#1
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Construction and tone (Martin 17 vs 18 questions!)
I'm mostly an electric player, so I'm somewhat uninformed when it comes to acoustics. I've been looking at small or medium sized acoustics, in particular Martin 00 and 000 models for around $1500. Looking at the lineup, the 000-17 just jumped out at me. Love the sunburst finish and lack of decoration. Looking at the next step up (above budget, used or new) I often hear the 000-18 being recommended. When people compare these two guitars, they say the 17 sounds "bluesy", "dry", and "fundamental", while the 18 is described as sounding "full" and with lots of sustain. I can get those differences. But looking at the spec sheet, what makes them sound this way?
They're both all solid spruce and mahogany guitars, have scalloped X-bracing, same neck carve, nut and bridge widths, and scale lengths. From what I can see, the differences are: 1. The 17 has a smaller CNC cut simple dovetail joint, the 18 has the traditional hand shaped dovetail. 2. The 17 has 5/16" braces, the 18 has 1/4" braces. 3. The 17 is "mahogany", while the 18 is "genuine mahogany". I see that Martin just classifies several woods into mahogany, so they might very well be different woods. 4. The 17 has a rosewood fretboard and straight cut bridge, the 18 uses ebony with a belly. 5. The 17 has a satin finish, the 18 is gloss. So what makes them sound different? Thanks for reading! |
#2
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Imho, the neck joint and braces account for most of the tonal differences between those models.
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#3
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The Strings!!!
000-17 factory fitted with Monel Retro 000-18 factory fitted with Lifespan Phosphor Bronze Just that small change would give the tone difference you describe. (it does seem quite a price jump for a string upgrade!!!!!!)
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I'm learning to flatpick and fingerpick guitar to accompany songs. I've played and studied traditional noter/drone mountain dulcimer for many years. And I used to play dobro in a bluegrass band. |
#4
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The 000-18 will have Honduran mahogany. The 000-17 will have Sipo or sapele. In Martin-speak that’s the difference between “Genuine Mahogany” and “mahogany.”
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2021 Edmonds OM-28RS - Sunburst (Adi/Old Growth Honduran) 2014 Walker Clark Fork (Adi/Honduran Rosewood)…incoming FOR SALE: 2023 Martin 000-15SM 12 fret w/ K&K mini |
#5
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Definitely the bracing and dovetail. Also the 17s just feel much more lightly built which helps to give them that unique sound. Not sure if the woods on that series are thinner or something else, but if you hold one in each hand, the 17s are a bit lighter than the 18s.
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#6
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I don't think it will be sapele on the 000-17. Martin declare if that wood is used. It is more likely to be khaya from Africa or Madagascar (African Mahogany), which is the most used substitute, and the closest. The "Honduran Mahogany" of the 000-18 is listed as "Genuine Mahogany" by Martin which I expect comes from Asian plantations (same species re-planted) rather than Central America.
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I'm learning to flatpick and fingerpick guitar to accompany songs. I've played and studied traditional noter/drone mountain dulcimer for many years. And I used to play dobro in a bluegrass band. |
#7
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Quote:
Suppose someone decided to build two D-18's, as identical as possible (which is a big caveat), but one with a traditional dovetail joint and another with a simple dovetail. Wonder what the tonal difference would be. |
#8
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Quote:
My opinion... Martin
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***************************** Gibson L-00 Standard 2018 Yamaha FS5 2020 Gibson J-45 Standard 2020 |
#9
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EDIT: I stand corrected, was notified 17 series now uses standard X bracing...
Bracing differences on Martin’s site here: https://www.martinguitar.com/feature...cing-patterns/ Last edited by zoopeda; 11-23-2020 at 01:06 PM. |
#10
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Quote:
This is what he shared with me: Quote:
Last edited by UncleJesse; 11-22-2020 at 03:39 PM. |
#11
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I’m a long time Martin player and collector and I simply don’t believe the neck joint matters. That’s just my opinion. The newest 000-17 and 000-18 differ mainly cosmetically. The wood grades are all visual not tonal. I’m sure the variations between 3 000-18s would not be any different if you played two 000-18 with a 000-17. In my opinion, the best guitar for the money is a used 000-18GE, but if you’re coming from electric you may prefer the thinner neck and saddle spacing on the newer “re-imagined” ones.
Finally, make sure you understand MSRP, MAP, and that our sponsors will sell you a new Martin at 40% off MSRP. That will narrow the price difference a bit. |
#12
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Quote:
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2021 Edmonds OM-28RS - Sunburst (Adi/Old Growth Honduran) 2014 Walker Clark Fork (Adi/Honduran Rosewood)…incoming FOR SALE: 2023 Martin 000-15SM 12 fret w/ K&K mini |
#13
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Quote:
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I'm learning to flatpick and fingerpick guitar to accompany songs. I've played and studied traditional noter/drone mountain dulcimer for many years. And I used to play dobro in a bluegrass band. |
#14
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Quote:
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#15
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For what it's worth, I think the finish makes more of a difference than the type of neck joint.
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1 dreadnought, 1 auditorium, 1 concert, and 2 travel guitars. |