LR Baggs Lyric?

[cary]

NEW LYRIC USER HERE:

I'm a long-time K&K user, and I've been very happy with that pickup, but I can tell you that I absolutely LOVE the Lyric. While the K&K is a great workhorse pickup, the Lyric is even better IMHO.

There is at least one caveat though -- in my experience the Lyric needs more EQ tweaking that the K&K to reach its full potential.

I honestly wasn't happy with the tone of the Lyric using just the simple BASS/MID/TREBLE controls on my Schertler David. However, I could hear the potential of the pickup and decided to purchase an LR Baggs Venue to go with it, and that has made all the difference.

The problem with the Lyric is that it needs some reduction in various parts of the Mid frequency to remove some boxiness -- with the Venue I have two parametric controls for the mids, giving me much more control.

In fact, if my current installation is any indication, I'd guess that a good EQ needs to be figured into the cost of the Lyric, since it's pretty much required.

Now, all of that said, when EQ's correctly applied, the Lyric is the best sounding pickup I've ever used -- it's a Mic and it sounds like a Mic. It captures the real nuances of my playing, and it captures the true sound of my guitar (on a scale of 1-to-10 for realism, I'd say the Lyric is giving me about a 9.)

One downside to a Mic though -- particularly for those used to the K&K, like I am -- is that the Mic picks up everything, just like plopping your guitar down in front of an SM57.

I guess what I mean is that an SBT like the K&K does more compressing and smoothing out of your playing -- the Lyric, on the other hand, requires you to play better. At least that's my current take on it. Your sound will be much more dynamic with the Lyric, and less forgiving.

As far as feedback goes, I haven't had to deal with that yet, but I feel that the feedback controls on both my Schertler and my Venue should be able to handle anything I may come across in the types of venues I play.

As always, YMMV, but for me personally the Lyric has been a game changer, and I can't wait to get out there and get some gigging in with it.

[MaurysMusic]

Originally Posted by cary

NEW LYRIC USER HERE:

I'm a long-time K&K user, and I've been very happy with that pickup, but I can tell you that I absolutely LOVE the Lyric. While the K&K is a great workhorse pickup, the Lyric is even better IMHO.

There is at least one caveat though -- in my experience the Lyric needs more EQ tweaking that the K&K to reach its full potential.

I honestly wasn't happy with the tone of the Lyric using just the simple BASS/MID/TREBLE controls on my Schertler David. However, I could hear the potential of the pickup and decided to purchase an LR Baggs Venue to go with it, and that has made all the difference.

The problem with the Lyric is that it needs some reduction in various parts of the Mid frequency to remove some boxiness -- with the Venue I have two parametric controls for the mids, giving me much more control.

In fact, if my current installation is any indication, I'd guess that a good EQ needs to be figured into the cost of the Lyric, since it's pretty much required.

Now, all of that said, when EQ's correctly applied, the Lyric is the best sounding pickup I've ever used -- it's a Mic and it sounds like a Mic. It captures the real nuances of my playing, and it captures the true sound of my guitar (on a scale of 1-to-10 for realism, I'd say the Lyric is giving me about a 9.)

One downside to a Mic though -- particularly for those used to the K&K, like I am -- is that the Mic picks up everything, just like plopping your guitar down in front of an SM57.

I guess what I mean is that an SBT like the K&K does more compressing and smoothing out of your playing -- the Lyric, on the other hand, requires you to play better. At least that's my current take on it. Your sound will be much more dynamic with the Lyric, and less forgiving.

As far as feedback goes, I haven't had to deal with that yet, but I feel that the feedback controls on both my Schertler and my Venue should be able to handle anything I may come across in the types of venues I play.

As always, YMMV, but for me personally the Lyric has been a game changer, and I can't wait to get out there and get some gigging in with it.

Thanks for the review - sounds like you're very happy! Its always nice when that happens with gear.

