Quantity vs “Quality”

[Ian111]

I’d rather have the distinct tones that an SG Jr with P90’s ($1500) and a Les Paul with Burstbuckers ($1100) over one Standard Model Les Paul ($2700 ish). Same goes for my Telecasters and Strat over one Custom Shop Strat or Tele. I think you can get away with having fewer different types of acoustics. But with electrics each model is so different from each other it seems better to have more tonal options.

I usually favor quality over quantity and I think I’d be that way if I was more into acoustics. (One 000-18 over two Mexican made Martins). But with electrics i’m going with quantity.

(Just talking preference. No right or wrong here)

[Dru Edwards]

Ian, great thread. I agree with your thoughts.

I think that it's easier to change the voice of an electric by swapping pickups or changing amps, or even using the right pedal. That makes it easier to buy a less expensive guitar even after accounting for upgrades.

It's not the same for an acoustic (at least unplugged). Different strings, picks, nut/saddle material make a difference but you still have the basic voice of the guitar. For that reason I find there's a bigger discrepancy between entry level / intermediate level electrics and their acoustic counterparts.

Regardless of the guitar (electric or acoustic), the neck needs to match the player's preference.

Of course, quality still needs to be good enough to last a lifetime.

[Ian111]

Yeah referring back to my other thread Strat vs Tele. I’d rather have a Player Strat and a Player Tele over one Professional.

[Rogerblair]

Agree…there are so many very good low cost electrics out there these days. It’s easy to get even a VERY cheap Squier Tele or Strat or an Epi Les Paul to play well, and pickup swaps aren’t prohibitively expensive if you want to up the sound game.

Love the variety.
Rb

[raysachs]

Yeah, each electric has it's own voice, but I've always found that no matter what I'm playing, I always end up sounding like me, for better or worse. I just have sound in my head, I can generally dial it in, and it ends up sounding pretty much like me. The exceptions are strats, which have the 2 & 4 positions that sound like NOTHING else, and a solid body with P90s, which has it's own type of growl I don't hear anywhere else. So my two electrics are a really nice strat that I play 95-99% of my electric time, and a cheap Epiphone SG with P90s, which I play the 1-5% of the time I just gotta have that P90 growl. I've had various other guitars - teles, Les Pauls, Firebirds, semi-hollows, etc, and I can get to the same "sounds like me" place on the strat and SG I can get to with any of those others, but I can ALSO get to those signature sounds you can ONLY find on strats or with P90s. And I still end up sounding pretty much like me, but with a slightly different flavor of me...

With acoustics, there's mahogany and there's rosewood, and as long as I've got one of each, I'm pretty happy. Right now I have one of each and both are awesome...

I don't need or want a lot of guitars - two electrics (one would be fine honestly) and two acoustic keep me very happy. I have a third acoustic, and Emerald X7 that's really nice to be able to toss in the trunk of a hot car when I'm traveling and not have to worry about it. It's got a useful function and sounds OK, but I almost never play it at home when I can play my mahogany or rosewood guitar.

-Ray

[Bob Womack]

In the 1939 film You Can’t Cheat an Honest Man, W.C. Fields' character, Larson E. Whipsnade, sings in the shower:

"I’d rather have two girls at 21 each, than one girl at 42."

Somehow it seems apropos, at least to my sense of humor.

Bob

[Ian111]

Don’t get wrong. More expensive versions of the same model sound “better”. They do that on purpose. But the law of diminishing returns really kicks in after about the $500-800 mark. At the same time I’m all for buying the finest instrument you can afford. I don’t want to encourage a race to the bottom. A well crafted instrument should be appreciated.


At the same time……I’m sure Jack Pearson would sound better with something better than a Squier Bullet Strat but it goes to prove when performing, people are focused on the performance and not the instrument. Even guitar geeks. The only ones who care what we play are very few in reality.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Ian111

...I usually favor quality over quantity and I think I’d be that way if I was more into acoustics...But with electrics I'm going with quantity...

You can have both: since the beginning of the "lawsuit" era there have always been those offshore instruments that seriously challenge the big-buck stuff at intermediate-player prices - '70s-80s Yamaha and Ibanez, Korean 5400/5600-Series Gretsch Electromatics, Eastman 300/400-Series, the Godin 5th Avenue family, among others - as well as select entry-/midrange-level US-built gear that, in too many cases, is swiftly discontinued when it turns out to be too good for its own good...

