some classical guitars again but I love steel strings, you know? So for me the shorty is really where I'm at these days.

Well maybe I'll try the Wyres on my little Gibson

[Finger Stylish]

Originally Posted by moondoggie999

Oh heck I love this shorty! Can sit and play for hours and no pain. I think they key for me is classical guitar size, short scale neck, 12 frets, cutaway, and no wood worries. Still have the other guitars to finish up current CD and then I'll sell most everything off except the shorty. Tone wise, I was amazed from the start and even happier now to find a set of strings that I really gel with, I feel truly lucky and inspired.

The Breedlove for me was a great guitar but I still had some issues ergonomically (even tho it's not a large guitar). I started on classical, went thru a couple BIG guitars (Tak and Gibson) then Breedlove and even some classical guitars again but I love steel strings, you know? So for me the shorty is really where I'm at these days.

Well maybe I'll try the Wyres on my little Gibson

Yep; RainSongs are amazing.
I also liked those Wyres on your test vid.
My next strings to test will be the ErineBall Silk & Steel 80/20 Bronze, but 1 month in and I can find no reason to remove the Retro's. They seem to be sounding better, and I love the way they bend.

[moondoggie999]

Well the SP's seem to have gone dead. That's about 6 weeks since I put them on. I'll put some SP lifespans on next and see how long they go for.

Two odd things about my shorty - first is that the strings lay on top of the truss rod cover. This seems to be the norm due to how low Rainsong sets the action. No problem, just a little different than what I'm used to. Second thing, two of the bridge pins holes are slightly larger than the other four and the bridge pins fall out of the hole. Again no problem, used that as an excuse to order some ebony pins with a mother of pearl dot surrounded by a gold colored circle (Parisian Eye) Did have to slightly enlarge all the bridge pin holes to accommodate the ebony pins but now none fall out if I turn the guitar over.

In other customization: had a friend/luthier dye the nut and saddle a dark black (like the new Smokey) and also "engraved" the truss rod cover. I ordered some Gotoh tuners in gold color with ebony tuner buttons that should arrive in 4 to 6 weeks. Will post a pic then of the finished look.