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  #31  
Old 04-28-2022, 07:03 PM
redi redi is offline
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Good luck Simon.

Look forward to your designs.

12" radius would not bother me at all.

I agree with your love of locking tuners. Locking tuners make string changes easy and probably add some tuning stability. Gotoh makes some stealth tuners that are "knob-free" in the back, look like the standard ones but as soon as you start turning, the peg locks up the string. They do work great (particularly on pinless bridges too) but I'm digressing.

Lastly I would love so see a fretboard that followed/paralleled the string path a little better, and did not get wide shouldered moving up the neck. I know a forum member or two has requested a special neck on their other builds that did not have lots of fretboard outside the E strings. I wish I had done this, my only real issue on my cf instruments.
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  #32  
Old 04-29-2022, 01:24 AM
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Originally Posted by David Eastwood View Post
If I saw the inside of a guitar that looked like that, I’d run a mile. Can you imagine the equivalent in a wooden instrument?

It looks like an outtake from a bad sci-fi movie
I have one of their original version and the inside top is smooth inside, nicely done.

I love the tone of my 660 so I'm curious what the reason is for adding the bumps to the soundboard's inside surface. Maybe someone else knows or has asked them why this change was made.
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  #33  
Old 04-29-2022, 02:26 AM
AZLiberty AZLiberty is offline
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Originally Posted by coder View Post
Rainsongs esp. tend to sound shrill. There is a reason why they started fusing spruce veneer with their carbon soundboards. ( SFT technology)
.
Rainsongs sound shrill because they ship with shrill twangey 80/20 strings on them.
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  #34  
Old 04-29-2022, 04:36 AM
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Simon@Caulfield Simon@Caulfield is offline
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Thanks for your input guys. I too prefer gig bags! I've been reaching to a number suppliers, I'll see what options they can come up with!

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Originally Posted by JackDaniel View Post
something I really like is the "tuning" that Mcpherson uses in their Sable and Touring. CF doesnt need bracing but they add bracing to tune the instrument. You can really hear the difference and the warmth it adds. It sort of gets rid of some of that weird CF resonance thing that makes the instrument sound plasticy. Not sure if you're played with that at all.
I agree. I believe that McPherson do some truly special work great work which is reflected in the sound their instruments produce.

I found that tuning the top can have a massive impact on the resonance. The rear of the instrument also has a notable impact as I found at some frequencies you can get out-of-phase vibrations reducing the overall voicing.

In terms of how I have approached it, I have simulated and bench tested materials and soundboards/sound chambers and arrived at what I believe gives the best performance. Whilst this is not traditional ribs (like on a wooden instrument), I do have bracing within the layup to help shape and distribute the vibrations through the instrument. My sound hole size, position and shape also help with this.

Another significant advantage is that within my layup, there are no materials specifically there to help resin flow (no cores, flow paths or absorbent materials). This means my tops can be incredibly thin in specific areas if required (something that I'm looking forward to utilising if/when I get the chance to create a nylon string variant). This is because my resin is already impregnated within the carbon, so its evenly distributed throughout from the onset.

My process is extremely controlled and repeatable. So now that I have arrived at a design I am happy with, Its really simple to replicate.

This being said, I did not set out to replicate the sound of a wooden instrument. Instead, I'm hoping to exceed it in many ways. My goal is to get the voice and projection of a large body, in a small/comfortable package. My belief is that the superior properties, repeatability and controllability of composite materials should mean you dont need a huge body. I think I have achieved that.

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Originally Posted by jklotz View Post
Will it have a truss rod? I've found it really helpful on my carbon guitar to dial in the setup.
Yes! It has a dual action truss rod, accessible at the headstock. Previous variations did not, however I too have found that the ability to finely control the relief was a significant advantage (even at the sacrifice of adding more weight).

Adding the truss rod was a significant challenge (I initially tried without one), and not only did it require some thought and design as to how to incorporate it into the neck, but also how to ensure the added mass didn't impact the centre of gravity and cause "neck dive" issues. The body had some design changes at this point also and caused quite a delay. But I'm extremely glad I took the time to make this change.

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Originally Posted by redi View Post
Good luck Simon.

Look forward to your designs.

12" radius would not bother me at all.

I agree with your love of locking tuners. Locking tuners make string changes easy and probably add some tuning stability. Gotoh makes some stealth tuners that are "knob-free" in the back, look like the standard ones but as soon as you start turning, the peg locks up the string. They do work great (particularly on pinless bridges too) but I'm digressing.

