Do you learn songs on guitar faster with experience?

[dltw]

In your time playing guitar, from when you're starting out till now, has your learning of a new song become faster as you gained more experience?

I understand that it can be a complicated question, since so many factors are involved, such as time, effort, skill level, equipment, professional/amateur roles, music education, type of music, etc.

So if all things were equal, ie same amount of time/effort/knowledge, an experienced guitarist must be able to learn any song quickly. What do you think?

[Tico]

Yes, of course.

[DukeX]

Yes, you get "better" at it but you also start playing more difficult songs/instrumentals. So, for me, "gets easier" is a misnomer.

[donlyn]

Exactly. The easy ones are yesterday's work, and the hard ones just keep getting harder. Sometimes you just don't notice how much better you've gotten.

Don
.

[FormerFoodie]

Originally Posted by DukeX

Yes, you get "better" at it but you also start playing more difficult songs/instrumentals. So, for me, "gets easier" is a misnomer.

+1

This is exactly how I view it.

[Rinaz]

I do.......... ten characters

[zmf]

Originally Posted by Tico

Yes, of course.

Another yes, of course.

[Ed66]

Originally Posted by donlyn

Exactly. The easy ones are yesterday's work, and the hard ones just keep getting harder. Sometimes you just don't notice how much better you've gotten.

Don
.

Excellent synopsis! I think if you're moving in the right direction, you're always trying something more difficult. Sometimes, you may not realize what you've selected to try is easier than you think and you rapidly move forwards. That's when you get to sit back and grin.

[Wade Hampton]

Dltw, learning new songs definitely becomes easier and faster the more practiced at the process you become. You increase “the vocabulary of your hands,” so to speak, the more often you put together different chord combinations in different sequences.

That’s what I call it, anyway: “I’ve got to get this song into my hands before I play it in public this weekend,” is often how I phrase it when I learn a new piece, especially a challenging one that requires chord voicings and different passages than I’m used to.

Of course, if you’re a vocalist, as well, as I am, then you have to get the words in your head and be able to sing them while you’re playing the accompaniment or melodic passages. Many, perhaps most of the musician friends I have seem to have more difficulty remembering lyrics than I do: for me learning the words is the easy part and always has been. I’m certain that that’s a major reason why I eventually became a front man when in bands and a solo act when I decided I wanted to make an actual living from playing music: I was the guy who always knew a lot of songs because I could remember all the verses, not just the first verse and chorus.

You’re going to need to find your own path to learning more songs, which won’t necessarily be anything like mine. But rest assured, the more songs you learn and the more practice you get at adding to your repertoire, the easier it becomes.

That’s not saying that unfamiliar chord patterns and chord forms you haven’t played before automatically become as easy as falling off a log, but the more you do this the more you’ll “get these songs in your hands” because you’ll have more and more of these processing skills that you haven’t acquired yet.

Short version: the more songs you learn, the more structural similarities you’ll see between one song and the next, the more facile at the process and the more strategic you’ll become in how you approach the task each time you learn a new song.

Hope that makes sense.


Wade Hampton Miller

[ssynhorst]

Experience will contribute to learning. But if it is simple mindless repetition it will be slow. There are mindful, intelligent, organized ways to learn that are very much faster. A local teacher may or may not know much about them. I think it is better to look into the methods yourself and make a smart decision about which path to take.

To start I suggest you take a look at classicalguitarshed.com. It is not just about classical music, though that is the most thoroughly studied, it is about how to learn how to learn, how to study, how to practice. You can branch off from there to the kind of music you want to learn.

Making music has been studied by great minds for centuries; you do not have to go your own way all alone. There is a lot of help out there; find it. - Stevo

[dltw]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Dltw, learning new songs definitely becomes easier and faster the more practiced at the process you become. You increase “the vocabulary of your hands,” so to speak, the more often you put together different chord combinations in different sequences.

That’s what I call it, anyway: “I’ve got to get this song into my hands before I play it in public this weekend,” is often how I phrase it when I learn a new piece, especially a challenging one that requires chord voicings and different passages than I’m used to.

Of course, if you’re a vocalist, as well, as I am, then you have to get the words in your head and be able to sing them while you’re playing the accompaniment or melodic passages. Many, perhaps most of the musician friends I have seem to have more difficulty remembering lyrics than I do: for me learning the words is the easy part and always has been. I’m certain that that’s a major reason why I eventually became a front man when in bands and a solo act when I decided I wanted to make an actual living from playing music: I was the guy who always knew a lot of songs because I could remember all the verses, not just the first verse and chorus.

You’re going to need to find your own path to learning more songs, which won’t necessarily be anything like mine. But rest assured, the more songs you learn and the more practice you get at adding to your repertoire, the easier it becomes.

That’s not saying that unfamiliar chord patterns and chord forms you haven’t played before automatically become as easy as falling off a log, but the more you do this the more you’ll “get these songs in your hands” because you’ll have more and more of these processing skills that you haven’t acquired yet.

Short version: the more songs you learn, the more structural similarities you’ll see between one song and the next, the more facile at the process and the more strategic you’ll become in how you approach the task each time you learn a new song.

Hope that makes sense.


Wade Hampton Miller

Thanks, Wade. I understand what you mean. We have to find the best method for learning that suits us.

