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  #16  
Old 06-15-2018, 01:35 AM
Jack Orion Jack Orion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockabilly69 View Post
Well good luck on setting up your rig and I hope you find something that works for you, I just wanted you to have all the info about the Felix because I remember my frustration when I was in your situation!!!
Thanks - frustrated is the word - see the bottom of this post...

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Originally Posted by kaos View Post
Imo the stock GE-7 colors the sound and can be noisy. Get a modded one or do the mod yourself ... if you decide to get one.
Yep, tried a GE-7 yesterday - noisy and a bit 'grungy' sounding, not very clean at all...

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Originally Posted by rschultz View Post
I had the Felix, it was cool. But eventually I wised up and realized that for $1000 I can have a used Helix... and it does WAY more. It allowed me to mix a dual sourced guitar (K&K + Anthem SL), all sorts of EQ, comp, reverb, mod, delay, does IR too. I run my electric through it as well as 3 different acoustics. And it does SO much more than I'm not even using. It's a dual processor, so I could also run a mic or other instrument through it at the same time.

I haven't looked back, Helix is the way to go if you can swing $1000.
the Helix is an amazing bit of gear for sure - I used to work for a shop when they first came out and the demo guy came round and showed them to us and my mind was completely blown! But for acoustic I only really need EQ and reverb, and for electric I have a small board (Keeley C2, TS808, Boss TU3, Strymon El Capistan) that does everything I need (and, to be honest, I often just go straight in to my amp!)

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Originally Posted by Spook View Post
I have a Grace Design Felix and an Empress ParaEQ. The Empress is better at equalization and is a great addition to any rig. That being said, I don't use it much any more because the Felix EQ is good enough while provided a great input stage and other stuff you need.

I'm about to start playing with a ToneDexter (new shiny object.. teach me to read these forums). If it's as good as everyone says it may be worth running an output from a K&K equipped guitar to an A/B DI with whatever you're using for your others.
Interesting to hear that about the ParaEQ vs Felix...

Anyway, so I played out again last night and was fighting with a PA that was too loud for the room (and style of music) and there was some offending low end rumble going on - at one point I was tuned to open D and the f# string was being set off by something in the system and was droning out... I think f# is around 200hz, which is a frequency I've noticed is quite dominant in my direct recordings of the K&K.

After last night I started thinking again - what I need is a way to notch out something really bad, a way of combating excessive low end, and a sweepable mids to dial in the mid tone...

Which again is pointing me towards the Grace preamps isn't it?

I may have to eat my words and seriously look into one - although this started with the need for two EQ settings, I'm not sure I can justify the Felix (for starters I'd also need to look at a new pedal board if I wanted to incorporate my Bluesky into the mix as well), but I am looking at the Alix - as far as I can see this is basically a single channel Felix right?

Obviously the issue with the Alix is I can't switch EQs for guitars on the fly and if I start adding stuff you're getting towards Felix pricing anyway...

I think I need to have a serious think about how to move forward - one option is to simply return to using the Martin with the Anthem for potentially troublesome gigs and only take the Collings with the K&K out for those gigs which I think will have better sound - the problem there is you never know what the gig's going to throw at you regardless of how well you think it might go!
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  #17  
Old 06-15-2018, 04:13 AM
AeroUSA AeroUSA is offline
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This is the reason I don’t like the K&K and would rather use a UST with ToneDexter or the Anthem/Fishman VT Enhance.
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  #18  
Old 06-15-2018, 05:06 AM
Pnewsom Pnewsom is offline
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This would be going a different direction, but a Bose T1 mixer just might do the trick.

You can run a vocal mic plus two dedicated guitars, and a line level output device.

I'm pretty sure that it has a K&k tone patch, and some for most of the other makes of pick ups.

It also offers two separate levels of tone control for each channel a three band and a parametric notch control. Compression, Chorus, Tremelo, and Delay effects are also available on each channel, as well as reverb.

The unit is very compact, and sounds great.
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  #19  
Old 06-15-2018, 05:15 AM
Marty C Marty C is offline
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I am not a professional musician and I don’t play out that often. Maybe the simple set up you described with two different eq pedals into one switch box would be the most simple.

What about a small digital mixer with guitars in two different channels. I have done this before. Vocal in one channel panned left so the left output/vocal can go to the FOH. Then the guitars panned right going through the right output. Just mute whichever one you want. Endless eq options available here.

Since the Para eq is digital, it probably has presets also. Maybe one A/B switch to feed both guitars into, single cable out to the Para eq and then just recall the preset when you decide which guitar you will use for each song. Save you from buying two Para eq.

