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  #1  
Old 05-03-2020, 02:32 PM
thegreatgumbino thegreatgumbino is offline
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Default Composite Acoustics Cargo Questions

Newbie to CF guitars here. Been wanting to get a smaller couch guitar/outdoor guitar and stumbled upon the CA Cargo, which seems to check most of the boxes for me. Would love a McPherson Touring, but alas it is out of my price range.

1) What is the going rate for a used Cargo without a pickup? There is a used Peavey Cargo near me, but they're asking $1,150 which is ridiculous when I've seen them new without pickup for $1,299. The last two sold on Ebay (via bids) went for $770 and $730 and both had pickups.

2) Is it doable to install a pickup after the fact? I don't necessarily need this, but might be nice in the future.

3) I keep all my guitars in Standard D tuning. I read one member here successfully keeps his Cargo in this tuning. Any more feedback on this? I realize heavy gauge strings are needed to achieve this without too much slop.

4) It seems the Peavey era Cargos would be the way to go if available due to the reinforced neck, correct?

5) Are there any issues with the RAW CF finish on the Peavey's? I've read some folks prefer the RT finish on the pre-Peavey, and I think I read some folks didn't like the gloss finish option. Is the RT finish the one that looks similar to rhino liner?

6) Is there anything specific to CF guitars to watch for when buying used?

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 05-03-2020, 03:04 PM
Earl49 Earl49 is offline
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If you see a new or excellent condition used Cargo for $1200, you probably should grab it. About three years ago they were $1200 new for pure acoustic and $1299 with pickup. Subtract ~$100 for RT or raw finish. Then one day they suddenly went up to $1800 - which is probably a more sustainable price for a carbon fiber instrument. We happened to buy a gloss blue one with a pickup about two months before the price increase. I don't think that local store has sold another CA since the price jump, but cannot be sure. It seems like they always have the exact same ones on the wall during every visit, including ours now priced at $1800. I doubt we would part with ours in mint condition for less than ~$1200 unless we were doing someone we knew a favor. It can sit in the hall closet for years if we cannot get that amount back out of it -- 2/3 of new prices.

Cargo has a rather short 22.75 scale length and therefore should need heavier strings (medium gauge or 56-13) to equalize the tension of light gauge on a 25.5" scale guitar. But my wife plays lights on her Peavey Cargo, and in lowered Open G tuning (DGDGBD). I think the strings are a bit too floppy, but she likes them just fine. She is a somewhat infrequent player and does not have serious callouses, so she likes light strings. I have a couple of guitars that live in D standard tuning to make certain songs easier for my voice. They wear medium gauge strings, as do most of the guitars sued for my various slack-key tunings. When you are lowering that bass E string down to C or Bb, it needs to be heavier than a 0.053".

I have some CF guitars with truss rods, and some without. For those without truss rods, I have never missed the adjustable capability. None have ever perceptibly shifted action or needed remedial set-up work, except for eventual wear of the nut slots and saddle. They don't even need truss road adjustments when changing tunings or when moving up one notch heavier in string gauge -- like mediums at E or tuned down to D standard.

The biggest benefit with a carbon guitar is if the neck angle is right on day one, it is unlikely ever to change or move. The flip side is if it is not right to start, it can be virtually impossible to fix neck angles later.
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Old 05-04-2020, 08:43 AM
Jim in TC Jim in TC is offline
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I agree that if you see a new Cargo around $1200 or $1300 you should grab. I managed to pick one up at around $1800 just before the big price drop that turned out to be temporary. I am seeing them for around $1450 new now, at, for example, LA Guitar. But I am wondering if they are still being made? I also agree that I would not part with mine for less than $1100 or more, though I have seen them on AGF for around $1000 on occasion.

Anyway, I am very pleased with mine and tend to run light strings (will try mediums next time I buy). It is an exceptionally small guitar with a very short scale. I find it comfortable but not all do. Tone and volume punch above its size, but it is still no dread.

