Avid announces a new interface and HDX Hybrid platform "Carbon"

[KevWind]

Realizing that we Pro Tools users are relatively few her on AGF
But I found the idea of Avid moving into a new system for HDX interesting

And while the new Carbon interface is indeed spendy @ $4k it appears to offer a simple intuitive system that utilizes HDX DSP for sub 1ms latency and apparently integrates seamlessly with native processing as well . Has quite a bit of I/O capability and is a 1 rack space unit.
It does require an Ethernet connection on the computer
And the best part is the HDX processing is in the interface itself and does not require a Tower computer with PCIe slots

If anybody is interested in more info here, and the video from the launch event https://connect.avid.com/Avid-Carbon...20#WebinarList

[jim1960]

I was excited for half a minute when I heard about this but I need 16 channels and this only gives me 8 unless I add another piece of hardware. $4K for 8 channels is just too steep when I can get 16 channels from an Apollo X16 which sells new for $500 less.

But even that aside, in recent years it's really felt like AVID doesn't value customers like me. Up until Carbon, there wasn't an interface in their lineup I could use unless I wanted to upgrade to the HD/Ultimate software. That said, if AVID had also released a 16 channel version of Carbon without the preamps, I'd have given it serious consideration. But they didn't and now I have an X16 on the way.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by jim1960

I was excited for half a minute when I heard about this but I need 16 channels and this only gives me 8 unless I add another piece of hardware. $4K for 8 channels is just too steep when I can get 16 channels from an Apollo X16 which sells new for $500 less.

But even that aside, in recent years it's really felt like AVID doesn't value customers like me. Up until Carbon, there wasn't an interface in their lineup I could use unless I wanted to upgrade to the HD/Ultimate software. That said, if AVID had also released a 16 channel version of Carbon without the preamps, I'd have given it serious consideration. But they didn't and now I have an X16 on the way.

Jim I think the Apollo will be a great unit and certainly am not attempting to convince you otherwise or argue BUT

I guess I am a bit confused or misunderstanding some of what you are saying ?
Now I completely get not wanting to pay for preamps you don't need. But in this case that would be $500 additional, for 8 mic preamps that are said to be pristine quality . And four individually controllable and mixable Headphone Outputs

And it appears the Apollo is an all DB 25 analog input connection, yes ?
So I assume you already have a patch bay with a couple DB 25's coming out of it to get the 16 channels , yes ? If so then seems that you would not need any additional hardware. (Again not arguing just trying to understand)
Because the Carbon does offer an additional 8 channels of analog input via 1- DB 25 plus the existing 8 channels of line/mic inputs with preamps. for a total of 16 analog inputs possible. As well as additional digital I/O and the four Headphone outputs

Now it is true that it only has 8 channels of HDX DSP processing on board But because it is a new hybrid system you can also simultaneously record 8 channels with Native processing as well, for 16 Or more.

Again a moot point for you and understandable, I understand your frustration with AVID as they have been stagnant in the "In between" the hobby home and big commercial studio market..... But this new unit does seem to address that market And honestly as an HD Native user (which was supposed to be their "in between" solution, (that came out in 2011)..... This unit is $1500 less than buying a new HD Native system and seems to me like a much much better solution. As always being individuals YMMV . Looking forward to your thoughts on the Apollo once you get it up and running , Kev

[Brent Hahn]

Maybe I'm not reading carefully, bit it looks to me like it has 8 a/d's. Incorrect?

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn

Maybe I'm not reading carefully, bit it looks to me like it has 8 a/d's. Incorrect?

Yes I think you and Jim are correct , I just read PT Experts writeup and I was was mistaken I assumed it have conversion for all analog inputs but apparently the 8 DB inputs are mirrors of the 8 mic inputs so you can have 16 channels of analog connection but only use 8 at a time. Which for many studio's could indeed be limiting


From the PT Expert article : https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/pro-tools-carbon-review#:~:text=It%20is%20Mac%20only%20at,doesn't%2 0easily%20support%20AVB.
On the input side, we have 24 inputs, 25 if you count the talkback mic, as the choice for the analogue inputs is an either/or choice between Mic/Line/Instrument on inputs 1&2 and Mic/Line for inputs 3-8. The Mic inputs are all rear-mounted combi XLR/TRS connectors but thankfully the provision of the same 8 analogue ins on D-sub means that a mic and a line source can be left connected at the same time, though not used at the same time.
So as Jim said for analog input it is essentially an 8 channel system'

Some other limitations :
Apparently currently Mac only because of AVB over Ethernet protocol ( apparently not easily accomplished on PC) and only newer Mac's with TB ports
Laptops will need a TB to Ethernet adaptor
Only one Carbon unit can be run in PT at this time
And you have to be running macOS 10.15.7

[jim1960]

Here's the Carbon back panel. The Dsub is labeled 1-8 with true preamp bypass. So what I take that to mean is if you use the Dsub, the preamps are not available to you unless you either disconnect the Dsub or bypass it to reengage the preamps (if there's some way to do that without pulling the Dsub cables). I'm pretty sure to access channels 9 and above, you'd have to use a second piece of hardware like my Rosetta 800, for example. My X8p has a similar setup. The X16 has two sets of Dsub connections. A pair for 1-8 and another pair for 9-16. So I don't need another unit to use the channels above 8. What the X16 doesn't have is any monitor control, but I have the Dangerous Monitor ST that can handle all that.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by jim1960

Here's the Carbon back panel. The Dsub is labeled 1-8 with true preamp bypass. So what I take that to mean is if you use the Dsub, the preamps are not available to you unless you either disconnect the Dsub or bypass it to reengage the preamps (if there's some way to do that without pulling the Dsub cables). I'm pretty sure to access channels 9 and above, you'd have to use a second piece of hardware like my Rosetta 800, for example. My X8p has a similar setup. The X16 has two sets of Dsub connections. A pair for 1-8 and another pair for 9-16. So I don't need another both to use the channels above 8. What the X16 doesn't have is any monitor control, but I have the Dangerous Monitor ST that can handle all that.