As I said, I am not playing out much anymore and all this might be easy at home and more complicated when playing out. Just my input.
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  #20  
Old 06-15-2018, 07:25 AM
Jack Orion Jack Orion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroUSA View Post
This is the reason I don’t like the K&K and would rather use a UST with ToneDexter or the Anthem/Fishman VT Enhance.
Yeah I moved away from the K&K in the past because of similar issues but this Collings couldn't have an undersaddle fitted without modifying the saddle slot (ie. making it a drop in saddle that looks like a through saddle which is what my OM28v has).

I have heard the K&K sound great in guitars in the past so I know it can be done, it's just getting the right EQ dialled in I'm hoping...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pnewsom View Post
This would be going a different direction, but a Bose T1 mixer just might do the trick.

You can run a vocal mic plus two dedicated guitars, and a line level output device.

I'm pretty sure that it has a K&k tone patch, and some for most of the other makes of pick ups.

It also offers two separate levels of tone control for each channel a three band and a parametric notch control. Compression, Chorus, Tremelo, and Delay effects are also available on each channel, as well as reverb.

The unit is very compact, and sounds great.
An interesting diversion - I've seen people use these with the L1 systems and they have sounded great! I'll look into them but my initial research suggests that a lot of settings are sort-of 'tucked' away in sub-menus but I assume you can assign the core adjustable settings (EQ, notch) to the three controls on the front.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty C View Post
I am not a professional musician and I don’t play out that often. Maybe the simple set up you described with two different eq pedals into one switch box would be the most simple.

What about a small digital mixer with guitars in two different channels. I have done this before. Vocal in one channel panned left so the left output/vocal can go to the FOH. Then the guitars panned right going through the right output. Just mute whichever one you want. Endless eq options available here.

Since the Para eq is digital, it probably has presets also. Maybe one A/B switch to feed both guitars into, single cable out to the Para eq and then just recall the preset when you decide which guitar you will use for each song. Save you from buying two Para eq.

As I said, I am not playing out much anymore and all this might be easy at home and more complicated when playing out. Just my input.
I think the ParaEQ is analogue (not that it really matters if it sounds good!) but I'm glad at least somebody thinks my initial idea might be the simplest! I could fit 2 ParaEQ, my BlueSky and perhaps a muting DI from Orchid Electronics on my current pedal board and that would give me a lot more control than I have already, and I'd still have my Orchid Preamp for the odd gig where I'd just be taking my Martin and a cable (festival gigs mainly).

Thanks for your contributions by the way folks - I know I've dismissed a few ideas but it's not to say I don't appreciate them, it's always food for thought when other people chip in, what a great resource pool we have here!
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  #21  
Old 06-15-2018, 08:57 AM
uriah1 uriah1 is offline
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Love the K&K and fire eye. Very natural
I heard the dexter, and it was too mechanical or digital sounding for me.
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  #22  
Old 06-15-2018, 10:28 AM
Pnewsom Pnewsom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Orion View Post

An interesting diversion - I've seen people use these with the L1 systems and they have sounded great! I'll look into them but my initial research suggests that a lot of settings are sort-of 'tucked' away in sub-menus but I assume you can assign the core adjustable settings (EQ, notch) to the three controls on the front.
Jack,

I bought mine about a year ago to expand my Bose L1c for duos. The T1 is much better and easier to use than I had expected. To me it sounds better than Behringer1202 and a H&A Zed10FX(cleaner and more effects) that I went through first before buying the T1.

Very rugged build, with a small foot print that can be attached to a mic stand. The interface is very simple and clever with dedicated knobs for effect/eq adjustment, and the vocals and guitars sound great.

Definitely worth a closer look.
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  #23  
Old 06-15-2018, 05:22 PM
Irish Pennant Irish Pennant is offline
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Zoom A3 lets you save settings for each guitar and easily call them back up. It runs on batteries, which makes for a quick stage setup. It's not as high end as many of the options mentioned here but non the less, it's a good and reliable pedal. It's out of production but can still be found. The biggest complaint about it has been that the learning curve on how to use it is steep, in reality, it's not that bad.
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  #24  
Old 06-15-2018, 06:13 PM
BT55 BT55 is offline
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K&K offers a few add on options. An add-on preamp, the Pre-Phase Preamp and also the Pure Preamp. Both are matched to the K&K that you already have installed.
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  #25  
Old 06-15-2018, 06:24 PM
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JayBee1404 JayBee1404 is offline
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JackOrion, have you considered the Source Audio Programmable EQ box? Four separately-programmable channels with volume and seven-band EQ. I use one on my board for three instruments - two guitars and mandolin - and have a channel set up for each, plus the fourth channel has the EQ set flat (just in case). Highly recommended.

https://www.sourceaudio.net/programmable-eq.html
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  #26  
Old 06-17-2018, 04:08 AM
janmulder janmulder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Orion View Post
I have heard the K&K sound great in guitars in the past so I know it can be done, it's just getting the right EQ dialled in I'm hoping...

