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  #1  
Old 06-01-2016, 12:12 AM
Bax Burgess Bax Burgess is offline
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Default 60's red Nippon Gakki neck adhesive?

I've read posts that mention epoxy, but I've just now heard of aliphatic resin as a possibility.
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Old 06-01-2016, 04:15 PM
jared1177 jared1177 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bax Burgess View Post
I've read posts that mention epoxy, but I've just now heard of aliphatic resin as a possibility.
I can just say that its not wood glue, thats for sure.
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Old 06-01-2016, 05:02 PM
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Default We call it, "AMG"

Asian Mystery Glue!
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Old 06-02-2016, 12:24 PM
Truckjohn Truckjohn is offline
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It would not surprise me to find out that they used hide or fish glue in the 60's....
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Old 06-02-2016, 02:27 PM
Bax Burgess Bax Burgess is offline
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I sent an email to Yamaha Support on Tuesday - no reply as of yet. I have an FG-110, and have contacted J Guitars in Glenside PA about a neck reset. If Jake has to saw off the neck, he'd like to be confident that it was absolutely necessary, epoxy being a mess to steam loose, and the Yamaha's having a reputation for a tight neck joint.
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Old 06-03-2016, 12:15 PM
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I've never taken one of these apart, but I believe the problem is not the glue but the design of the neck joint, it's not a dovetail or typical M&T.
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Old 06-03-2016, 01:45 PM
Bax Burgess Bax Burgess is offline
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Originally Posted by Rodger Knox View Post
I've never taken one of these apart, but I believe the problem is not the glue but the design of the neck joint, it's not a dovetail or typical M&T.
Good to know.
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Old 06-03-2016, 02:05 PM
JLS JLS is offline
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Good to know.
They are dovetails, often very tight mechanically.
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Old 06-03-2016, 02:22 PM
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From an online source, a Yamaha distributor's website I believe:
Neck-body Joint Yamaha acoustic guitars use "set" necks, which means that the neck is fitted and glued into a recess in the end of the body. The recess is actually cut into a specially shaped block that is installed inside the body. The way this is done is critical to achieving optimum tone as well as durability, and Yamaha has an original approach. Rather than the more conventional mortise and tenon or dovetail joint, Yamaha employs an innovative, complex joint configuration that ensures consistently intimate contact between the neck and body. This is important because the transmission of vibration between the neck and body plays a major role in shaping response and sustain.

I suspect the are several neck joints that Yamaha has used over the years, which is one of the problems with resetting the neck.
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Old 06-03-2016, 06:32 PM
Bax Burgess Bax Burgess is offline
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Additionally I ended up at this page as per a solution:

http://www.frets.com/FretsPages/Luth...ichreset1.html

In addition to the 110, I have a red label FG-150, more in need of a reset. I could have this lesser sounding of the two, the 150, worked on as a test case, then mull over treatment the 110. I'll take the guitars over to, and consult with, the luthier, whereupon we'll decide on a course of action. I'll have to resurrect this thread when the first patient is released.
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Old 06-05-2016, 04:17 PM
JLS JLS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodger Knox View Post
From an online source, a Yamaha distributor's website I believe:
Neck-body Joint Yamaha acoustic guitars use "set" necks, which means that the neck is fitted and glued into a recess in the end of the body. The recess is actually cut into a specially shaped block that is installed inside the body. The way this is done is critical to achieving optimum tone as well as durability, and Yamaha has an original approach. Rather than the more conventional mortise and tenon or dovetail joint, Yamaha employs an innovative, complex joint configuration that ensures consistently intimate contact between the neck and body. This is important because the transmission of vibration between the neck and body plays a major role in shaping response and sustain.

I suspect the are several neck joints that Yamaha has used over the years, which is one of the problems with resetting the neck.
I've never seen anything but a dovetail on Yamahas.
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Old 10-05-2016, 06:54 AM
Bax Burgess Bax Burgess is offline
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Resurrecting this, with an update on the neck removal of my 1972 red labeled Gakki 110. Jake of J Guitars says: I was able to steam the neck off of your guitar with moderate difficulty. The dove-tail joint was much more shallow than most and was a bit tricky to loosen.

Details later, when I have talked over the process with him.
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  #13  
Old 10-05-2016, 01:08 PM
John Arnold John Arnold is online now
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I just reset the neck on an FG-180 red label Nippon Gakki.
I removed the fingerboard tongue by cutting it at the 12th fret. That gives full access to the dovetail, which can be 'drilled' using a small steel scribe (a 0.070" diameter rod that is pointed on the end) that is chucked in a hand drill. I drilled three or four times on both dovetail cheeks, and I was able to remove the neck with no water. There is some heat generated when using the scribe, but I believe the main reason I was able to remove the neck was that the drilled holes weakened the joint.
Some repair of the surfaces is required, but thicker shims will take care of it. Shimming the joint is almost always done during a reset.
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Old 10-05-2016, 05:27 PM
Greg Maxwell Greg Maxwell is offline
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I've reset over a dozen older FG-140's and FG-180's and I haven't had one yet I couldn't steam apart. Sometimes some reconstruction of the tongue is necessary but this isn't that big of a deal. I've never seen one that wasn't a typical dovetail.
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  #15  
Old 10-20-2016, 05:47 PM
Bax Burgess Bax Burgess is offline
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My last update for this thread. Jake, the luthier said that it was epoxy at the neck joint, a shallow dove tail that required him to dramatically slant his drill holes so that the steam could access the cavity, which I guess would be at the top of the dovetail. The dovetail began to split on one side as he worked both sides with a blade to loosen the neck. The treble side loosened easily, the bass side was the bugger.

Re-attaching the neck, the dovetail remains, however, Jake inserted a sleeve into it, to pair with a bolt applied from within the body, through the neck block - a bolt-on, dovetail neck. He also made a replacement bridge, its height almost twice that of the original, sanded down one.

The aforementioned, a little cosmetic work at the neck joint, some shaving of the fretboard to even out a slight twist, and new frets - total $930
It'll play great, already sounded great, but it'll win no beauty contests - can't wait. Crass looking, non original tuners will be replaced at a later date.
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