[Aaron Smith]

When you read through these threads, I'm pretty amazed at how many of the opinions are provided by people who:

A) haven't even tried the Lyric, and are posting due to some preconceived notion they have about the manufacturer or about microphones; or

B) have only used it in the context of plugging it into their MacBook, or messing around in their bedroom.

Are there really that few people on this forum that have used it for gigging, at gig volumes?

Speaking as an engineer, this is an innovative product. It is a PZM microphone (which by it's very nature is quite different from a standard mic) with a bunch of pre-processing that greatly reduces feedback and smoothes the response. For those of you that haven't tried it: I guarantee that it's unlike any pickup, or mic for that matter, that you've tried before.

My review after gigging it for a few months: with some tweaking, it is a great sounding pickup that gives me many of the sonic benefits of dual-source systems without the complications. It is simple, practical, and feedback resistant enough for my needs. My basis for comparison is the K&K Pure Western Mini, which I've used for years. I think I like the Lyric a little better now, but I'm happy enough with the K&KPWM's in my other guitars that I have no plans to change.

It took me some work to get to this conclusion about the Lyric. It does require a fair amount of EQ to make it stage-ready, at least for my purposes. It shares this characteristic with basically every other pickup I've tried. The first gig I did with it where I plugged it straight into the mixing board went poorly. The difference is that the EQ needs are unique from other pickups, and pre-amp or mixer EQ that has worked for me in the past did not work for the Lyric. In my hands the Lyric benefits from a bass boost below 100 Hz, and a bass cut between 100-200 Hz. Most mixers and pre-amps are poorly equipped for this job; the only practical solution I've found is a MXR 10 band graphic EQ pedal. I posted about this in a different thread.

[cary]

Are there really that few people on this forum that have used it for gigging, at gig volumes?

The Lyric hasn't really been around all that long... I'm not surprised that so few have used it for consistent gigging.

I do, however, share your frustration with those who seem to have opinions based on zero actual experience using one.

That said, I'm not sure why there's anything wrong with playing the Lyric in the bedroom/living room/garage -- it is, after all, where most of us experiment before taking our rigs out to the real world.

[Aaron Smith]

Originally Posted by cary

The Lyric hasn't really been around all that long... I'm not surprised that so few have used it for consistent gigging.

I do, however, share your frustration with those who seem to have opinions based on zero actual experience using one.

That said, I'm not sure why there's anything wrong with playing the Lyric in the bedroom/living room/garage -- it is, after all, where most of us experiment before taking our rigs out to the real world.

No offense intended cary... I also fine-tune my gear at home before it hits the stage. Your review is fair and useful, and my experience has been identical to yours. I just get a little agitated when people make declarative statements about a new technology (it's great! it's terrible!) without having used it for it's intended purpose.

I don't make declarative statements about gear until I've used it repeatedly in a venue with 100-year-old aluminum electrical wiring, two-prong power outlets, fluorescent lights overhead, on the same circuit with the refrigerator and HVAC, under a ceiling fan, next to a TV playing the Braves game, on a 4 square foot stage, in a room with terrible acoustics. I'm trying to play louder than the jukebox, the bartender is yelling at me to turn down, and the crowd is yelling at me to turn up (while requesting Freebird, or course).

Fortunately, several of my gigs have that exact setup- so I get my product feedback quickly.

[Doubleneck]

Originally Posted by Aaron Smith

I don't make declarative statements about gear until I've used it repeatedly in a venue with 100-year-old aluminum electrical wiring, two-prong power outlets, fluorescent lights overhead, on the same circuit with the refrigerator and HVAC, under a ceiling fan, next to a TV playing the Braves game, on a 4 square foot stage, in a room with terrible acoustics. I'm trying to play louder than the jukebox, the bartender is yelling at me to turn down, and the crowd is yelling at me to turn up (while requesting Freebird, or course).
.

