12 String Appreciation

[DenverSteve]

Deleted. Duplicate post.

[Brucebubs]

Originally Posted by Knives&Guitars

Thanks Brucebubs, great info.

So do you believe there is any difference in the New F-512 American made verses the JF-30's of yesteryear(pre-china).

Is there any design differences" between the New F-512 over the the older JF-30's ?
I guess the most important question is, Does one sound better than the other?With the new USA factory in California maybe comes something new and better?

Had an Ovation 12 back in the 70's and actually it was a pretty good sounding guitar. Sold it because the nut width was smaller and I found myself not progressing, because the smaller nut was more suited towards strumming and picking. Harder for individual notes.

The Guild with its wider nut, and wood body has me dreaming of that 12 string sound once again.

If we're talking just 12-strings then the old USA made JF-30-12's will all have dual truss rods and a thicker neck profile.

They are quite strongly built guitars and noticeably heavy.

The USA 12-strings went to a single truss rod with 2 support bars in late 2007/early 2008 at the end of the Tacoma factory period. (I believe the Made in China 12-strings still use the older 2 truss rods system?)

Guild then moved to the New Hartford factory that was already making Ovation guitars.
This factory was also using CNC machinery to cut & shape Ovation guitar necks and so Guild benefited by the upgrade too.

I've read over on the Guild forum that the new Cordoba Guilds coming out of Oxnard, California are all much lighter and more responsive builds.

Bottom line, an older USA JF-30-12 will be a fabulous guitar -but heavier and with a thicker neck profile than a current new F-512.
Whereas a new F-512 will lighter with a thinner neck profile and likely more responsive.

The usual tonal differences between rosewood and maple will apply.
Both are good!

[JohnW63]

I have an Ovation 1768 Elite 12 string that hits the spot. When the strings were old, I was thinking of looking for a nice Guild, but when I changed them out... it livened right up and made me realize I don't need another 12 string.

[Silly Moustache]

I have two.

My 1964 Martin D12-20, rebuilt ni 1998 (by Martin) who added a truss rod ebony bridge and fretboard and the "X35" trim.

And my beat up but beautiful Harmony H1270 (c.1968)

[Silly Moustache]

Martin d12-20:

[DCCougar]

My blue JF30-12....

[rstaight]

I couldn't be more pleased with my Takamine GJ72CE 12 string. It is the natural finish and it sings like an angel.

[DenverSteve]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

I have two. My 1964 Martin D12-20, rebuilt ni 1998 (by Martin) who added a truss rod ebony bridge and fretboard and the "X35" trim. And my beat up but beautiful Harmony H1270

Andy, those are great but that Martin is truly special. Gorgeous.

[DenverSteve]

Sunday morning starting to awaken. A good time for a bit of 12’ing, then later, some golf. Let’s see some more.

[ollie94]

I have been thinking about buying one for a while, I love 12 string guitars especially old 60/70s guilds they sound mega. I don’t know where to start with thinking about what one to buy within the 300-400 pound mark?

[MarkWW]

I love Guild 12's. I wish they made a 1.9" nut width like Seagull but in the meantime I keep on muddling. I THOUGHT I wanted a Jumbo but even though I am a fairly big guy it felt uncomfortable. I was sooo glad I had not sold my 12 string dred. Here is my GAD G212

[mcduffnw]

I am a huge fan of the 12 string, as two of my main inspirations to play music, guitar and sing were John Denver and Gordon Lightfoot back when I started playing as a 12 year old in 1972.

John Denver was my ultimate musical idol and his guitars back then were my dream guitars, especially that mighty Guild 12 string of his.

I now have, since 2010 a truly mighty 12 string, a 1969 Guild F-512 Custom, Sitka/Brazilian, one of only 20? known to have been made, and only one of about 10?...no one knows for sure...that were Brazilian. My guitar is actually a "sister" guitar to one that was owned by John Denver, and was originally bought by a member of The New Christy Minstrels" at the Guild factory in Hoboken in 1969...for full retail price at the time of $795.00. I am the second owner. The story from the original owner...condensed version goes as such. The original owner was performing with TNCM in a concert with John Denver, Jose Feliciano, and Bob Hope in Steamboat Springs Colorado. John had just gotten his F-512 Custom, the sister to mine, and the original owner was so impressed with John's and John told him there was a sister guitar back at the Guild factory. By pure luck, TNCM next concert was in New York, and the original owner went over the the Guild Factory in Hoboken and bought the sister, which he owned until 2010 when I bought it...but...I had first seen the guitar in 1992. How I came to own in is a long story, and a very lucky lucky one...needle in the haystack lucky almost.

Anyway...if you care to see it, if you Google:

Images for john denver guild f-612 guitar images and then click on that link and scroll down a few lines you will see a guy...me...sitting on a bench at the beach with a Guild 12 string with double pickguards. That is me and the F-512.

If you click on the link in that picture. It takes you back to a 2015 AGF thread about Guild 12 strings and if you scroll a little you will come back to that picture of me with the guitar AND couple of Soundclick links where you can hear me play it.

The one called "Angelic 1" is just me riffing in drop D

"Angelic 2" is me playing my version of the guitar part from John Denvers song Rhymes and Reasons, which is the song of John's that first made me want to play and own a 12 string.

Both clips were just one take shots recorded with my friend Michael Thrash "dadthrash" on the AGF and UMGF, in his home, with his Zoom H2 sitting on a stool about a foot in front of me, just set EQ flat.

It is the most amazing sounding 12 string I have ever heard or owned, with power to burn and a very firm and fundamental tone that is deep and resonant, and bell like...not chimey...but bell like in it's clarity, and enormous and deep bass response.

And yes...it is built like a tank and weighs a ton.

Have a look, and have a listen if you like.

duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

[Brucebubs]

Here's a link to the post by mcduffnw above.https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...=379287&page=4

Possibly the most beautiful 12-string I've ever heard.

https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v3/...BDB1021B60CD26

https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v3/...BDB1021B60CD26

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by DenverSteve

Andy, those are great but that Martin is truly special. Gorgeous.

Thanks Steve, yes it is. I reckon it is the only 1964 D-12-35 with a mahoganot B&S, or is it the only D-12-20 with X35 trim?

When it appeared on US ebay folks on various fora, esp. the UMGFF were sure that it was a phoney, or "knock-off". I contacted the seller and had a dialogue with him, and he sent me pics of the Martin repairs.

Seems no-one in the US would risk it, so he accepted my offer and shipped it to the UK for me.

How much of it is original and how much replaced - I can't say.

[Glennwillow]

Originally Posted by Brucebubs

Here's a link to the post by mcduffnw above.https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...=379287&page=4

Possibly the most beautiful 12-string I've ever heard.

https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v3/...BDB1021B60CD26

https://www.soundclick.com/html5/v3/...BDB1021B60CD26

I don't know how I missed those soundfiles from Duffy back in 2015 of his BRW Guild F512 with the two pick guards, but I listened to them now.

That is a great sounding guitar. I played Duffy's 12-string just a little once at an AGF gathering in Seattle and I remember Duffy playing Gordon Lightfoot's "Canadian Railroad Trilogy" using that guitar. It was a special encounter in meeting Duffy and his 12-string. I remember that he also had some other very nice 6-string guitars with him.

- Glenn