Lastly I would love so see a fretboard that followed/paralleled the string path a little better, and did not get wide shouldered moving up the neck. I know a forum member or two has requested a special neck on their other builds that did not have lots of fretboard outside the E strings. I wish I had done this, my only real issue on my cf instruments.
I've seen the stealth ones and have used them in the past! They are great! Id have love to have gotten my hands on some for this guitar; however at the moment with everything that's going on in the world, there are some significant delays; and I've had to work with what was available. Perhaps on the next one!

In my opinion, this neck should follow the string path exactly. I'm a stickler for small details; and the mould for this is an extremely accurate piece of tooling taken directly from computer designs that I've done myself.


Thanks again Guys for all your interest, input and questions. Hopefully my answers aren't too long-winded! :P

Last edited by Simon@Caulfield; 04-29-2022 at 04:50 AM.
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  #35  
Old 05-02-2022, 09:32 AM
slimey slimey is offline
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I use a sable as a gig guitar when weather, location, timing means I'm reluctant to threaten the well being of a wood instrument. It's a reasonable instrument for the job, best I've found for my tastes. But as an acoustic instrument it lacks volume and projection, for gigs it's heavy, the tactile feedback to the player is limited. But the neck is good and using a good pick up you can get an acceptable tone for live sound. ( just )
Acoustic players tend to be tone chasers which translates to those who gig being fussy about the pick ups they use.
I think this makes reasonable access to the insides of the instrument critical. There are many instruments I've not purchased because it came with a pick up I didn't want and changing it would mar the instrument. Taylors are a good example with their built in controls on the side of the instrument.
So not being able to quickly change a battery, with big hands, would stop me buying an instrument.
Better player feedback, no mid range quack, lighter, functional ( battery access, quick string changes, good tuners, stable ) , an easy playing fast neck would all be things making an instrument interesting and a threat to the wallet.
With carbon instruments we're far from traditional design , I think Emerald has done a good job of recognizing this with their shapes , why has no one copied electric guitars and molded a battery compartment into the back of the instrument , a closing compartment with a small hole into the inside of the guitar would make it simple to change battery and easy to run the wire through for any pickup. You could even have a terminal connector for the battery connections so any pick up could be simply adapted.
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Last edited by slimey; 05-02-2022 at 09:40 AM.
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  #36  
Old 05-02-2022, 10:48 AM
Captain Jim Captain Jim is offline
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Acoustic guitar players tend to be conservative in what their guitars should look and sound like. Those on this sub-forum may be the exception. I started playing guitar in the 60s (along with many from my generation)... when the Holy Grail for an acoustic guitar was a Martin, and pretty much all the guitar makers tried to "make a Martin." That tradition has been hard to escape.

For the record, I think McPherson makes great guitars... but their Sable is pretty much a "carbon copy" (pun intended) of their lovely wood guitars. Even today, the RainSong offerings look like traditional acoustic guitars. Only Emerald has moved from those strong traditions to making guitars that show forward thinking, designed for the player rather than what a player thinks the audience wants to see. Guitar makers have to build what people will buy. While many of us here see the advantages of carbon fiber, it is still a niche market.

In the meantime, electric players have enjoyed more innovation, even though most makers offer their version of a Les Paul and a Strat... and electronics (pickups, pedals) have evolved faster than in the acoustic world. I see that starting to change with Emerald offering various pickup options (a humbucker pickup on the soundboard of an X10?? Heresy!)... their Virtuo line seems to have been well-accepted... putting the Hyvibe in their lineup... still, a niche, though.

This could be a pivotal time for our friend Simon to design something unique, electronics included.

I guess I don't follow the norm - I like wood guitars but have never been a "tone chaser." I also like carbon fiber guitars for what they bring, in sound, design, and durability. My choice in electric guitars is all about the pickups and the feel. For any guitar, I look for...

* It should sound good. (there isn't any "one tone" that I chase - I like variety)
* It should play well. (I'm willing to do a set up as needed)
* It should look good. (doesn't have to look like "art," but it should please the eyes)
* It should be comfortable. (easy to hold and play, not too heavy, no hard edges where it meets my body/arm)

Not a requirement, but I also appreciate it if the guitar has something unique about it... something that makes it stand out from other offerings.

