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  #31  
Old 05-20-2018, 05:28 AM
Pitar Pitar is offline
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Originally Posted by cyclistbrian View Post
I guess you could say I'm a grandchild of the fifties sixties folk boom. Music was important in the home I grew up in and a lot of it stemmed from the folk era. My grandparents especially were Quakers and hard core lefties and a part of that scene. Think Oak Publishing, Sing Out, The Weavers, Pete and Woody, and you'll have an idea of what I'm writing about. And it seems to me that while the steel string was and remains vastly more popular for American (as in USA, not the continent) the classical guitar had its place back then.

I myself having recently turned fifty am solidly in the steel string camp. I've tried nylon string guitars a few times. I love the sound others can get from them. As for me a wide classical neck hurts like heck to play and even the mid priced cross overs have been overbuilt and sounded dull. So no real personal success. Its a kind of a shame and Im inclined to give it one more go.

Who here is using a nylon string for folk? Do you use it for ballads? To acompany singing? If you play steel string as well what determines what you prefer for which songs?
At 50 I was where you are now. My older sister comforted me on my 50th birthday saying I wouldn't be 50 for very long. I'm not 50 anymore and nor do I play steel string guitar. I play a classical guitar, plugged mostly, and enjoy that sound much more than the sound of the harsher steel strings. Your ear for overbuilt and dull sounding is about right for a steel string player groomed on the sound of steel, as I was, and I had your same opinion of the very guitar I'm playing now when I was some years younger.
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  #32  
Old 05-20-2018, 06:58 AM
lpa53 lpa53 is offline
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About ten years ago I was reintroduced to the music of Michael Johnson, who started his career with the Chad Mitchell Trio, and who played a classical guitar almost exclusively. I myself had started playing guitar in the 60s using an Aria classical but over the years had migrated to steel. While I hadn't played my Aria in years, I still loved the sound and decided to purchase a better nylon string guitar. Although the true classical neck can take some getting used to, it's well worth putting in the effort as I, too, have not been very impressed with crossover nylons.

If you can swing it, I'd recommend going for a true classical and, in order to avoid a dull sound, look for one in the over-$1000 range. The right strings are also important. After trying many sets, I ended up liking hard tension strings because the 1) felt firmer, like steel and 2) gave a brighter sound.
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  #33  
Old 07-28-2018, 10:42 AM
JohnnySmash JohnnySmash is offline
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Originally Posted by sirwhale View Post
In Spain, of course, the "Spanish guitar" is king.
I have an Almansa 401 Mate from Spain. I live in Thailand and everyone who plays on my guitar when they visit, then they want to buy it. Even tho I do not play it much anymore I would never sell it. It sounds great. I think, I do not know, it is more or less a beginners guitar. I have had it for over 15 years and purchased it in Bangkok.
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  #34  
Old 07-30-2018, 11:38 AM
Stringmaster Stringmaster is offline
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I recently picked up a Dupont MCC30 nylon string, based on the first Maccaferri guitar. It's my first nylon string and I'm really smitten with the sound of the thing. I'm not a classical player, but rather folk/western/blues/swing, and it covers all of those styles nicely. I have no doubt that it would be fantastic in the hands of a classical player as it's built like one.

I wrestled with the notion of going with more of a crossover guitar and tried a bunch of those, as well as standard classical guitars. It was between this guitar which has a flat radius fingerboard that is almost as wide as a standard classical (just under 2"), with a full 650mm scale length, and a crossover type with a slightly radiused fingerboard and narrower nut. This guitar really beat the other tonally, and I'm adjusting to the width of the neck no problem--in fact I kind of like it, especially the string spacing. Only downside is that I can't do the thumb wrap so I have to bar more chords (my hands are on the smaller side), but not a big deal. I'm finding that the guitar is very sensitive to different strings and I'm experimenting there. It's opened up a whole new world of playing for me!!

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  #35  
Old 07-31-2018, 12:18 AM
gigmaster gigmaster is offline
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I play a lot on my classical (Salvatore Ibanez AEG-10-NE), everything from Spanish classical, pop, jazz, country, James Taylor, Gordon Lightfoot, Jim Croce, Easy Listening, etc... I also play both steel string, and electric in my shows. It just depends on what I feel like playing at the moment. I let the song decide....
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  #36  
Old 07-31-2018, 06:52 AM
lpa53 lpa53 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stringmaster View Post
I recently picked up a Dupont MCC30 nylon string, based on the first Maccaferri guitar. It's my first nylon string and I'm really smitten with the sound of the thing. I'm not a classical player, but rather folk/western/blues/swing, and it covers all of those styles nicely. I have no doubt that it would be fantastic in the hands of a classical player as it's built like one.