Another guitar for you to look at is Journey, which may also tick most or all of your boxes and comes in (last I noticed) at around $1200 for the small body instrument. It can be bought either with a folding neck or fixed (same price, I think) and I found it impressive when I tried one out at Elderly Instruments. I did not compare directly with Cargo at that time.
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Old 05-04-2020, 11:42 AM
Fixedgear60 Fixedgear60 is offline
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As others have stated... Cargos are an excellent choice for couch/outdoor guitar and had one for a number of years. If you need electronics I HIGHLY recommend buying one factory installed. Getting access to install one is difficult given the shape and small off set hole. Also K&K passive pickup do not work well for some reason with lots of balancing issues.
There were a number of threads on this back in the day ... if I remember correctly. Best to purchase with original electronics. I would jump on a used on from 999 - 1300 as people have said. BTW... the gloss finished one can chip .. so I would avoid. Saw a number of the cool carbon burst ones used and all had finishing chips around the edges... I am picky and find the raw finish my favorite ... no fuss no muss... to worry about... good luck...it was my first CF crush and somedays still miss the little critter ... but not at these new proces... I bought my raw with electronics for $999.

Last edited by Fixedgear60; 05-04-2020 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 05-04-2020, 12:08 PM
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Acousticado Acousticado is offline
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I’ve owned an ‘08 Cargo with charcoal RT (road tough) finish since new when they first came out. I paid $725 for it back then. Mine has factory electronics, the guitar has no issues whatsoever. I love the little bugger. The RT finish is great, very durable. It’s truly a no fuss, no muss guitar. I’ll never part with it. It is small, perfect couch guitar and so much more. I can still sell it for at least what I paid for it, if not more, so it has held it’s value more than any other guitar I own...except the ‘58 Strat I once owned...that one was best ROI ever.
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Old 05-04-2020, 02:45 PM
Earl49 Earl49 is offline
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Had I bought a CA Cargo after first seeing one at a music camp in Hawaii in FEB 2008, it would have been $900 new and shipped by 2nd Day Air to Alaska from Hilo, HI. A friend brought one back to AK from that camp, but I had too many bags already.

We were at the 2010 NAMM show and I spent a lot of time at the Composite Acoustics booth. Ted at LA Guitar Sales bought the entire stock from the booth while at the show, and the company coincidentally went under a few months later. Cargo's quickly disappeared from stores until Peavey eventually resurrected that brand. We ended up with our current Cargo when my wife concluded that it absolutely kicked the butt of her GS Mini (although ~3X the price at that time). They sound great, especially given the size. We have a local store here that stocks the CA brand, with a couple of Cargo, Gx, Ox and an occasional Dreadnought on display in their two stores. They also have extras in the warehouse according to the owner.
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Old 05-05-2020, 04:55 PM
thegreatgumbino thegreatgumbino is offline
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Thanks for the replies everyone. It's greatly appreciated. Based on the couple used auction sales on Ebay, I was anticipating them to go for less used. If I'm looking at upping the price, I may just hold off and work towards a McPherson Touring. It's a slippery slope
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Old 05-05-2020, 05:08 PM
tbeltrans tbeltrans is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreatgumbino View Post
Thanks for the replies everyone. It's greatly appreciated. Based on the couple used auction sales on Ebay, I was anticipating them to go for less used. If I'm looking at upping the price, I may just hold off and work towards a McPherson Touring. It's a slippery slope
I suspect that you might like the Touring. I have a couple of the original CA Guitars Cargos and , contrary to rumor, not all of those had problems. CA Guitars did have quality control issues back then, but if you purchased from a guitar shop that cared about selling quality product, they would have inspected these guitars before putting them up for sale and sending back the problematic ones. None of my Cargos exhibits those issues and I have had them since around 2007 or so, back when they were less than $800.

Having said that, to me the Touring is what the Cargo would have been, had it benefited from serious R & D. The Cargo is still a very good and unique guitar, but for fit and finish and balanced sound, the Touring has all that. I own the Touring and the Sable, so I can make those comparisons.

I have not looked to see what Cargos sell for lately, but was shocked several years ago to see that one cost more new than two of mine did back when I bought them. If Cargos are approaching $1800, then for sure I would save up (not borrow!!!!!) to get a Touring. It will be worth it in the long run.

Tony
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Old 05-05-2020, 05:23 PM
Fixedgear60 Fixedgear60 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbeltrans View Post
If Cargos are approaching $1800, then for sure I would save up (not borrow!!!!!) to get a Touring. It will be worth it in the long run.

