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#106
04-16-2002, 01:07 PM
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Beatlenut:
I know about the possessed soundboard stuff. It's wierd when settings aren't changed...even touched, the room isn't altered, same number of chairs filled, etc, yet the sound is radically off. The enemy tries to stumble us in any way he can. Sounds like a real cram getting ready for service. At least you don't skimp on the prayer. Blessings, |
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#107
04-16-2002, 01:41 PM
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Hey beatlenut
Funny you should say that about your soundboard. We call ours the "mackie demon" hehehe  Every knob on that thing could be glued into position, we could seat the exact number of people in the building in the same seats and I think it would still vary. We have no soundman, so I feel your pain. It's basically soundcheck then take the guitar off and walk back and forth to the soundbooth (graciously done by the ever-patient associate, Cynbrad) Anyway, our local sound expert who has balanced the system for us has said he thinks we are on an "ancient burial site"  Some days I am inclined agree with him. Boy, could we use a soundperson!!!!Lisa |
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#108
04-16-2002, 08:02 PM
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Oh yes, the sound issue. We have a team of about 4 people helping with the sound. Great guys who really try hard. But I guess that sound is dynamic. A lot also depends on the people playing. We have a drummer who needs to have the drum mikes turned on and another who we never use any mikes at all. He beats those drums real hard!
The problem we have in our church is that our monitors and speakers are really old but we do not have the finances to improve the system. maybe some of you guys can pray that we will have the finances we need soon. just as a seperate note; I am really encouraged to find so many worship team people here. The Lord bless you all. |
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#109
04-16-2002, 08:37 PM
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Hey Raj:
I'm happy to pray for your churches finances as it relates to the worship ministry. I too am blessed to see so many brothers and sisters participating in this thread and the Lord's service. We shoudl lift each other up in prayer often, perhaps each time we sign on or off from the forum. Then we will start hearing the praise reports come in... Blessing all, |
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#110
04-16-2002, 10:32 PM
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Hey CAKES...and everyone else...
Greetings and blessings to all,
I have been leading worship for our Praise & Worship service since we started in Sept. 2000. It has been both a blessing and a challenge. I am the band (+ my Alesis SR16). I just always "hum" a cool baseline in my head while I'm strumming along to my tracks. We have experienced some very sweet times of worship, which goes way beyond just music! Likewise, there is always the challenge of seeking the Lord with a newness and freshness, but He is leading. I've played a 310-CE up until I got my Alvarez Yairi WY-1K, which is an awesome stage guitar. I prefer the electronics on it over the Fishman on the 310-CE. My 310-CE is now sold and I just brought home a 414CE-LTD (koa) which is incredible. I have yet to use it during worship, but I can't wait to! Hey CAKES, I relate to needing some time off. I, too, felt the need and desire to step down and take some time to refresh and rediscover some of the joy I felt I had lost. I am also the full-time youth minister at my church which is on Rt. 17 just down the road from Warrenton. Leading worship was volunteer time and my priorities had gotten out of whack a little. It's a hard balance, but rewarding. Let us know how things are going and what you've decided... I echo others by saying it is truly encouraging to find so many brothers and sisters that share our true reason for being here: to lift up our God! Peace be with you... Steven |
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#111
04-17-2002, 06:32 AM
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Ref MikeG...
"When it is a revolving door of musicians, it can cause mistakes, "musical collisions" and distractions in the worship. Anything that distracts from the spirit moving in the sanctuary is a problem.." Hey MikeG, some pretty relevent comments in your post. I am interested in your thoughts on "musical collisions". This *IS* a problem, what are your expectations of musicians that would prevent this from happening? I have seen some very good musicians, who play by ear, do a great job with most everything they play. but I have also found so real dilemmas when "trained" musicians and "play by ear" musicians get together. The good play by ear musicians will play beautifully, but won't play that particular chord on the "8th note downbeat" like the technically trained musician will. Sometimes it is just hard to get them together. Do you tend to eliminate the guys/gals who just can't keep time, who just can't 'hear'(or refuse to hear) the other musicians, who don't read music... Maybe the better question is, what do you (and other Worship Leaders) look for in the IDEAL candidate for the Worship Team. <>< Ron Lonesome Picker (NC) |
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#112
04-17-2002, 07:36 AM
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I have ongoing musical tension with two of our keyboard players on the worship team for the same reason. They read, and I play by ear. Actually, the problem is that they want to play the keyboard like a piano, and thus far, I've failed to convince them that much of contemporary worship doesn't use the piano sound.