An acoustic (for me) should have an intimate feel to it, sound "appropriately rich and full" to my ears, and I appreciate onboard electronics - I'm not obsessive about "should sound like the guitar only louder" when plugged in... just like an electric guitar, I can use "stuff" to alter the tone, if desired. I don't play out much these days, but the only time anyone has commented about the sound is to say, "Sounds good," when I play songs they know. (OK, once in a great while, another guitar player will ask something like: "Are you using some chorus on your guitar?")

When I take a guitar off the wall in my music room, it is as much about comfort as tone, because I've already chosen guitars I like.

It's a good time to be a guitar player - lots of good options. I have no experience with guitar making, but I would think it takes a bold individual with a plan and desire, and grit to find a place in the market. There is a saying in the boat building business: The way to make a small fortune in boat building is to start with a large fortune.

Good luck, Simon.
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  #37  
Old 05-02-2022, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slimey View Post
I use a sable as a gig guitar when weather, location, timing means I'm reluctant to threaten the well being of a wood instrument. It's a reasonable instrument for the job, best I've found for my tastes. But as an acoustic instrument it lacks volume and projection, for gigs it's heavy, the tactile feedback to the player is limited. But the neck is good and using a good pick up you can get an acceptable tone for live sound. ( just )
Acoustic players tend to be tone chasers which translates to those who gig being fussy about the pick ups they use.
I think this makes reasonable access to the insides of the instrument critical. There are many instruments I've not purchased because it came with a pick up I didn't want and changing it would mar the instrument. Taylors are a good example with their built in controls on the side of the instrument.
So not being able to quickly change a battery, with big hands, would stop me buying an instrument.
Better player feedback, no mid range quack, lighter, functional ( battery access, quick string changes, good tuners, stable ) , an easy playing fast neck would all be things making an instrument interesting and a threat to the wallet.
With carbon instruments we're far from traditional design , I think Emerald has done a good job of recognizing this with their shapes , why has no one copied electric guitars and molded a battery compartment into the back of the instrument , a closing compartment with a small hole into the inside of the guitar would make it simple to change battery and easy to run the wire through for any pickup. You could even have a terminal connector for the battery connections so any pick up could be simply adapted.
Hi Steve!

Thanks for your feedback!

As a player myself, I agree whole heartedly with all your preferences/necessities.

I think the problem is; achieving everything with no absolutely no sacrifices isn't possible; and where I personally have placed ultimate priority is on acoustic sound and tone.

Its quite easy to mould an access panel on the rear, or indeed have a very large sound hole that even the largest of hands can fit down into (and I can by all means do this); but what this is doing is significantly impacting the structure of the resonance chamber itself.

Some manufactures require tooling within during moulding/assembly, and the large sound hole helps them remove this; or indeed if they do not have large sound holes; they may have access panels on the rear. These are not there just for setup; but a manufacturing restriction. My process however is completely unrestricted in this way; so the sound holes only purpose is to help shape and project the sound (with no other openings or holes cut in the body itself)..

That being said, I've found that they still provide ample access for wiring a simple under-saddle pickup (with controls, pre amp and battery). And; I will be adding an externally accessible battery door also (just couldn't get one in time to suit so am now designing my own )

I think the beauty of selling direct to customers will be finding their personal preference and working with them. Want a very specific pickup? Sure! Want an access panel, external controls or a larger sound hole? No problem, just be advised that this will impact the sound of the instrument.

My philosophy is that I'm not aiming to make the 'swiss army knife of the guitar world' that can do a little bit of everything, 'just ok'; instead I'm aiming for a very specialised tool that's main objective is; sounding and feeling good.

Thanks again for your feedback and suggestions; I am taking everything on board, and indeed will incorporate this into the next prototype

Last edited by Simon@Caulfield; 05-02-2022 at 11:23 AM.
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  #38  
Old 05-02-2022, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Captain Jim View Post

Good luck, Simon.
Apologies, Jim! Only seen your reply to the thread after I posted.
Thanks for your input and sharing your priorities I hope I'm on the way to achieving all the points you've stated! :P
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  #39  
Old 05-03-2022, 06:49 AM
Frettingflyer Frettingflyer is offline
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Simon,
Reference your case or bag question, bag all the way. I have had quite a few CF guitars and the hard shell case has always stayed in the closet while I have traveled over 1 million air miles with them. I have had various bags from the traditional to the “hard bag” of today and think the hard bag is a great solution.
FWIW.
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  #40  
Old 05-03-2022, 09:11 AM
new2guitar_eh new2guitar_eh is offline
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Hi Simon,

I have a couple of questions:
- will you be considering a short scale offering?
- when do you anticipate you will start selling your guitars?
- do you have a sense of pricing yet?

