Origin of this riff

[NormanKliman]

I’m looking for the origin of a really basic riff. Typically, it’s a bend on the third string and a note or notes a fret higher on the second and/or first strings. You’ll know it as soon as you hear it. It’s in this tutorial for Skynyrd’s “Gimme Three Steps," at the beginning and at 3:49.

I’m wondering if we can identify the earliest recordings of this riff. It was played throughout the 1970s but I’m not finding many examples from the 1960s. “Gimme Three Steps” was released in 1973. I hear it in the Stones’ “Honky Tonk Women,” from 1969 (I think it’s Mick Taylor, not Keith Richards).

Anyone know of earlier recordings or older guitarists who played it? James Burton plays it in a video of a live performance from a few years ago, but I don’t know if he was playing it in the 1950s or 1960s.

Thanks in advance for any info.

[jseth]

Oh yeah, that one has been around since the fifties or earlier... Chuck Berry did it, and I'd guess that, were you to dig into some 40's rhythm and blues music, you'd hear it there as well.

Probably originated by the early electric blues players, but I would not be surprised to hear it done by the early acoustic blues players, too... which would put it back in the teens, twenties or thirties, easily...

[NormanKliman]

Ah, Chuck Berry. I hadn’t thought of him! Thanks jseth, I’ll have a listen.

I don’t recall hearing it in old blues, although there’s a lot I haven’t heard. I have no knowledge of more modern blues guitarists like Otis Rush, Buddy Guy... I figure between blues, Bakersfield and some Brits (just to name three Bs), there must have been some exponents of that idea in the 1960s (or earlier, as you said).

My guess is that what guided guitarists into playing that idea was banjo and open G tuning on the guitar. I’ve heard some bluegrass banjo licks that sound similar (when played slowly, of course).

Any more suggestions?

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Pretty sure it was included in the deal Robert Johnson made at the crossroads.

[mc1]

Just a couple few thoughts.

- I think it will be hard to find the origin, as licks like this are as old as country blues guitar. And there are many subtle variations, like if you play both notes at the same time, or one first and while it is still ringing play the other.

- To me, with the whole step bend on the 3rd string, it seems more like an electric guitar lick.

- The country/country-blues version, like in 3 Steps, bends the 2nd note of the scale up to the major 3rd with the 5th on top. The more bluesy version with the minor pentatonic bends the 4th of the scale up to the 5th with the dominant 7th on top. That has a really Jimi Hendrix feel to it, although he certainly used the major pentatonic as well, and riffs like this predate him.

- I believe this technique is called an oblique bend, where one note is bend and played against another unbent note.

[mc1]

Originally Posted by NormanKliman

My guess is that what guided guitarists into playing that idea was banjo and open G tuning on the guitar. I’ve heard some bluegrass banjo licks that sound similar (when played slowly, of course).

My guess might be that it was stumbled upon based on the most common and ubiquitous pentatonic scale pattern, shown here:



It's so easy to bend the 3rd string with the 3rd finger, and the notes are right there. I'd guess someone just happened upon it with their fingers and liked the sound.

[NormanKliman]

Originally Posted by mc1

I think it will be hard to find the origin, as licks like this are as old as country blues guitar.

Agreed. Finding the first recording would take some serious research. I should have titled the thread “origins.” I’d be satisfied just to find some examples that predate Honky Tonk Women (1969).

Originally Posted by mc1

And there are many subtle variations, like if you play both notes at the same time, or one first and while it is still ringing play the other.

Yeah, and even playing the high note(s) first and undoing the bend afterward. Still the same basic idea.

Originally Posted by mc1

To me, with the whole step bend on the 3rd string, it seems more like an electric guitar lick.

Seems likely, as bending like that is a lot harder on an acoustic. I'm betting it wasn't recorded until the 1950s.

Originally Posted by mc1

I'd guess someone just happened upon it with their fingers and liked the sound.

Yeah, the riff is right there in that pentatonic box. Once you start soloing in that position, playing all the notes, it’s not far.

I dunno; I’m still hearing the banjo influence, but I admit my head’s kind of stuck in the country vibe of Honky Tonk Women and southern rock in general.

[mc1]

Originally Posted by NormanKliman

I dunno; I’m still hearing the banjo influence, but I admit my head’s kind of stuck in the country vibe of Honky Tonk Women and southern rock in general.

That's a pretty reasonable theory, although I would lean more toward county/country blues/blues. Does southern rock go back much before the Allman Brothers?

Edit: Someone like Lonnie Mack comes to mind, who like Chuck Berry, liked the double stops, but I can't say I specifically know of this lick.

[NormanKliman]

Originally Posted by mc1

...Does southern rock go back much before the Allman Brothers?

I'll assume that's not a rhetorical question, although I don't know enough to answer with any confidence. In the 70s, I became aware of what is widely regarded as Southern rock (Skynyrd), and I haven't really listened to much of what came before them. I've just had a look at Wikipedia, in case a group had slipped my mind, and there's mention of all the 50s rockers with Southern roots, but it looks like the Allman Brothers were the first well-know group to play in the style that we might call Southern rock today.

Maybe Creedence Clearwater Revival recorded that riff before The Stones. I seem to recall hearing it in their recordings, and I see their debut album was recorded in 1968. Time for me to listen before I post any more about this.

The Wikipedia entry mention Lonnie Mack, too, although I can't say I've ever heard his music. I'll have a listen; thanks for the input, mc1.

[Ray175]

This type of riff is S.O.P. on a pedal steel (dating back to Paul Bigsby's work in the late 1940's) and on its predecessor the lap-steel guitar (dating back to the 1920's)......
Any string instrument with a glissando capability like a violin can easily play this riff, and you'll find examples in Stéphane Grappelli's work with Django Rheinhardt in the Hot Club de France in the 1930's and 40's.

[NormanKliman]

Hi Ray175,

Pedal steel, yeah, I can sort of hear that in my head, and I think it's pretty much the same idea. About Grappelli and the violin, I'm more interested at this time in identifying early examples of the riff as played on some kind of guitar. Thanks for the input!