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  #16  
Old 11-09-2019, 01:46 AM
Fishermike Fishermike is offline
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I love it when at 1:44, he says “I was at 200. Let’s say that was difficult...”
Umm, yeah, let’s say that, John! Clearly not for him, of course...
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  #17  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:33 AM
TJE" TJE" is offline
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Maybe one the thing to bear in mind is that you might not have to use a metronome for ever. After practising with one for a few weeks I found that my sense of inner internal timing timing had massively increased( I had none to begin with) such that I don't really it anymore.

As someone said ty to get one where the first beat can be empasized so you don't get lost, and also one where you can not only vary the timing but number of beats in a bar. Korg does quite a cheap digital one which has these feature plus more.
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  #18  
Old 11-09-2019, 09:41 PM
rwhitney rwhitney is offline
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I practice with a metronome, and suggest besides setting it to the beat, use subdivisions, e.g. two clicks per beat (or even more, depending on tempo), and one click for every two beats (like half-time). Using sub-beat divisions can really improve your rhythmic accuracy if you pay attention and count the subdivisions in your mind until they’re internalized and automatic, more of a feel. Don't forget to use triplets when appropriate. In any case, it takes time to get on with a metronome, so be patient, but don't overdo it -- I wouldn’t normally use a metronome for more than 20-30 minutes during a practice session (unless you're a drummer).

I don’t use a metronome until I’m fluent with the particular song/piece, scale, or exercise I’m working on to play at a steady pace without flubbing it. The next step is sight-reading notation/tab with a metronome, which forces you to think ahead — a more advanced skill, obviously.
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  #19  
Old 11-10-2019, 08:46 AM
SprintBob SprintBob is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJE" View Post
Maybe one the thing to bear in mind is that you might not have to use a metronome for ever. After practising with one for a few weeks I found that my sense of inner internal timing timing had massively increased( I had none to begin with) such that I don't really it anymore.

As someone said ty to get one where the first beat can be empasized so you don't get lost, and also one where you can not only vary the timing but number of beats in a bar. Korg does quite a cheap digital one which has these feature plus more.
I believe any serious musician must always have a metronome at hand as a reality check. I took a class with Jamie Stilway this year where she exposed to many of us there that our sense of time/rhythm was not as innate as we believed it to be. It was a sobering experience but well worth the lesson learned.
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  #20  
Old 11-10-2019, 09:04 AM
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The problem with "Crusade mentality" is if focuses on the extreme (both in forwarding it's own agenda as well as attempting to disparage the contra viewpoint " ) as opposed to observing the vast middle ground and its objective reality . Unfortunately video does a lot of that.

The entire spiel about a beginner player learning a new piece, who is still struggling with just making chord changes, or the correct finger placement for a melody, not using a metronome, is ludicrous as a general argument against the general concept practicing with a metronome, as well as being a total DUH .

Obviously one should be able to make chord changes fluidly before attempting to work on the timing I mean DOUBLE DUH.
Not to mention metronomes have the ability so slow down, so as to fit the speed one can actually make the changes at

Also stating symphony players and rock players etc. did/do not ever practice with a met, is total complete wild speculation, maybe they did or maybe they didn't, who knows, but Glittering Generalities are foolish as an argument. Not to mention Practice and Performance are to very different situations.
Juss sayin.
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  #21  
Old 11-10-2019, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by TRose View Post
I have a new instructor. Our first session was last night. He suggested I spend some time practicing my playing with a metronome. His explanation on “how to” was limited- “just get the feel of the tempo of the song.” I’ve been doing as told and can sense more consistency already- of course I have the tempo set slower than cold molasses. Hopefully over time I’ll be able to speed her up.
If you have any practical suggestions on how I might make this practice more focused I’m all ears.
Best,
Tom
Hi Tom

I came from 18 years of classical training in piano, brass - solo and orchestral - and band/orchestra/swing band/formal performance.

I have done tons of hours with metronomes. But never all the time I practiced.

