Got cut off in traffic last night.

[Silurian]

Originally Posted by KevWind

Not unreasonable questions, And stiffer penalties might work. But unlike drinking and driving (for which one, there are no other practical controls but education ( the message) and stiff penalties) but for which a simple roadside test can quickly determine guilt, that is not logistically nor practically true for cell phone usage while driving. So that could prove to be very problematic and a legal nightmare to actually enforce


Where the installation of an operational jamming device is arguably logistically no more of a bureaucratic "nightmare" than say emission standards enforcement . So obviously yes for new vehicles, and then for current vehicles in order to get the annual registration and license plate, it would be required to have the unit installed and functional.

Seems like those same questions were asked about emission standards were they not ?

To be honest if we were going to go down this route, some kind of external device probably wouldn't be required. With accelerometers and GPS capability the phone itself could probably detect when it was being used on public roads and automatically disable specific functions.

This would still leave the issue of devices on public transport, but I'm sure any technical obstacles could be overcome.

I suppose that leaves other passengers in the vehicle using a phone/tablet. If this could be overcome without the need for some external device to detect whether the driver is using a phone then it may be feasible. If not it still seems a bit draconian especially for a country like the US.

[GHS]

Originally Posted by imwjl

Jamming signals when using them will keep cars from killing ourselves doesn't make sense.

This phone issue is a problem but when I look at the local news it sure seems like drunken driving and incidents related to violent crimes are killing people far more often than phone use.

I thought cancer, heart disease, respiratory and obesity related issues are all bigger killers than accidents. Something like the top killers 2-4 times more than accidents. Sorry if I'm way off there. If you want to prevent death and get commission for doing good work you'll probably get richer and save more lives working at solving poor life style choices like obesity. Surely phone related automobile deaths are less than drink driving.

Have to disagree with this. The top five killers of people are listed as diseases. While some are treatable and like (obesity) may be preventable in some cases, talking or texting on a phone are conscious acts, not a disease nobody asked for. That is 100% treatable. And the ripple effects after deaths and injury are high insurance rates, damaged vehicles and road ways, cost of calling out emergency road and air crews, etc. Its an epidemic among a large portion of the population...an elected disease.

[imwjl]

Originally Posted by jhmulkey

Everyone has their calling and cause. Some may feel a passion to deal with distracted driving issues, while others may commit their time to health issues or violence issues. I say good on them no matter which problem they're trying to help with. A life saved from a motor vehicle death due to distracted driving is just as important as a life saved from any of those other things (not saying you disagree; just emphasizing).

Originally Posted by GHS

Have to disagree with this. The top five killers of people are listed as diseases. While some are treatable and like (obesity) may be preventable in some cases, talking or texting on a phone are conscious acts, not a disease nobody asked for. That is 100% treatable. And the ripple effects after deaths and injury are high insurance rates, damaged vehicles and road ways, cost of calling out emergency road and air crews, etc. Its an epidemic among a large portion of the population...an elected disease.

I'm very sensitive to the ramifications of traffic accidents and this danger. Long timers here have probably read my posts about our losing family member to an selfish jerk behind the wheel.

I'm also aware of the technology coming to cars and in a lot of phones. The suggestion to jam signals when better engineering is here and coming just seemed absurd. More absurd having made lifestyle changes that have a positive impact on other problems discussed here.

Transportation is so costly and can be such a mess that it is one of the areas where my inner rebel or inner libertarian thinks about better planning and the economics concept of public goods.

To be fair, my thinking might not make sense because so many people make moves that add to sprawl and make a lot of places conduits vs communities - add to the driving vs reduce it. As said earlier and in other posts, we moved where our driving was cut down, where our kids can walk or bike K-12, and where some transportation is old fashioned foot or pedaling. 11 years in I see how right my wife is. Even if we go to a park or do some recreation via car in free time it's usually less than we used to sit our butts in a car just to go to work and pick up kids.

To be fair, we also know the future or what it should be because we have one car with the semi-autonomous safety system and 5 iPhones with the DND drive feature. Add that my wristwatch vibrates or shouts important things while driving that were looking at an atlas or notes when I was a truck driver.

I'm not saying we don't have a problem. We do have it where some will always be bad drivers, misbehave or do criminal stuff. Better overall transportation systems will help that.

I'm also saying look in the mirror regarding other big problems.

[Bob Womack]

It's so much easier if people just take on personal responsibility.


Bob

[imwjl]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

It's so much easier if people just take on personal responsibility.


Bob

That's a dream I stopped having. Driving a car and leadership in a place with hundreds of employees reminder me all the time.

Regarding our family member killed in a car accident, we can't see how it could have possibly happen if 1 or both drives had a system as simple as Subaru EyeSight.

[RussL30]

Originally Posted by imwjl

I know and associate or meet many more who've moved to places where a lot of time in a car impacts their behavior and well being. There are cases where that long commute is hard to avoid. Situations like jobs in different directions or changed jobs after settling in a place.

I can't go very long looking at my social media feeds seeing people I know and work with complaining about traffic and taking pictures of it where many chose that yet complain about it.

About 11 years ago now we went from 30-40 min one way to commutes that are 1.8 mi for my wife and 4 mi for me. She will still tease me about that because it was her obsession but the reality is we don't even have to answer the phone or look at it when a drive is never more than 15 min, or as long as 22-24 min on a bike.

