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  #46  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:44 PM
carl365 carl365 is offline
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Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
I don't see any problem with learning new chords as you go...at least until you're comfortable branching out...learning a thousand shapes in a vaccuum without context isn't going to get you too far anyway.

But I still think the end goal, somewhere down the line, for a serious player should be to learn how to build chords from the major scale/formulas. Once you can do that, you can literally say that you know how to play EVERY chord...and every place that chord "lives" on the neck!
I think your right mr. beaumont, I've got most of the "cowboy chords" down fairly well including half a dozen of the maj7's, at least well enough to accompany singing and changing chords without losing a beat and not have any buzzes or dead strings. (most of the time anyway!)

As you say, I'm delving into the construction of chords to give me a better understanding how they are made.

I heard the mention of barre chords earlier in the thread so, I tried it out last night and while the fingering is not too difficult, I find getting all the strings to ring clear is something else yet, so, I'll put the barre chords priority in my practice.

Thanks all!
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  #47  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:46 PM
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HI folks...
One of the main differences between learning as you go on one's own versus getting into lessons or a system is the tendency to drift along against deliberately moving forward with a purpose.

If all one does is collect a few chords as he/she progresses, once they collect enough skill to 'get by' and play a few songs, that is where they settle in.

My main clients as an intermediate/advanced fingerstyle teacher are players who have hit the wall and don't know where to go next, and where they are deficient is almost always in chord knowledge, arranging, knowledge of the fingerboard, and melody/harmony/chord structure.

I didn't overlook the fact the original poster said he'd been playing only a couple months. I expect lots from beginners because they are often adventurous and have big ideas!

Within the first 4 lessons even my beginner students can play 25 chords and are painlessly on their way to learning/using barre chords and inside chords. And none of them hate B7th either.

They are also playing full chords at the 9th fret by the second lesson, and they are using what they are playing.


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  #48  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:57 PM
shawlie shawlie is offline
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I agree with the approach of knowing as many as you need to play the things you want. If you use a capo, you could probably get by for a long time with the major, minor and a few 7th chords in a few keys - depending on the music you play.

And anyway, what's in a name after all. You play an Am chord - add a finger or take one off, or put the C or E in the bass, etc. They all have different names (and each of those fingerings might have a few different names, at different times). And it'll be the same idea for other chords, either adding or subtracting, depending on what you want and what's possible. Eventually they may not actually resemble the fingering in chord books (it'll be your own stuff, own fingering) and you'll find lots of handy ways to do what you want.
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  #49  
Old 01-25-2012, 01:23 PM
mr. beaumont mr. beaumont is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ljguitar View Post
HI folks...
One of the main differences between learning as you go on one's own versus getting into lessons or a system is the tendency to drift along against deliberately moving forward with a purpose.

If all one does is collect a few chords as he/she progresses, once they collect enough skill to 'get by' and play a few songs, that is where they settle in.

My main clients as an intermediate/advanced fingerstyle teacher are players who have hit the wall and don't know where to go next, and where they are deficient is almost always in chord knowledge, arranging, knowledge of the fingerboard, and melody/harmony/chord structure.

I didn't overlook the fact the original poster said he'd been playing only a couple months. I expect lots from beginners because they are often adventurous and have big ideas!

Within the first 4 lessons even my beginner students can play 25 chords and are painlessly on their way to learning/using barre chords and inside chords. And none of them hate B7th either.

They are also playing full chords at the 9th fret by the second lesson, and they are using what they are playing.



This is how I teach as well...if someone comes to me wanting structure--they're going to get it!

I got barre chords back at my first guitar lesson. My teacher said, "never too soon to start working on these now."

I understand not every player wants/needs that structure, but in a private lesson format, that's what they're getting... on an internet forum, I sometimes catch myself and remember that we've got everything here from pros to those who play three chord tunes to their kids and dogs, and both are part of what's great about guitar playing...
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  #50  
Old 01-25-2012, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by carl365 View Post
I think your right mr. beaumont, I've got most of the "cowboy chords" down fairly well including half a dozen of the maj7's, at least well enough to accompany singing and changing chords without losing a beat and not have any buzzes or dead strings. (most of the time anyway!)

As you say, I'm delving into the construction of chords to give me a better understanding how they are made.

I heard the mention of barre chords earlier in the thread so, I tried it out last night and while the fingering is not too difficult, I find getting all the strings to ring clear is something else yet, so, I'll put the barre chords priority in my practice.