When learning a new song, I always look for the proper music sheet for the songs I like, and usually have no trouble with it. I tended to focus first on the guitar playing section. I also realised there were subtle nuances in performing the song, even after mastering the guitar section. However, when I look at a guitar tab with just chords and without strumming patterns for the same songs, I just struggled. And video tutorials do help when that happens.

I guess I should have worded the question with more detail. I wanted to know the most efficient method for learning and gaining experience to be better, since I can get stuck in a rut from time to time.

[dltw]

Originally Posted by ssynhorst

Experience will contribute to learning. But if it is simple mindless repetition it will be slow. There are mindful, intelligent, organized ways to learn that are very much faster. A local teacher may or may not know much about them. I think it is better to look into the methods yourself and make a smart decision about which path to take.

To start I suggest you take a look at classicalguitarshed.com. It is not just about classical music, though that is the most thoroughly studied, it is about how to learn how to learn, how to study, how to practice. You can branch off from there to the kind of music you want to learn.

Making music has been studied by great minds for centuries; you do not have to go your own way all alone. There is a lot of help out there; find it. - Stevo

Thanks, ssynhorst. I will certainly look at the classicalguitarshed.com. For now, I have to do it by myself. I have to say it's a challenge to discern the many learning methods recommended by YouTubers, online tutorials, and so on. I'll do my best. Thanks again.

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by dltw

Thanks, Wade. I understand what you mean. We have to find the best method for learning that suits us.

....I guess I should have worded the question with more detail. I wanted to know the most efficient method for learning and gaining experience to be better, since I can get stuck in a rut from time to time.

It’s a different process for me because I can’t read music and I concentrate on getting a feel for the song that’s going to work for the way I play. Naturally one of the first things I have to do is find a key where the song fits with my vocal range, so as often as not I’ll work up an entirely different arrangement in a different key than the original recording.

One thing that I have NEVER understood is why anyone would take a song and learn it note-perfectly from the original recording, but then sing it in a key that doesn’t suit their voices. Making the song sound good and communicate it effectively is the first, most basic obligation that anyone performing in public should respect and follow, but all kinds of people play and sing songs that aren’t really within their vocal range just because that’s the key it was in on the recording.

A large part of that process for me, especially when I was just starting to become a competent musician was that I was working up songs that had been recorded on guitar but I needed to create an arrangement for the mountain dulcimer, since that was the first instrument I got good on. (I’m a former United States Mountain Dulcimer Champion.)

So I was always flying by the seat of my pants in that regard, and always had to develop my own arrangements of these songs.

Which, in terms of performance style, made them mine.

Anyway, you mentioned wanting to be able to break out of musical ruts you’ve gotten stuck in, one simple but amazingly effective way I learned to get past those obstacles is when I have the words down and know what my accompaniment on the instrument SHOULD be doing, but can’t seem to get there is to take whichever instrument it is I’m using for the piece - whether it’s guitar, mandolin, banjo, mountain dulcimer or baritone guitar, and go sit in a completely dark room and work on the song until it suddenly comes together.

Removing the visual distractions forces you as a musician to focus only on the things that matter at that stage - the sound and the tactile feel of the strings under your hands.

It’s by far and away the fastest and most effective way to get around those roadblocks where I simply can’t get around the problem and progress on the song. I did that on a new piece I was stalled on just last week.

Now, I’ve made that suggestion to other musicians before, and it’s probably safe to say that many of them think I’m nuts. But give that a try if you’ve gotten to the point on a song where - technically - you know it, but just can’t seem to make it flow.

It’s a technique that’s always worked for me.

One more approach you might try in a similar situation is you’ve gotten to another frustrating stalemate trying to make a song work, but just haven’t been able to is to follow your normal practice routine, and take a break until right at bedtime, when you’re so tired that you’re about to fall over.

I used to do this right on the edge of my bed when I was a bachelor, but a sofa in in a nearby room will also work - but you’re so exhausted that you’re literally close to falling over - THEN you should pick up your guitar and play through the song that’s had you stymied and play it through four, five, six times through.

I’ve achieved major breakthroughs many times when I’ve been semi-conscious like that. My guess is that it works because you’ve already put in most of the grunt work “getting the song in your hands,” but your frustration with not quite getting it to work and flow is actually distracting you from getting it to all lay out perfectly.

In other words, it’s your rigorous left brain trying to get everything laid out and champing at the bit to get it done, while what you actually need is the more intuitive right brain to take over and get the song to flow.

Being almost too sleepy to hold the guitar will help get your uber-organized brain to back off long enough to let the song put itself together.

I suspect that these are techniques that might sound strange to you and others, but practicing in a completely dark room and then briefly running through the song while half asleep are two ways to bust out of the ruts you find yourself in sometimes.

Hope that makes sense.


Wade Hampton Miller

[1neeto]

Those hard passages become easier and easier. Also once you start to understand music better, you’ll figure out where it’s going based on key signature and chord progression.

[EZYPIKINS]

In the past couple years the toughest song for me was figuring how to slickly play Under The Sea from the Little Mermaid. Learned for my Granddaughter. Got it figured out. Is it note for note? No. One thing I learned watching Tommy Emanuel. All you need to do is make it sound enough like the actual song that people recognize what you are trying to get across. And do it quick enough, no one has time to think about it.