I'm a leader in an institution with about 600 kids in lessons, programs and teams. Where I work there are hundreds of employees in the state's two major metro areas. I see a whole lot of families who are living 2-3 hour of their day in a car. That seems to create a lot of distracted driving and it looks like a hit to quality of life.

Driving aside, when I visit friends and family in these modern outer ring subdivisions or suburbs I see few people out and knowing each other. They even describe people by what they drive. There's a contrast where their kids are not out as feral kids knowing others in their own neighborhoods.

Again, I know many have to make some choices and long drives that are not ideal but I also know it doesn't have to be that way way for many. Not living that way helps you meet some important standards for health and well being.

Thanks for the reply. Honestly, I would love to have a shorter commute and I will
one day. My wife has about a 10 mile commute but it’s long due to the traffic. Right now we both have great job situations at places we enjoy and we live exactly where we want to. Dealing with the commute is an unfortunate part of that, but it’s worth it to me. I just didn’t feel like that meant I made a poor life choice and just wanted some clarification on what you meant.

[golfreggie]

Of course this is a plague that is rampant in the US, and I assume other nations. What is also unnerving is the new touch screen sound systems. Trying to find a radio station takes a 2yr tech degree. I just got a new 2018 Honda CRV, and I must admit I take operating a "car stereo" as a skill I learned 55 years ago. Now, I must take out the manual and play with it while I am in my garage to begin to have an inkling of how to work it. Technology is great, but I do think we are getting overboard on "entertainment" technology in moving death traps like automobiles. Oh well, so it goes, huh?

[Denny B]

I drive daily and ride motorcycles too, so there's not a day that goes by without me narrowly avoiding being hit, rear ended or run over...

More and more, the main cause of these close calls is cell phone usage by the other party...

I'd like to find a solution, like everyone else...

But the truth is, there IS no solution...

Just like driving under the influence, road rage, etc, all the laws in the world can't STOP people from recklessly endangering their own lives and the lives of others on the road...

All that can be done is to deal with the tragic results...

The world is far too full of people lacking a sense of responsibility for themselves, and who have no respect for others...

You can't legislate that into them...

[jhmulkey]

Originally Posted by Denny B

I drive daily and ride motorcycles too, so there's not a day that goes by without me narrowly avoiding being hit, rear ended or run over...

More and more, the main cause of these close calls is cell phone usage by the other party...

I'd like to find a solution, like everyone else...

But the truth is, there IS no solution...

Just like driving under the influence, road rage, etc, all the laws in the world can't STOP people from recklessly endangering their own lives and the lives of others on the road...

All that can be done is to deal with the tragic results...

The world is far too full of people lacking a sense of responsibility for themselves, and who have no respect for others...

You can't legislate that into them...

There's no "perfect" solution, if that's what you mean, but there's certainly more that can be done throw up our hands. Higher fines/penalties and stricter enforcement would definitely keep many people at bay out of fear of losing their money/license or going to jail if they try to drive once their license is suspended. I don't drive while on a cell phone, but if I did, if I knew a cop observing me doing so could result in a multi-hundred dollar ticket and points on my license, I guarantee you I would not take that risk, and many others wouldn't either.

[HHP]

I don't know. Other drivers seem very attentive and polite when I drive my old VW.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by HHP

I don't know. Other drivers seem very attentive and polite when I drive my old VW.

And if I was standing up in back with my tropic fly fishing costume on, I imagine they would clear a path

[jhmulkey]

Originally Posted by HHP

I don't know. Other drivers seem very attentive and polite when I drive my old VW.

I can't say I don't encounter inattentive or rude drivers, but I can say they rarely make that mistake twice.

[Denny B]

Originally Posted by jhmulkey

There's no "perfect" solution, if that's what you mean, but there's certainly more that can be done throw up our hands. Higher fines/penalties and stricter enforcement would definitely keep many people at bay out of fear of losing their money/license or going to jail if they try to drive once their license is suspended. I don't drive while on a cell phone, but if I did, if I knew a cop observing me doing so could result in a multi-hundred dollar ticket and points on my license, I guarantee you I would not take that risk, and many others wouldn't either.

I'm not saying that higher fines or suspensions wouldn't give those caught something to think about...

But the reality is, I travel regularly in an area covering 3 states, other states fairly regularly...enforcement is almost non existent, while 5 minutes won't pass without seeing a dozen drivers using cell phones...

There's certainly no "perfect" solutions, and most of the non perfect ones don't help much in the real world...and unfortunately what Ron White said is true:

"You can't fix stupid."

My long term policy is that I ride a bike and drive a car like everyone on the road is out to kill me... some of them really are...

[jhmulkey]

Originally Posted by Denny B

But the reality is, I travel regularly in an area covering 3 states, other states fairly regularly...enforcement is almost non existent, while 5 minutes won't pass without seeing a dozen drivers using cell phones...

Well, that's exactly my point. We need strict, draconian-like enforcement. You can't fix stupid in some cases, but you can deal with it. And obviously your defensive-driving maxim at the end should always be followed, because all it takes is 1 mishap.

[Denny B]

Originally Posted by jhmulkey

We need strict, draconian-like enforcement.

Absolutely!