As I hit hard to manage passages, or uneven spots, I'd slow my self down and straighten things out accompanied by a metronome, and didn't speed up till the passages were properly done at a slower tempo.

Metronomes are meant to be an aid, not a slave-master.

Joining a good blue-grass circle (or jam as I call them) occasionally might just do tons of good for your rhythm and pacing.


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  #22  
Old 11-10-2019, 09:27 AM
TRose TRose is offline
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Thank you all for the replies.
I have been practicing playing the tunes I already “know” with a metronome and have suddenly become more conscious of my tendency vary pace unintentionally. As I’ve made my pacing more consistent the songs sound better- to my wife at least- even though I perceive them to be oddly slow. My perception is probably due to my primitive, beginner internal “rythometer”
needing to be calibrated.
I think metronome practice, for me, will be a good thing. I think I need to learn to play in time before I can effectively alter it for expressive purposes. If that makes sense?
My understanding is that “Beauty in the Orderly” is a standard left over from the Baroque era and still has relevance today even in the Modern/Jazz age where expression is a large and important component. Practicing with a metronome, in a way, is a tip of the hat to Scarlatti, Bach, Telemann, Handel and Vivaldi to name a few.
I suppose I should learn to play in time before I try to spawn some catchy improvs.[emoji3]

I’m always grateful for the community this forum has built. Thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge.
-Tom
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  #23  
Old 11-26-2019, 11:04 AM
Rocky Dijohn Rocky Dijohn is offline
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Default Use of Metronome

I have metronome app on my iPhone. It has an audio beat and a visual clue as well. I do not think I can watch for the video clue while also trying to watch what I am doing on the guitar.

Do most people just rely on an audio beat to keep time?
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  #24  
Old 11-26-2019, 12:51 PM
reeve21 reeve21 is offline
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Originally Posted by Rocky Dijohn View Post

Do most people just rely on an audio beat to keep time?
I do. Flashing lights do not help.
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  #25  
Old 11-26-2019, 08:22 PM
Su_H. Su_H. is offline
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As someone who's played for a long time, through my trials and errors, I highly recommend playing with a metronome.

Also, if someone much more advanced than you are - is telling you to practice a certain way, you should give that an honest attempt even if you don't understand the reason behind it. Ask questions if you don't understand. Don't be like me and never ask questions.

I wish I had done everything my instructors had advised me. I would have been a much better guitarist now.
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  #26  
Old 11-26-2019, 09:45 PM
fwellers fwellers is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwhitney View Post
... The next step is sight-reading notation/tab with a metronome, which forces you to think ahead — a more advanced skill, obviously.
As a person who struggles to play any piece through smoothly without errors or pauses, I can voucher for the above comment.
Even without reading, if you know the piece by heart, a metronome can help you to think ahead in the piece to help keep it flowing.
It's the fastest way I know of to get to the next level of playing a piece. You just slow it down until you succeed. From that point on, bumping up the tempo in increments is not as difficult.
I just use a free online metronome that runs in a browser.
Definitely worth your time to check it out!!

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  #27  
Old 11-27-2019, 06:41 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
The problem with "Crusade mentality" is if focuses on the extreme (both in forwarding it's own agenda as well as attempting to disparage the contra viewpoint " ) as opposed to observing the vast middle ground and its objective reality . Unfortunately video does a lot of that.

The entire spiel about a beginner player learning a new piece, who is still struggling with just making chord changes, or the correct finger placement for a melody, not using a metronome, is ludicrous as a general argument against the general concept practicing with a metronome, as well as being a total DUH .

