buying/trying vocals mics now

[Bob Womack]

Frankly, ever since MARS Music went out of business we've been up crick without a paddle. They had a mic testing room that was really nice. But the only way you really get the feel for a mic is to use it, and I haven't found a place that allowed returns of vocal mics. Most call it a health issue.

But think about it: do you want to buy a beery, lipstick laden mic for full price? Don't think so.

Bob

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

Frankly, ever since MARS Music went out of business we've been up crick without a paddle. They had a mic testing room that was really nice. But the only way you really get the feel for a mic is to use it, and I haven't found a place that allowed returns of vocal mics. Most call it a health issue.

But think about it: do you want to buy a beery, lipstick laden mic for full price? Don't think so.

Bob

I've always felt that buying a used microphone was just a notch up from buying a used harmonica. I'm gonna pass on that.

[alohachris]

Aloha Karen & friends,

I'd rather wait for the vaccine & avoid auditioning used vocal mic's at this time. Only new mic's. I'd stick with your KSM-32 LDC for now.

COVID-19 changed the used vocal mic audition equation, one that has been alive forever. I mean, where do you think all those Big Buck used vintage U47's, U67's, 87's, U89's, 251's, C12's, etc. have come from all these decades? From the thriving vintage vocal mic market that's where. No one allowed fear of a virus to get in the way. Mic's can be completely cleaned. But no more.

I spent many, many thousand$ on used high end vocal mic's over four decades & once even spent $17K on a prized, mint U47 used on Sinatra's Columbia albums (it was great on my voice but not my all time favorite). I enjoyed it for a year then traded it to a collector for more cool high end mic's.

But I wouldn't think of it these days. Obviously, one cannot do that until COVID is controlled.

Karen, I'd wait for COVID to be completely controlled before you try out more mic's - unless you know of a studio that can help out after a thorough cleaning the mic's. That killer coronavirus is everywhere & so contagious. I mean, even here on little Oahu in the most distant land in the world, & not as badly infected as Mainland states, we have over 6,000 active cases walking around - trying to kill kapuna (old folks) like me. Sheesh! No wonder I've been literally hiding inside from young idiot carriers, with no visitors near me for six months now!

Check out Mojave MA-200 (cardioid only) or 300 tube (multi-pattern) LDC's. Then save money & look for used later when the coast is clear. To me, they sound much better than an AT4050 (a workhorse, IMO, w/o much sparkle) for capturing nuances of many styles of female & male voices. I still have an MA-200 that was a real value mic to me, even though I had much higher-end mic's in-house. Worth a try, IMO.

Also check out the Neumann's: a U89 (a standard for female voices), Vintage U87 (Classic) or U87ai (latest) or TLM 102 (a less-expensive sleeper). Then listen to the Gefell UM-70, Flea M49, Peluso 2247-LE (great LDC) or even a Ribbon mic like the classic BBC designed Coles 4038 (a real winner on female voices) for fun. ALL Work VERY well on many female voices. Check out the first half of samples below. -alohachris-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScQISlpnjoQ

Another consideration in an LDC mic search:What preamp do you match to the mic? Your Summit Audio 2ba-221 is a decent one channel preamp with many fans. Should work well combined with many mic's.

Good luck in your search, Karen. You should wait nine months to audition used unless you're buying new. You probably know that cheap mic's like SM58's have no resale value. Though I used 58's live for many years before I became educated & more curious about what's up the trough, you're better off saving the $100 & putting it into a studio LDC. Better mid-range (over $1200+) LDC mic's don't lose as much value, if any, or nuances. If you look inside an SM58, you'll find all your vocal nuances hiding in the foam. Great for shouters & framers though.

A Hui Hou!
alohachris

[Tico]

Originally Posted by Pnewsom

...Alternatively, you could just take a chance and buy a Shure SM58. They have been an industry standard for the last 50 years or more. They are very durable, and sound good for most voices through most systems.

There are those who prefer other more sensitive makes and models, and there are lots to choose from. But at around $100, an SM58 is a good investment as it can be sold pretty easily later on, or kept as a backup if you find something you like better down the road. It will also serve as a good reference point to compare other mics to later on. ...

I strongly agree the Shure SM-58 is the lowest-risk mic.

I have other mics costing $900 and $1100 each.
Obviously they sound better, but at only $100 (dollar for sound and ruggedness) the SM-58 is the quintessential bulletproof-value vocal mic choice for live applications.

[Chipotle]

BTW, you might want to check out this: Sweetwater Vocal Mic Shootout.

Has both male and female vocalists on a large variety of mics, and you can download 24/96 files to load into your DAW and compare on good monitors. It might not tell you exactly what mic you want, but it could at least help you narrow down your choices.

[keith.rogers]

Another option is to listen to (300!) different mics on different tracks at this site: https://audiotestkitchen.us17.list-m...0&e=0436ecdf03

You do have to create an account to use the features of this site, but I think I've gotten 2 emails in the past 7 months.

You'll want to delete the mics that are presented, then click the search (magnifying glass) icon to pick different mics. Then you can pick tracks and audition full mixes, female vocals, acoustic guitars, and other tracks.