Looking forward to the progression of your new brand!
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  #41  
Old 05-05-2022, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Frettingflyer View Post
Simon,
Reference your case or bag question, bag all the way. I have had quite a few CF guitars and the hard shell case has always stayed in the closet while I have traveled over 1 million air miles with them. I have had various bags from the traditional to the “hard bag” of today and think the hard bag is a great solution.
FWIW.
Dave
Thanks for your input, Dave! I tend to agree. I'm on the hunt for a suitable maker and hope to have some options to put to you guys soon

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Originally Posted by new2guitar_eh View Post
Hi Simon,

I have a couple of questions:
- will you be considering a short scale offering?
- when do you anticipate you will start selling your guitars?
- do you have a sense of pricing yet?

Looking forward to the progression of your new brand!
1) Initially, not at first. Although, my mould is somewhat modular and I may consider taking more bespoke customs in the future.

My bridge is moulded with the rest of the instrument, so unlike other manufacturers; I cannot move this to suit (and I believe moving the bridge to be less than idea).

The neck can be shortened after the moulding process, but this involves cutting off the headstock and removing a piece of neck; interrupting the continuous weave that runs from my bridge to my headstock. Again, possible, and done by others; but something that id rather steer away from at this time. What scale length would you like?

2) I'm hoping to start selling soon. My goal at this time is to make another test instrument, and if it meets all my expectations then perhaps open for orders. Whilst nothing is set in stone at this time, I think I may cap this at 10 orders and I will work closely with each client throughout the process. That being said, I've been working on this for the best part of 2 years, and only when I am completely satisfied will I open for orders.

3) Pricing is difficult at present with everything that's going on in the world. Raw material costs change weekly. That being said, I'm hoping to be competitive with what's already on the market. I'm hoping for a well equipped instrument to come under the $3k mark including delivery to the US. Id like to also offer some discount to early adopters.

Thanks for your questions!
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  #42  
Old 05-05-2022, 12:02 PM
AZLiberty AZLiberty is offline
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Originally Posted by Simon@Caulfield View Post
Thanks for your input, Dave! I tend to agree. I'm on the hunt for a suitable maker and hope to have some options to put to you guys soon
Since this is an 0 size instrument, my go-to Gig Bag would be Boulder Alpine.

Rainsong used these for a while, and they are available factory in Black, Blue, Green, and Tan. I bought a Tan one for my Larrivee Parlor, which is again an 0 size.

I like the Tan a lot since it keeps down heat transfer, and I live halfway to the surface of the sun. (Phoenix)
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  #43  
Old 05-11-2022, 08:01 PM
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Some purely personal, non-functional thoughts: Having tuners that aren't parallel has always bugged me, although there are a few makers out there that do this. ...and I know I'm in a minority here, but I've never been keen on the carbon weave showing so a solid paint color (or burst!), with a gloss finish would also be my preference.
But as I don't even have a CF guitar anymore you can take this with a fistful of salt!
But overall, I quite like the look of this
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  #44  
Old 05-17-2022, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by tdq View Post
Some purely personal, non-functional thoughts: Having tuners that aren't parallel has always bugged me, although there are a few makers out there that do this. ...and I know I'm in a minority here, but I've never been keen on the carbon weave showing so a solid paint color (or burst!), with a gloss finish would also be my preference.
But as I don't even have a CF guitar anymore you can take this with a fistful of salt!
But overall, I quite like the look of this
Hi tdq!
Thanks for your comments and suggestions!

-Tuners - I've tried both, I felt with the buttons on these particular ones; it flows better flowing with the shape of the headstock; especially viewed from the rear. But with more vintage style tuners that stick out a little further, parallel worked a little better in my opinion! That's not to say the next ones wont be different.

Id ideally like a more traditional button but didn't want to sacrifice the locking feature (I couldn't get my hands on the vintage style button with the lockers in time).

-Paint - I've more ideas than I have time when it comes to finishes. Carbon finishes will of course be offered, but I do enjoy the contradictory clash of having a really traditional/simple paint finish on a modern guitar that's been engineered to the nth degree... Watching people react to the Daphne blue guitar shown; as they slowly realise that there's no wood has been quite fun! I also have a butterscotch yellow one.

Some supplies are arriving this week; and ill have more to share then
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  #45  
Old 05-17-2022, 09:04 PM
JackDaniel JackDaniel is offline
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Will any sound clips or videos be available soon?
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