I wrestled with the notion of going with more of a crossover guitar and tried a bunch of those, as well as standard classical guitars. It was between this guitar which has a flat radius fingerboard that is almost as wide as a standard classical (just under 2"), with a full 650mm scale length, and a crossover type with a slightly radiused fingerboard and narrower nut. This guitar really beat the other tonally, and I'm adjusting to the width of the neck no problem--in fact I kind of like it, especially the string spacing. Only downside is that I can't do the thumb wrap so I have to bar more chords (my hands are on the smaller side), but not a big deal. I'm finding that the guitar is very sensitive to different strings and I'm experimenting there. It's opened up a whole new world of playing for me!!

That is one cool-looking guitar! Like you I love the nylon sound (and do love steel, too). I've gotten more into it having gained an interest in the work of Michael Johnson and it's helped advance my playing abilities.
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  #37  
Old 07-31-2018, 07:00 AM
rodmbds rodmbds is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gigmaster View Post
I play a lot on my classical (Salvatore Ibanez AEG-10-NE), everything from Spanish classical, pop, jazz, country, James Taylor, Gordon Lightfoot, Jim Croce, Easy Listening, etc... I also play both steel string, and electric in my shows. It just depends on what I feel like playing at the moment. I let the song decide....
Interesting you mentioned James Taylor and Jim Croce. At least in my hands, they sound much better in nylon strings than steel.
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  #38  
Old 07-31-2018, 10:47 PM
rodmbds rodmbds is offline
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Your comment inspired me to pick the guitar up and do an impromptu recording of some Jim Croce and James Taylor.

The sound is a bit low mostly because the babies were asleep so I had to do it quietly. And that's basically when I find some spare time to play

Here's the YouTube link:

https://youtu.be/xs0TQSX1fEA

As pointed out some two or three posts before, I also have a hard time trying to keep the thumb behind the neck. I try not to, but it keeps popping out...
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  #39  
Old 08-06-2018, 10:23 PM
john bange john bange is offline
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old folky...nylon on everything except my 12 string...and tuned down to B to B...it feels like nylon too. Even my banjo.

I have gone away from 2" nuts, however.
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  #40  
Old 08-07-2018, 08:46 AM
rodmbds rodmbds is offline
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Why? I'm interested to know because I've got mixed feelings about it. On one hand, I like the string spacing, but on the other it's difficult to do thumb over the neck, though I managed to do it eventually.

My guitar's neck is a D shape, flat at the back. It's rather uncomfortable, I'm still getting used to it. But I haven't got another one, so I I'll just play what I got.
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  #41  
Old 08-08-2018, 06:58 AM
john bange john bange is offline
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if you are asking me...I don't thumb over the neck at all. barr chords are easy for me and I have no need to try and catch an E string with it.
it's just the way i've played for 50 years, or so...certainly not the only way.

my thumb is planted on the back of the neck, mostly.
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  #42  
Old 08-15-2018, 03:27 PM
Cameleye Cameleye is offline
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In the above photo Woody is holding a Martin 00-18C.

A steel string player for the past 50 years, a few years ago I acquired a '54 Martin 00-18G. At first I rarely played it, now the ol' arthritic hands find it a blessing. It does take a while for the ears to adjust to the tone of a nylon stringer but now that I'm there I find the tone everything I could ask for.

Martin's G series nylon stringers were a staple of the early folk scene, especially the less costly 00-18G. Paul's holding one on the cover of PP&M's first album.
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  #43  
Old 08-15-2018, 04:30 PM
rodmbds rodmbds is offline
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I love the combo of steel and nylon that peter paul and mary (ppm) do.

I was asking about the thumb because the necks on steel guitars kind of "want" you to wrap the thumb around it, while nylons ask for thumb behind the neck.

Somebody once told me "correct" technique required the thumb to be behind the neck and not showing above the fretboard. How about that? I can keep it behind the neck most of times but there's always a part of it that pops above it.
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  #44  
Old 08-15-2018, 07:54 PM
Cameleye Cameleye is offline
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I cradle the neck just like I would a steelstring. Of course my thumb doesn't make it as far around as it would on a skinnier neck. Classical music players stick pretty much with the thumb behind the neck technique though.

Re PP&M I did hear that Peter's D-28S while strung with steel on the 6th through 3rd strings actually had nylons on the 2nd and 1st.
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  #45  
Old 08-18-2018, 07:37 AM
john bange john bange is offline
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[QUOTE=rodmbds;



Somebody once told me "correct" technique required the thumb to be behind the neck and not showing above the fretboard. How about that? I can keep it behind the neck most of times but there's always a part of it that pops above it.[/QUOTE]

I'd sure take issue with that. The "correct" way should be the way each is comfortable with and the size and shape of the neck will usually dictate the thumb position.
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