Personally, it made me realize that the differences can be pretty subtle, depending on what is being recorded. In many cases, the mic choice makes a difference in how much EQ is needed in mixing. Some mics mean you don't have to do anything, while some mean you need to do a lot.

So, it's good to have an idea of what problems you are specifically addressing for your own vocal by a mic choice. If it's sibilance (e.g.) then knowing where your problematic frequencies are can help you make use of response graphs. Nothing beats trying them, of course, but you kind of need a plan.

[Chipotle]

Originally Posted by keith.rogers

So, it's good to have an idea of what problems you are specifically addressing for your own vocal by a mic choice. If it's sibilance (e.g.) then knowing where your problematic frequencies are can help you make use of response graphs. Nothing beats trying them, of course, but you kind of need a plan.

I came across something recently that said to record a vocal-only track with the flattest mic you have. In your DAW, create a very narrow band EQ, boost about 10-12dB, and sweep it back and forth. See what frequencies jump out as bad--boxy, nasal, sibilant, etc. You can also note where good spots are--warm, airy, etc.

You can use those notes to compare to the mic's graph like Keith says.

BTW, I have never been able to get Audio Test Kitchen to load on my PC (Chrome on Windows 10). It just hangs on the loading screen. Am I missing something?

[keith.rogers]

Originally Posted by Chipotle

...
BTW, I have never been able to get Audio Test Kitchen to load on my PC (Chrome on Windows 10). It just hangs on the loading screen. Am I missing something?

I had a problem with it when I tried it a while back, and actually thought it might be broken. But, I got an email a couple days ago saying they'd added a lot of mics and new tracks, so tried it again, and it seemed to be working as it had before.

You do have to create an account / log in to be able to make it useful it seems.

I'm using Chrome on a Mac (OS X Mojave). Haven't tried it on anything else, TBH. Maybe do the clear all browser cookies & cache thing...

[lkingston]

How good are the acoustics of the room you are recording in? Are you tracking vocals by themselves or while you are playing guitar?

I love the Shure SM7B and a CloudLifter preamp if you are tracking in a regular room or with guitar or a band because it isolates the vocal from the ambience.

Nothing beats a good large diaphragm condenser mic for tracking vocals by themselves in a good room though.

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

I've always felt that buying a used microphone was just a notch up from buying a used harmonica. I'm gonna pass on that.

Walk into any studio in the world and you're going to sing into mics that have been used by hundreds of people before you. I can see the virus being an issue if one is picking up the mic in person, but if a mic is shipped it has likely sat in the box long enough for virus germs to have died off. I've bought quite a few used mics over the years and have never had a bad experience with it.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by jim1960

Walk into any studio in the world and you're going to sing into mics that have been used by hundreds of people before you. I can see the virus being an issue if one is picking up the mic in person, but if a mic is shipped it has likely sat in the box long enough for virus germs to have died off. I've bought quite a few used mics over the years and have never had a bad experience with it.

I've sang into a Neumann mic in our local pro studio and wasn't concerned in the least, and in actuality the front was about 6" behind a pop filter.

In normal times I fully agree with the whole concept of it not being an issue, but since I've seen some singers who would dampen the foam inside a SM58 windscreen it's more the gross out factor than any real danger.

I know in practice that a high-dollar LDC isn't going to get that treatment, and I'd be more concerned with a good mic being dropped than transferring viruses, etc. from a purchased mic.

[runamuck]

I have a KSM32 and know that's it's a smooth mic on the high end and upper mids. For that reason you may not like my suggestion below.

I suggest that if you're trying out a 4050,and 4040, try a 4033 as well. A good friend of mine is a notable mixing engineer and says that he uses it a lot for vocals even though he has plenty of others, including both a 4040 and 4050.

Jim

[KarenB]

Originally Posted by runamuck

I have a KSM32 and know that's it's a smooth mic on the high end and upper mids. For that reason you may not like my suggestion below.

I suggest that if you're trying out a 4050,and 4040, try a 4033 as well. A good friend of mine is a notable mixing engineer and says that he uses it a lot for vocals even though he has plenty of others, including both a 4040 and 4050.

Jim

I have no problem with your suggestion at all. Thanks.

[KarenB]

Thanks to all for your thoughts and suggestions. For now, I will just stay with my Shure KSM32 and be happy.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by KarenB

Thanks to all for your thoughts and suggestions. For now, I will just stay with my Shure KSM32 and be happy.

I think that's a reasonable idea
Let me suggest that you can play around with subtle EQ on the vocal track itself . Something like a few db's of high freq. boost starting around 6k to 7k and up for a bit more air
And then also experiment with setting up a parallel Reverb track for the vocal and send the vocal to that track. Place an EQ plugin before the reverb plug in on that track with with some major Low and High cut filters. Set the low cut to roll off everything below 600 Hz and the high cut roll off everything above 7kHz. Also put about 50-60 milliseconds of pre delay on the reverb.
Thus having the reverb effect only the mids (this will tend to clean up the vocal reverb sound, and bring it a bit more forward in the mix (reverb usually tends to move the vocal back in the mix a bit)

If my above explanation is not quite clear I can post some screen shots later this evening .Kev