Thanks all!
Hi Carl…
Printing it off as a resource is a great thing to do.

Let me pass on something I learned and use; it came from one of my beginner students which she taught me during a lesson (and didn't realize it).

I caught her switching back-n-forth and back-n-forth and back-n-forth between the fingerings for a D and A without playing anything with the strumming hand. I watched her for a couple minutes and then asked what she was doing and she said "When I only have to worry about one hand, I learn to switch better."

The light went on in my head, and I now use this frequently personally to build muscle memory for switching chords - especially for difficult or awkward switches which are not intuitive, and for teaching others as well…

............D........................A...........



One thing I immediately saw is the 1st finger doesn't even have to move…

This is a less conventional (but highly useful) fingering for an A major chord (feel free to add it to your chord library).



Hope this helps…


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Last edited by ljguitar; 01-26-2012 at 07:36 AM. Reason: added label
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  #51  
Old 01-25-2012, 10:44 PM
carl365 carl365 is offline
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Thanks for the neat tips Larry, yes that's a interesting way from D to A, a little easier than squeezing all three fingers for the A. And concentrating on the left hand muscle memory only is something I'll incorporate too.

I have this great program called Fireshot for Firefox that captures any screen image and text, (even when sites have the right click/copy function disabled) a portion or whole scrollable page with two clicks. Makes gathering info quick for later viewing.

Thanks again!
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  #52  
Old 01-26-2012, 08:55 AM
AirWolf AirWolf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carl365 View Post
I know this is a very broad question but how many chords does the typical accomplished player know? or, do they add chords as they need them?
Really accomplished players can improvise their own chord voicings on the spot. This is very uncommon though.

In the beginning the best thing to do is work on learning some songs you like. If there is an unknown chord in the song, use that as a motivator to work on learning the unknown chord(s).

EDIT: That fingering for the A chord shown above is THE BEST (most comfortable and easiest) I've seen... Someone showed me this on Monday.
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  #53  
Old 01-26-2012, 09:58 AM
slinco slinco is offline
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.................

Last edited by slinco; 08-02-2012 at 07:37 AM.
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  #54  
Old 01-26-2012, 10:42 AM
EnglishGuy EnglishGuy is offline
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Hi Slinco.
errrr. So a 60 year old is unlikely to have an enquiring mind? More concerned with the time when the nurse will bring the next meal? Or looking to the tutor to wipe the dribble from his chin?
Mebbe Springsteen will be looking for a guy of similar age to himself if Nils Lofgren can't make a couple of gigs on the next world tour and this 60 year old might be the chosen one if only he practises his chords. Give the guy a break!
Let these wrinklies be taught I say.

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  #55  
Old 01-26-2012, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AirWolf View Post
...EDIT: That fingering for the A chord shown above is THE BEST (most comfortable and easiest) I've seen... Someone showed me this on Monday.
I AWolf...
It's one of 2-3 fingerings I use for A may - and my default.

I thought I invented it 35 years ago when I was teaching fingerstyle, and then I was looking at an 1835 book of guitar instruction and found it listed as the fingering for A. Nothing new under the sun... as a very wise man said once.


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  #56  
Old 01-26-2012, 11:50 AM
mc1 mc1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ljguitar View Post
Nothing new under the sun... as a very wise man said once.
and even he stole that line from somebody else...
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  #57  
Old 01-26-2012, 12:52 PM
slinco slinco is offline
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.............

Last edited by slinco; 08-02-2012 at 07:55 AM.
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  #58  
Old 01-26-2012, 01:22 PM
mr. beaumont mr. beaumont is offline
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Originally Posted by slinco View Post

I guess what surprised me so much about the comments from the teachers in this thread is that no one asked the OP anything about himself or what he wanted to do with the guitar.
Because the OP asks how many chords does/should an accomplished player know?

To me, that alludes to the type of player that wants to know more than how to strum a few three chord tunes around a campfire.
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  #59  
Old 01-26-2012, 01:26 PM
mc1 mc1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
Because the OP asks how many chords does/should an accomplished player know?
...
and how many of us answered that question?

maybe i'll go through and count, but i bet the answer is about a handful.
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  #60  
Old 01-26-2012, 02:06 PM
architype architype is offline
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You need to learn as many as you need. The longer you play, the more you will need.
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