We're working on right now deciding which songs sound better with a guitar dominance and which with a keyboard dominance. It involves some humbling here, as to make it work, I must back off and fit in with certain songs. I consider myself a player who strives for a fair amount of precision...ie, not blowing off chords, etc. But I think that sometimes it can be detrimental to worship music to play with too much precision, and that is what these keyboard players tend to do. They lack the ability to sense the mood and feel of the song, and just play what's written, how it's written. Both of them grew up in the church playing piano.
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ScottyMac Larrivee OM40 Rosewood Larrivee OM40 Mahogany 2011 Taylor 314ce Yamaha BB Bass, Fender Strats, PRS Zach Myers, Epiphone Les Paul Custom Pro |
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#113
04-17-2002, 09:18 PM
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What we look for in an ideal candidate for the worship team? that's a very good question. Where my church is concerned, 3 things we look for are;
1. They belong to the church (small group involvement and accountability is a must) 2. Teachable 3. Ability. They must at least be able to play the instrument or carry a tune if they want to sing. A sense of calling and service is also very important. We always emphasise the team ministry. We are all in this together. taylormeister: I understand what you are going through. We had a couple of keyboardist like that. It took a lot of love, acceptance and training and practice to work that through. We also have a trained pianist that is great with improvisation and keyboard playing. He helped the other pianist adapt. One thing that helped us was to train all musicians (including the gutarists) that we all did not have to play all the time. It is o.k to sit out on some songs or certaint parts of a song. the other was to get the pianist to listen to the CD's and oick out the keyboard/piano part. the intent was not to follow the Cd exactly, but to get a feel of the instrumentation for a certain song or type of song. Gosh, I hope this makes sense. |
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#114
04-18-2002, 06:10 AM
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My church has two worship teams which alternate months. We run two Sunday morning services with Sunday school in-between and no Sunday evening service. We meet for sound check and run-down from 7:45am (promptly) to 8:15. First service at 8:30am, second at 11:00am. Once a month, we meet for a two-hour rehearsal after church. Actually, because we are a very social bunch, we go down to Burger King or IHOP after church and then come back for two-hours of rehearsal.
Because each of our teams is so large (two guitars, piano, keyboard, bass, drums, four vocalists; only two people are shared between the teams: our two youngest players who are "hungry"), the worship leader wisely decided to get things organized. We each have a ring binder with copies of all the current songs. The pastor and worship leader get together each month and set the line-up for the next month, which is published to the players. As a result, its easy for a replacement to slide in, when one is needed. We learn one or two new songs per month in the rehearsal and introduce them to the congregation during the offerings. Our current challenge is getting and keeping audio operators. Being that audio is what I do for a living, I ran a class for new operators last month which drew nine people. We still need to get those folks to volunteer to work with a worship team so our current, consistant, and only operator can get a break. She was a sound person for bands for years and really has a great grasp of the sound 'thang. She understands that the whole thing changes, not only every week, but every service. She's vital. One of the things we've done to make the operator's job easier is set up a separate monitor system onstage for the instruments. We have our own mixer, amp, and monitos up there and take our feeds from the auxiliary outputs of all the direct boxes. Using this, we are able to adjust our own mix without bothering the engineer. Bob
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
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#115
04-18-2002, 07:10 AM
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Hey BobW...
Great input, and what a great-set-up! Are your services completely blended or are they "primarily" traditional with Worship music support during the Offering? Who and how do you handle the which instruments are played and how they are mixed/arranged in the new tunes you bring on board. Do you have a different person who recommends or manages how the vocals and harmonies "layered" and performed? Just a few questions..  <>< Ron Lonesome Picker (NC) |
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#116
04-18-2002, 07:19 AM
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BobW..