...

Thanks for your contributions by the way folks - I know I've dismissed a few ideas but it's not to say I don't appreciate them, it's always food for thought when other people chip in, what a great resource pool we have here!
Well here is a bit more food for thought to be dismissed if needed

First off, congratulations on some very fine work. I enjoyed watching some of the stuff on your site.

No doubt you have already learnt ... always beware of overly enthusiatic recommendations ... try before you buy if possible. You tried the GE7 and know what it does to your sound ... however, there are so many recommendations for the GE7 saying it is low noise and doesn't colour your sound and is the best EQ out there

With that said ... here are a few more things to consider ...

My main gigging guitar also has an Anthem SL and I run it through either a Baggs Venue or Radial PZ-Pre straight into AER C60. I use the XLR out from that for any desk.

This setup never worked for me with K&K so I got rid of it in all my guitars. It doesn't work for me with the Baggs Lyric pickup either ... which also needs massive cuts to some nasty honky frequencies.

I have 2 solutions that do work with this difficult pickup.

Carl Martin ParaEQ is a simple to use parametric designed for acoustic instruments. I like it because it is super fast to dial in (not usual for a parametric EQ). It has fixed Q but the settings are the most usable I've found. It also has an XLR out you can send to a desk.

AER Dual Para EQ is a fully parametric dual band EQ. It is super powerful at dialing out nastiness ... it's a bit slower to dial in than the Carl Martin because of the extra Q controls. It's the usual AER quality.

I'd compare these to the Empress ParaEQ

Hope that helps.
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  #27  
Old 06-17-2018, 05:51 AM
varmonter varmonter is offline
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At one point i was able to purchase 2 speck asc
eqs, for around 300 each used. These are 1/2 rack
mount units and probably the nicest eqs i've ever
used. I used one for my mandolin and one for
my guitar. these are recording studio eqs.
But they were in my rack for years and seem
quite road worthy. But i eventually went with a felix And
a pedal board so the rack stays home now .
The kk is a great pickup but definitely requires
Outboard eq of some type.
I tried the tonedexter as well and like stated a few posts(uriah1)
up found the sound too overprocessed and sterile.
But it gets a lot of love here.
Forums are a great place to ask questions and get opinions.
They contain a very diverse group of well minded people of
all levels of experience. I have found over the years that what
one persons set of experiences may not be what others sets
have been. An example would be someone who has plugged
their guitar directly into a board who suddenly discovers a DI Box
and will rave about brand x di box till the cows come home.
This worked for them but may not be where you are at currently .
I guess i am just cautioning about using a grain of salt.

Last edited by varmonter; 06-18-2018 at 06:24 AM.
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  #28  
Old 06-17-2018, 06:21 AM
Marty C Marty C is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayBee1404 View Post
JackOrion, have you considered the Source Audio Programmable EQ box? Four separately-programmable channels with volume and seven-band EQ. I use one on my board for three instruments - two guitars and mandolin - and have a channel set up for each, plus the fourth channel has the EQ set flat (just in case). Highly recommended.

https://www.sourceaudio.net/programmable-eq.html
Yes, that was the digital eq I was thinking of. Sorry Jack about my comment earlier when I mentioned the Para eq being programmable. I was meaning this eq.
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  #29  
Old 06-17-2018, 07:56 AM
janmulder janmulder is offline
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The programmability of this EQ is that you can save presets. However, it is still a standard graphic EQ which is not the best tool for dialing out unwanted frequencies. The frequency bands are hardwired and the Q factors often too low so that the bands overlap and if these settings are not exactly right it won't help much. The two really important frequencies - 400hz and 800hz - are not even catered for.

You might be lucky and find it works but you should try it first.
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  #30  
Old 06-17-2018, 12:49 PM
rschultz rschultz is offline
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The more I read this thread the more thankful I am that 6 months ago I sold ALL my pedals and bought a Helix. I haven’t looked back, not once. Multiple guitars, multiple pickups all needing EQ, different effects, etc. All situations covered by 1 Helix. What eventually got me was my dual source guitar, both needing EQ, and how expensive it was getting. 2 Eq pedals, mixer, verb, etc.

Comp, EQ, Reverb, Mod, lots of inputs/outputs, Presets... $1000 used... Helix. I should write a song about it, a jingle, something that gets stuck in your head. $1000 used... Helix.
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