Obviously one should be able to make chord changes fluidly before attempting to work on the timing I mean DOUBLE DUH.
I disagree. You can still work on keeping a beat, just strumming one chord. Keeping time is critical, and often under-rated in teaching.
Even when changing chords, having a steady beat to refer to is important. If you take time to change chords, give yourself time - take your fingers off chord 1 in time fo get chord 2 on the beat where it should be.
Sometimes you can even keep strumming the open strings while doing that. Of course, if the gap is any more than one beat it's going to sound wrong, but it's common even for pros to strum open strings on beat "4-and" during a chord change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
Not to mention metronomes have the ability so slow down, so as to fit the speed one can actually make the changes at
But what's wrong with that? Keeping a steady beat is an essential skill to learn. Obviously you start at a tempo where that's not too hard.
That doesn't mean slowing the metronome though. It might mean setting it to click on the 8th notes instead of the quarters. Slow metronome speeds are a lot harder to play to than fast ones. That's why you slow the metronome (or halve the bpm) once you get used to it as faster speeds.
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  #28  
Old 11-27-2019, 06:52 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRose View Post
I have a new instructor. Our first session was last night. He suggested I spend some time practicing my playing with a metronome. His explanation on “how to” was limited- “just get the feel of the tempo of the song.” I’ve been doing as told and can sense more consistency already- of course I have the tempo set slower than cold molasses. Hopefully over time I’ll be able to speed her up.
If you have any practical suggestions on how I might make this practice more focused I’m all ears.
Best,
Tom
Main thing to remember is that the metronome is not for practising getting faster. It's for practising how to hold a tempo steady, at any speed, fast or slow. (We are never as good at that as we like to think we are. )

So start with it at a comfortable tempo, where it's not too hard to play on the click. Practice all kinds of things: strumming one chord, changing chords, playing scales or riffs, whatever.
Vary the tempo a little this way or that, for variety, but you may need to spend months at medium or fast tempos before it really gets comfortable to stay with the click whatever you're playing.

Once you're totally confident you can do it - the click disappears because your time is so reliable - the next stage is to slow the metronome down. The usual first step is to halve the bpm. You play at the same speed as before, but now the click is on 1 and 3, or 2 and 4. Now you are having to get that missing beat in the right place. Again, it may take months of work to feel comfortable like that at various different tempos. But there are other stages beyond that...

Check this out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9X1fhVLVF_4&t=35
- he gets seriously challenging after around 5:00. You may never need to try any of that!
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  #29  
Old 11-27-2019, 08:29 AM
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KevWind KevWind is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonPR View Post
I disagree. You can still work on keeping a beat, just strumming one chord. Keeping time is critical, and often under-rated in teaching.
Even when changing chords, having a steady beat to refer to is important. If you take time to change chords, give yourself time - take your fingers off chord 1 in time fo get chord 2 on the beat where it should be.
Sometimes you can even keep strumming the open strings while doing that. Of course, if the gap is any more than one beat it's going to sound wrong, but it's common even for pros to strum open strings on beat "4-and" during a chord change.
But what's wrong with that? Keeping a steady beat is an essential skill to learn. Obviously you start at a tempo where that's not too hard.
That doesn't mean slowing the metronome though. It might mean setting it to click on the 8th notes instead of the quarters. Slow metronome speeds are a lot harder to play to than fast ones. That's why you slow the metronome (or halve the bpm) once you get used to it as faster speeds.
I think you do not actually "disagree". Perhaps my post was not completely clear ? If you read my post again, you will find nothing I am saying is contra to your post. The "Crusade mentality" is was referring to, is the one presented in the video, inferring practicing with a metronome is somehow bad or wrong. But it works both ways. Practice both with and without a metronome is beneficial IMO.
I did not say there is anything wrong with slowing a metronome I simply said you can do it if you want to
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  #30  
Old 11-27-2019, 08:59 AM
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I've found practicing with a metronome to be invaluable.

Also, I've found practicing with a drum machine (vs. a metronome) makes a big difference for me in the enjoyment factor, and somehow - not exactly sure how/why - I seem to play better with a drum machine vs. a "click click click" metronome.

Here is one free online drum machine I use. There are others if you look around.

DrumBit Drum Machine

Click on the button that says "No Demo" to see the different canned styles that are already in the drum machine that you can select/use. Then you can click on the squares in the matrix to turn various beats/sounds on & off.
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