internal mics.. why so many different kinds?

[hann]

We all know internal mics are prone to feedback, some more than others...

we all know hypercardioids are less prone cos of a more narrow pattern...

why don't most manufacturers just make hypers?

the K&K silver bullet's soft card, i've seen some omnis even!

what's up with that!!

*i'm just waiting for chris or sdel to share their stuff and boast about the C416!

[alohachris]

Aloha,

Thanks for the best wishes on the other site, braddah Hann!

Yeah I know, it sucks that AKG stopped making that wonderful hyper 416 internal mic. Not quite as clear a result with the 516 cardioid replacement. Still, it's better than a Silver Bullet.

BUT...... I'd check out the new DPA's. Rave reviews in the recording industry.

Guess I'll hold on to my three 416's. I don't suppose Greg at Pendulum would have anymore in stock or replacement suggestions for you? Call him. He might have one.

A Hui Hou!
alohachris

[hann]

what's DPA?

mm so Chris, any idea why these pickup companies make their mics in the way they do?

[ericcsong]

Originally Posted by alohachris

BUT...... I'd check out the new DPA's. Rave reviews in the recording industry.

Guess I'll hold on to my three 416's. I don't suppose Greg at Pendulum would have anymore in stock or replacement suggestions for you? Call him. He might have one.

A Hui Hou!
alohachris

I was actually checking out DPA's 4099. its an external mic that is attached to the guitar! I might pick one up, but it on the pricey side!

[sdelsolray]

One of the best internal mics is the Joe Mills. It's an omni with no circuitry to adjust the sound - the concept being the user will have a preamp and adequate eq downline to deal with things. Being an omni, it has no proximity effect. Cardioid and hypercardioid patterns have the proximity effect. Although a hypercardioid is directional, that doesn't mean it will be less prone to feedback than an omni, when the location of both mics are inside a guitar. Indeed, it may be more prone to feedback depending on placement and eq.

[hann]

interesting.. so the polar pattern has no impact on feedback-prone-ness.. cool...

[sdelsolray]

Originally Posted by hann

interesting.. so the polar pattern has no impact on feedback-prone-ness.. cool...

Not quite. The polar pattern can (and often does) contribute to or mitigate feedback, all other things being equal. The omni pattern does not generate the proximity effect. The proximity effect can contribute to feedback. An omni picks up from all directions, which can contribute to feedback (but less so inside a guitar than, say, on a mic stand out in front of a guitar). A hypercardioid being unidirectional, does not pickup sound from all directions equally. That can mitigate feedback. But a hypercardioid has the proximity effect.

And then there's placement....

I use two internal mics in two guitars. One is omni, the other is hypercardioid. The preamp/eq I use adjusts the sound to get what I want from either internal mic (each of which supplement a SBT pickup in another channel). I use an external mic (cardioid or hypercardioid patters) whenever possible. I can get a higher output before feedback with either internal mic than I can with the external mic. Not much, just a few dB.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by sdelsolray

One of the best internal mics is the Joe Mills.

Hi sdsr...
I miss Joe's skills...

[sdelsolray]

Originally Posted by ljguitar

Hi sdsr...
I miss Joe's skills...

Hey Larry,
I do not know why Joe stopped. His mic uses a quality Sony capsule, nothing really special, but the mounting provides some magic. I've always liked his internal mic.

I miss Steve Rabe (Raven Labs). Can you imagine what Steve could be doing now if he had kept going?

I've been suggesting to Greg Gualtieri (Pendulum Audio) for years to have his SPS-1 built in China under appropriate QC, using the same components. It would cut the final cost of the SPS-1 in half, or close to half. He doesn't want to.

Rick Turner continues to be creative, developing cost effective products. I don't think he'll ever make a truly high end, no compromise, preamp/eq though. He's too smart of a businessman.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by sdelsolray

...I miss Steve Rabe (Raven Labs). Can you imagine what Steve could be doing now if he had kept going?

Hi sdsr...
I own a pair of Raven PMBs so that one stikes a good note too. Actually, if I could find someone to modify a DTAR Solstice to accept a pair of 9 volt batteries to operate the power supply - I'd probably buy one and have the modification done.

I hope to pursue that this year...

I don't know why Joe Mills quit building mics - but I was planning on upgrading one of my K&K rigs with one and then possibly the others. I am not unhappy with the K&K Silver Bullet and despite the disparaging remark above, find it good sounding, feedback resistant, and quite easy to balance - most useful.

I've only had hands-on one Mills and it was a good sounding mic...it was just the idea of having one that intrigued me.

I'm glad Greg is not farming out his preamps to China - and I'm glad James Olson did not succumb to the temptation to become a small factory when he had thoughts in that direction...he just wanted to keep the quality as high as possible, and I appreciate his commitment.

[alohachris]

Aloha Sdel,

Well now that both the hyper AKG 416 and Joe Mills omni are unavailable, which internal mics sound good to you? I'm making a few guitars for myself and will be in the market in a couple months for new dual systems. What do you think.

In terms of omni vs. hyper, etc., mic placement seems to be the key. IMO.

But proximity effect be ****ed, I've never liked the idea of an omni in a box, even though everyone loved that Joe Mills. He must've gone off the deep end or something.

Larry, I wasn't disparaging the Silver Bullet. I merely said that an AKG internal would be better. Is that not true?

I recommend the Trinity dual SYstem here all the time. No, the Silver Bullet is definitely a decent internal mic.

A Hui Hou!
alohachris

[hann]

anyone know what the golden bullet's about?