That is classic!! Closer to the real world of praise band set ups than you might think. Except for the Freebird requests. LOL

[cary]

Originally Posted by Aaron Smith

don't make declarative statements about gear until I've used it repeatedly in a venue with 100-year-old aluminum electrical wiring, two-prong power outlets, fluorescent lights overhead, on the same circuit with the refrigerator and HVAC, under a ceiling fan, next to a TV playing the Braves game, on a 4 square foot stage, in a room with terrible acoustics. I'm trying to play louder than the jukebox, the bartender is yelling at me to turn down, and the crowd is yelling at me to turn up (while requesting Freebird, or course).

Fortunately, several of my gigs have that exact setup- so I get my product feedback quickly.

Hahaha. Oh man, I do my best NOT to accept gigs like that.

[myersbw]

Doubleneck, yeah, in SW Ohio I feel yer pain about the Freebird requests. LOL, or I did until I committed to only playing Christian music...lshol!

I agree about the EQ comments and the like. I just gigged it for the 2nd time last Sunday.

Ok, this is off the wall, but I'll post a fast, live recording I did of it. I wanted to hear how it sounded. Interesting enough, all really liked the tome of it in my Taylor 410 vs. My Taylor 214's Fishman RareEarth Humbucker. But, it did take a bit of EQ'ing. That said...it's not a good recording. I'm going thru my TEhelicon Harmony-G XT which is voice-doubled (works well live...not so for recording). Anyways, it's something from the gigging perspective to listen to.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ufwju9m4lf...sFaith_bwm.wav

Don't shoot me...I'm only the guitar player...lol.

BradM

[guitaniac]

FWIW, Brad, you don't need to run the guitar signal through the Harmony-G for it to trigger the harmonies effectively. In my own case, I run the "tuner out" signal from my Fishman Platinum Pro EQ preamp to the Harmony-G and put a dummy plug in the Harmony-G's "thru" jack. This lets me take the Platinum's primary output signal directly to the mixer.

Its my belief that running the guitar signal through the Harmony-G compromises it. I hear the same problem (a compromised guitar signal) when running sound for a friend's DigiTech harmonizer.

[myersbw]

I should've clarified, guitaniac...I do the same. I come out of the THRU jack...into a direct box and right to the board. What I was inferring was that the vocals aren't the best. The Harmony-G is setup to sound best (vocally) for the live environment there...not to record. And, it's just one mono-stereo recording captured via audacity...not individually tracked to mixdown later. But, I have control of the sound room...I just might have to start setting up an environment to multi-track. Normally, we don't as...when someone sits in to relieve me for vacations, etc...then I keep it as simple as possible for them to grab the message of the day & save it.

BradM

[sixxstringer]

Delete. Duplicate message.

[buzzardwhiskey]

I think I'm going to pick up a two-channel 15-segment graphic EQ. I'll use one side to shape my Lyric going into the board, and the other to shape the FOH after leaving the board.

[myersbw]

I've got a Rane rack unit I'm considering doing the same with. THat'll get me away from the limited 4-bander on the Mackie CFX12 board I'm using.

[Vancebo]

I'm glad to see folks here working out the issues with this new product. Every product has it's strengths and weaknesses. I just figure that the weaknesses of this product can be overcome with good EQ applied correctly and the result is better than a typical UST, SBT or Mag which to my ear can never be overcome, only made tollerable.

The result is good enough that I sold my Pendulum SPS-1, K&K's and DPA mics which in comparison was better overall and more flexible but also more trouble and hassle. This was the closest second I have ever heard.

[buzzardwhiskey]

Originally Posted by myersbw

I've got a Rane rack unit I'm considering doing the same with. THat'll get me away from the limited 4-bander on the Mackie CFX12 board I'm using.

Running directly into my Schertler Unico, or through my Soundcraft EFX8 first, the sound with the Lyric is of higher fidelity than when using my Fishman Matrix VT pickup. But I'm willing to bet that a more selective EQ would be even better,