By the way, out of interest you may want to look at the new Allen & Heath DP-1000 or DS-1000 digital mixers. They have (I think) over 100 presets that allow you or your soundman to find the right mix for a particular song, store it in memory, assign a number to it, and Vuella! You can move from song to song in lock step with the mixer at the press of a button..Neat <>< Ron Lonesome Picker (NC) |
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#117
04-18-2002, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
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I, for one, am pretty amazed at how well things mesh. We are extremely blessed. It must be a combination of the Holy Spirit restraining a bunch of strong personalities and a bunch of "been there, done that" people who aren't too wrapped up in their egos. Everyone gets to express himself a little but we still work as a team.Quote:
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
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#118
04-18-2002, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Sorry I am just now getting back with you. I will address your question quoted above. However, my comments may not be much of a "revelation". Why you ask??? Because I am one of the ear trained musicians. The last bit of theory I took was probably 25 years ago when I played the trumpet. However, I am not totally disappointed in the route I took. I love getting caught up in the Spirit and not being tied to the page or the "potential" bondage of technical perfection. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe all technically trained are, but I think you will admit that some get so "robotic" that there is no emotion flowing through them. I do wish that I had some classical training behind me on the guitar but I'm just blessed that the Lord is using me. My point being... I can't express my thoughts in technical muscial terminology like some of you folks can. However, I will try. All I simply meant by muscial collisions was that, when a team is not brought together by the Lord and has not had time to play together, get to know each others style, technique, thoughts and musical direction, the more prone the team is to being out of sync and "bumping" into one other becasue of thier differences. For instance. I invited a new brother at our church, who is an awesome guitarist, to play with me one week. The women were at a retreat so it was just us men and thought it would be fun to just have two acoustics. Well he is classically trained, yet very contemporary in technique as well. I have an aggressive syncopated right hand. What I thought would be wonderful turned out to be the two of us out of sync and it sounded like we were "shooting BB's at each other". You know...ping, ping, ping. As worship leaders, when we feel uncomfortable, the congregation can sense that spirit and worship is not as light and Spirit filled. My point, when we are "gelling", we are not encumbered by the technical issues and the Spirit just flows so much more freely. Now my friend and I know each others style, understand where we are going and it is more free and easy. In a nutshell, I don't believe there is any substitution for playing together and exposure to one another. When you bring in new folks, there is always a learning curve. Pershaps, practicing together for a time is reccommended before going live so you avoid any mistakes that causes people to take notice of you and there minds/hearts off the Lord. What a ramble that was. I hope it made some sense to you. Raj, Taylormeister and Bob made some outstanding observations and insights. Blessings |
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#119
04-18-2002, 02:24 PM
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Ref Mike G..."
I love getting caught up in the Spirit and not being tied to the page or the "potential" bondage of technical perfection. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe all technically trained are, but I think you will admit that some get so "robotic" that there is no emotion flowing through them." Hey Mike, I am in sync brother, although not to technical percection :-). I am also a play by ear musician, and I can relate very clearly to your thoughts here. This thread was interesting to me in that I recently played for a seeker service (see seeker service thread) and was asked to be the guitarist on very short notice. Outside of having to "hunt down" the tunes on mp3 and CD to get a a feel for the songs, I was asked to sit in with the half the "church choir" for vocals, the music minister on keyboard  and two other musicians (bass and elecric guitar, both musically trained perfectionists.. The songs were nice, but cookie cutter versions of songs that could have been done in a much more heartfelt, emotional and hmmmm..dynamic way. Like the sound of train wheels on a track, you new exactly when each "ta tuk, ta tuk" was going to occur in the song. Bottom line however, the seeker service was a success. The message was felt by all, but the music could have been much deeper... Anyway, I am gravitating toward a seperate worship group of strictly acoustic mucicians ( different kind of worship group for sure), we are putting together a mix of songs, layering the vocal and acoustic harmonies in a way that fits our "style & approach" to Worship music, and then offering to play as a group for special events, services etc... It is hard to be everything to everybody, and it takes a lof of work and strategic personality management to play in a Worhsip Group every Sunday with a mix of musican styles, capabilities, interests, and as mentioned before egos. Hey, good thread, thanks for the response and blessing to all brothers in Christ. In His Service <>< Ron Lonesome Picker (NC) |
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#120
04-18-2002, 06:49 PM
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Hi! I am a worship leader in a Baptist Church south of Atlanta. I am a new Taylor(410) owner. I have only had it a couple of weeks and used it for the first time last Sunday morning. Man do I love it. We do a blended service in A.M. and Contemporary in the P.M. I am also the student pastor.
We have a Praise Band and team that play Sunday A.M. & P.M. and a youth praise team that plays on wednesdays. There is nothing I like to do nothing better than worship God both personally and corporately. Worship is more than music but it is alot sweeter with my new 410. I need a new pickup for it though. It has a fishman in it but no preamp. Any suggestions? John |