You got your post out while I was still editing mine and again Yes you are correct

So understandable for you not a great fit at all. For me however it's pretty interesting. The added expense for me is I would have to get a new computer But honestly I have been thinking of getting rid of my Mac Pro tower and looking at a new iMac.

[Brent Hahn]

So yeah, 8 converters. Same as my old 192 but a little better-sounding. You can get another 8 (or is it 16?) using another box of some sort that outputs ADAT. In my case that's a Yamaha 01V digital mixer, although I hardly ever need that many inputs.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn

So yeah, 8 converters. Same as my old 192 but a little better-sounding. You can get another 8 (or is it 16?) using another box of some sort that outputs ADAT. In my case that's a Yamaha 01V digital mixer, although I hardly ever need that many inputs.

For me recoding only myself and not playing drums I only ever used 3 mic inputs at once ,,, 1 for vocal and 2 for a pair of guitar mic's ..

However I have two outboard FX units to hook up a 2 channel Comp and a 2 channel Reverb the comp is analog only so that will tie up two more channels The Reverb can be either analog or digital BUT it only has AES I/O and the Carbon only has ADAT (Not sure why they did not include AES like my Avid OMNI) so I guess that means 2 more analog channels.... But that still leaves me 4 mic input channels which is more than I need

I think the Carbon has two ADAT banks of connections but on the Sweetwater review I think he indicated it was either 8 or 16 depending on sample rate used ?

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by KevWind

You got your post out while I was still editing mine and again Yes you are correct

So understandable for you not a great fit at all. For me however it's pretty interesting. The added expense for me is I would have to get a new computer But honestly I have been thinking of getting rid of my Mac Pro tower and looking at a new iMac.
For me the true bypass is nice for my outboard mic pre and compressor

If I could get away with 8 channels, I'd be all over that and happy to have the better integration between my interface and daw. And getting UA's Console software out of my life would add to the joy. But the X16 will serve me well and leave about $1500-1600 still in my pocket. However, as I said earlier, I'd gladly pay the extra if there was a 16 channel version of Carbon without preamps.

The early notification has the X16 arriving from Cali next Thursday. I'll be un-wiring my rack over the next few days and I'll have to re-label my patchbays. No need for any new cables though. I already have the 4 Dsub-TRS cables I'll need, so that's a bonus.

[KevWind]

With more research it appears that Avid (once again) has a somewhat complex and confusing set of options , as far as moving forward with software plans for this new interface

here is a FAQ about Carbon and the software

https://avid.secure.force.com/pkb/ar...FAQ/Carbon-FAQ

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by KevWind

With more research it appears that Avid (once again) has a somewhat complex and confusing set of options , as far as moving forward with software plans for this new interface

ProTools has long been a confusing jumble of purchase options. And with the recent name changes, I've given up trying to keep it sorted in my head. At this point, all I know for sure is that I have whatever version ISN'T "HD" or "Ultimate" and that I'm paid through 2026.

That FAQ did answer the question I had as to whether PT was required for Carbon. The language I'd seen up until now was a bit ambiguous on that point. But PT being required wouldn't be a deal-breaker for me because at this point I'm never switching DAWs. I really do wish AVID had come out with a 16 channel box. I would so much prefer that over the X16 and I'd have talked myself right into spending that extra money for the seamless integration.

[KevWind]

The more I research this unit the more interested I become.
Since 8 analog inputs will more than do me now and into the future, I am really liking what I am hearing about it's internal clocking ,conversion , and mic pre's. As well as the idea of ABV ethernet connection to computer. and No drivers needed with that kind of connection .
plus even though I have PT ultimate it will run on PT regular if I wanted to switch to it and the less expensive renewal fee.

And apparently the limit to eight is only in A/D conversion, apparently your can run a additional channels in DSP mode before you max out the DSP chips which can handle more than one channel each.

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by KevWind

The more I research this unit the more interested I become.

If I were you, I'd be all over it. If they come out with a 16 channel version, the X16 that arrived last night might be up for sale in a hurry.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by jim1960

If I were you, I'd be all over it. If they come out with a 16 channel version, the X16 that arrived last night might be up for sale in a hurry.

Yes I'm pretty serious and most likely going to do it, it's just a matter of when ? Because it would also require me getting a new current fairly loaded 27" iMac , also .......

Currently my independent Pro Audio store guy I have dealt with for 15 years (who buy the way does compete price wise with the online dealers )
Is researching what my current system, 2 Avid Omni's, and my older Mid 2010 highly upgraded Mac Pro cheese grater/with HDN Pcie card might be worth

BTW he also does good quality reasonable custom cables and will be doing some for me because I am going to have to switch my Bricasti to DB 25 analog I/O because the Carbon does not have AES XLR connections like my Omni