Tony
I have to agree with Tony.. Touring is not only an exceptional travel/couch guitar.. it is just an exceptional guitar that hold its own with any full size guitar on or off stage.
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Old 05-05-2020, 05:39 PM
Earl49 Earl49 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbeltrans View Post
....contrary to rumor, not all of those had problems. CA Guitars did have quality control issues back then, but if you purchased from a guitar shop that cared about selling quality product, they would have inspected these guitars before putting them up for sale and sending back the problematic ones.....
As Tony said, and it bears repeating: CA had some QC problems -- mostly bad neck angles -- toward the end of their run. Unfortunately a bad neck angle is not feasible to repair on most CF guitars, but that is a strictly an initial manufacturing defect. It comes out of the mold wrong and is not something that crops up later. I do not recall hearing anything similar about the Peavey era CA's.

With all the love for them, I'd better avoid trying a McPherson Sable should that opportunity arise (never seen one in person, just the Touring). I'm pretty happy with my Emerald X20's these days.
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Old 05-11-2020, 11:55 AM
BillCoplin BillCoplin is offline
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Default PSA - Cargo

As an owner of both a Composite Acoustics GX and a Cargo, I can say I love them both. The Cargo is always with me and is a great investment. My son loved it so much, he bought one as well. We both purchased used under $900 within the last 16 months. I just noticed a similar deal on a used one on Reverb:

https://reverb.com/item/33501538-com...ntent=33501538

No affiliation but that’s a reasonable deal on a great guitar!
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Old 05-11-2020, 12:11 PM
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Here's one for $895 on Reverb https://reverb.com/item/33501538-com...-travel-guitar ....
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Old 05-11-2020, 02:23 PM
tbeltrans tbeltrans is offline
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At these used prices, they still selling for noticeably more than I pad new for each of three of my Cargos. Back then, they were around $750 or so brand new. Given a choice today, it would be worth the upcharge to get a Touring instead, nice and unique as the Cargo is.

Tony
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Old 05-11-2020, 03:00 PM
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The Cargo is a great instrument. I had both the pre- and post- CA and would recommend the post. Peavey made a big jump in quality with the Cargo, well worth the extra $300 or $400 you might pay on the used market.
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Old 05-11-2020, 03:19 PM
tbeltrans tbeltrans is offline
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I have no regrets or problems with my pre-Peavey Cargos. As I have mentioned in other posts, I bought all mine from The Podium. Marty Reynolds inspected each one as it arrived, and sent the problematic ones back. As is typical with carbon fiber, if you get a good one, you got a good one.

If the McPherson Touring had been available back then, and as good a quality product as McPherson has always put their own name on, I would have gone for that instead. However, at that time, the Cargo was unique and the carbon fiber world was very much smaller than it is today (which is still quite small in the grand scheme of things). For a number of years, the Cargos were my only guitars and they served me well.

I suppose the problem with buying a pre-Peavey Cargo (i.e. used) is not knowing whether it had been checked out thoroughly or was just shipped out by the vendor, passing through their hands just to collect their cut. I really miss The Podium because they cared enough to make we got what we were expecting. I am not saying that nobody else does that, but The Podium was (for me) a known quantity for many years and in a shop like that, you form personal relationships that continue long after the shop is gone.

Marty Reynolds really does know what he is doing. He is one of the best know luthier types around the Twin Cities and I have been bringing my guitars to him now for about 30 years, so when he says a given guitar passes muster, I know it does. He picked out all three of my Cargos, and that is one reason why I hang on to them even though I have the McPhersons.

So my final point on the Cargo is that there is a rumor that is PARTIALLY true that a number of the pre-Peavey Cargos had quality issues, but certainly not all of them. Those of us here who were at the old MacNichol forum know this and I would hope that among this group, all have the "good" Cargos. I was the guy who posted a lot about my experimentation with K & K pickups in the Cargo, modifying various EQ type pedals to handle it. These attempts were quite successful and the Cargos all still have the K $ K pickups in them.

Edit: I just realized that this pre-Peavey Cargo thing is similar to 1970s Martins, where for a while folks around here were saying not to buy them because the bridges were set wrong and they had intonation problems. That was a number of years ago, and then others spoke up about getting really nice problem-free Martins from that era and that SOME of the Martins made during that time exhibited these issues, but certainly not all. Of course again, that raises the issue for somebody buying a used Martin from that era - which are the "good" ones?

Tony
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Last edited by tbeltrans; 05-11-2020 at 03:53 PM.
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