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Torrefied Mahogany ?
Been playing Sitka tops for decades, an Adi for a few years, cedar for a little less... I have one mahogany top (Taylor 324e) - since 2018.
No doubt that hardwood tops sound different (than spruce or cedar) and I would guess they tend to have a different rate of that played-in seasoning, broken-in, opening-up, etc.. Today's mahogany topped guitars seem to sound better than ever (even brand new ones) and have become more popular - in all body styles/sizes. Are the tops thinner? Graduated? Does anyone know if torrefied mahogany is used ? (or even the softer cedar for that matter). I've never seen it listed as such in any specs... Last edited by FingahPickah; 05-15-2022 at 05:57 AM. |
#2
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Updated the subject line to clarify.
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#3
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To my knowledge the recently discontinued Martin 00-17 Authentic 1931 was the first mahogany topped guitar that was aged with their VTS system.
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Santa Cruz 000, Samick classical |
#4
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I have a torrified cedar top on a baked cherry body but I need to make a neck for it. The baked cedar might be a mistake, will find out when the strings are on. Not sure if the bridge will fly off. Made it for silk and steel though.
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Fred |
#5
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Here's my 80 yr old mahogany naturally torrified top
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#6
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Torrefied Mahogany ?
I’ll toss this factor into the mix: humidity
I have an all solid all mahogany guitar that hits a sweet spot when the relative humidity is close to 50%. I have a mahogany guitar with a German spruce top that also has a sweet spot between 45-50%. My rosewood guitars hit their sweet spot more in the 35-40% range. I have had discussions with a couple of luthiers and they also find that this is sometimes true with mahoganies. Of course there are always other variables. Not sure how the torrifaction (sp?) figures in but I am sure that there are charts somewhere that compare properties of hardwoods vs softer woods. Obviously torrifaction speeds up the process of wood curing and moisture content in the wood is part of that process. Best, Jayne |
#7
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That is correct. If I had the budget for it, I’d own one for sure. These are such great guitars.
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#8
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Very nice. This guitar looks to be in great shape. Would love to hear it. Best, Jayne |
#9
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I've seen videos with a luthier from Denver (Robert O'brien) area who visited and published videos from a wood factory which specializes in torrified woods for luthiers. Here's one of two or three videos from that visit I found fascinating. This man builds and repairs guitars…and has a lot of contact with other luthiers. He's the real-deal. When it comes to wood discussions, torrified, naturally aged/dried, or ordered from a supply house, the tone of the guitar is as dependent on the builder and his/her design as the type/make/species of wood used. Best wood in the world in the hands of an inexperienced builder still sound poor. Hope it adds to the discussion from a professional perspective. |
#10
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I actually asked my luthier this question yesterday when I was having one of my 000s looked at as I'm considering an all mahogany guitar; his view was that you can torrefy mahogany but it doesn't do much to affect the tone in the same way as it does for spruce, something to do with the resins in the wood. My understanding with mahogany is that thinning the top is the way to get the most projection and tone from the instrument, though that too is a tricky proposition.
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#11
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I'm a huge fan of Mahogany topped guitars and have owned a bunch. Currently I have a 1931 Gibson L-0 that I've been playing daily. One thing I've noticed over the years is that scalloped bracing makes a much bigger difference with a Mahogany top than it does with spruce. The Pre-war 0-17 and 00-17's sound amazing and as soon as they stopped scalloping the braces in 1945, there is a huge change. They still sound fine but are just nowhere near as responsive. Much more of a difference than with comparable spruce topped Martins.
As for torrefied Mahogany. I have seen it but never used it. A builder I know and trust has built with it and he said he couldn't hear a difference between it and the regular mahogany that he usually uses. He found that glue didn't hold quite as well so he stopped offering it as an option. |
#12
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So the second guitar that I made sounded poor even though everyone who played it was blown away? Good to know.
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Fred |
#13
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Quote:
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#14
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Please don't mistake me for an expert. I listened to all of Robert's interviews from that visit (twice and one three times) and feel I now understand the process of torrifying better, and if you follow Robert O'Brien you know he's realistic and cautious with the information he gives. This is not a subject with absolutes, but I can say after watching Robert's interviews and questions/answers given by the people at the wood distribution center where they are Torrifying the wood, I am a more informed player. |
#15
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Quote:
We've never met, and I certainly was not aiming my comments at any specific builder/luthier. Forgive me if you felt targeted… I added it because Robert's three videos introduce some people who torrify wood by the truck load, and who sell it to 'customers' who build guitars with it. I realize I'm leaving the research (to root out the other two videos) up to any interested explorers. I have no desire to interject my lack of knowledge on the subject into a discussion. Some of their customers also make tables etc. not musical instruments. If I could have James Olson build me a second guitar today and he offered me the option of Torrified wood, I'd decline (because my 30 yr Old Olson is amazing).
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Baby #1.1 Baby #1.2 Baby #02 Baby #03 Baby #04 Baby #05 Larry's songs... …Just because you've argued someone into silence doesn't mean you have convinced them… Last edited by ljguitar; 05-15-2022 at 09:40 PM. |