Originally Posted by Ian111

...More expensive versions of the same model sound “better”. They do that on purpose. But the law of diminishing returns really kicks in after about the $500-800 mark...

I have a 2011 limited-edition goldtop Gibson Les Paul Studio '60s Tribute with P-90's, that I use as my straight-ahead rock guitar...

Lightweight and acoustically resonant, third-edition 1960-style "Slim Taper" neck is smooth and fast, and the combination of satin finish and PRS-style revealed "binding" make it look like a sweet under-the-bed '56, that was played out on weekends and put away when Elvis got out of the Army...

Had the chance to A/B it about ten years ago, against a very well-maintained gennie '58 darkback/PAF goldtop owned by a nonagenarian WW II vet (hard to believe, but there are still some undiscovered examples out there). through both his early-60's Sano 1x12" combo and my Bugera V22...

Call me crazy, but I liked my little $800 axe better than his $150K+ (at today's prices) collector piece - turned down $1400 for it, and wouldn't sell for any price...

[Al Mojo]

Can we agree that value (expressed here as tone) is largely and literally in the hands of the player. The argument that "cheap" is better than "expensive"; "modern" is better than "vintage"; "import" is better than "Made in USA", or "quantity" is better than "quality" is subjective. Buy whatever flavor you like. 😊

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Al Mojo

Can we agree that value (expressed here as tone) is largely and literally in the hands of the player. The argument that "cheap" is better than "expensive"; "modern" is better than "vintage"; "import" is better than "Made in USA", or "quantity" is better than "quality" is subjective. Buy whatever flavor you like. 😊

I think the OP's point is that he'd rather have a variety of low- to mid-price instruments in the interest of tonal variety, than a single instrument with a more limited spectrum...

Quite frankly, from that standpoint I agree with him: wise shopping, with the goal being maximum tone/QC per dollar spent, has allowed me to amass over time a multi-instrumental studio player's sonic arsenal - acoustic and electric basses, 4-/5-/6-string banjos, a couple mandolins and ukes, a banjo-uke, a dulcimer, a full recorder consort (sopranino to bass), in addition to an assortment of acoustic and electric guitars (and the requisite amplification for the latter) - without making a major investment in any of them, and the bulk of which I can flip for a profit even in today's buyers' market...

Played some wonderful top-shelf guitars during my lifetime, owned a D-45 for over 25 years, scored a Gretsch White Falcon a few years ago that's not going anywhere - also own an $1800 (in 2003 dollars) Avalon cedar/RW mini-jumbo that gave a five-figure guitar, from one of those half-dozen luthiers whose name has assumed near-Divine status on the General subforum (and is known for guitars of this type), some serious competition when I A/B'd them at MandoBros...

Picked up a barely-played Pedulla P/J bass for $600 in the early-90's - served as my main instrument for 15 years, still in the loop...

Landed an excellent-condition Deering Boston tenor banjo at the Brooklyn Sam Ash for $325 w/OHSC about 20 years ago, been my open-jam companion ever since - worth about four times that at the time, new one would be around $2700 today as a special order...

The mass-maker headstock logos are what you would see at a well-stocked first-tier music dealer - Martin, Gibson, Taylor, Fender, Gretsch, Rickenbacker, Epiphone, Guild, Hofner, Yamaha, Ibanez, Ovation, Godin, Kentucky, Gold Tone...

Quality is where you find it, without regard to dollars spent and, as you state, indeed subjective; by the same token, few if any of us here looking for a sonic cornucopia can afford a Chinery-style collection of museum-quality flagship instruments - and if there's solidly-built, good-sounding gear out there that doesn't cost an arm, leg, and a couple other highly-useful appendages , those of us who relish variety will be on it...

[Al Mojo]

Good points, Steve - your expertise and experience shows through. I agree with you .. tone and sound, ears wide open, can be found at every price level.

And yet ...

In searching for interesting tone and sound, you will run across amazing (but expensive) guitars that haunt you in ways that cause you to throw caution to the wind - and you buy some of them - against normal logic. 😅

[Ian111]

Most of the guitars made by the big names will very rarely make a less expensive instrument better then an expensive one. I’m talking about the usual Fender Player vs Professional vs Custom Shop tiers. There are limited runs and dealer exclusives that will buck that trend but its not going to upset their basic sales strategy. So for most people who aren’t always on the look out for those jems its a matter of how important is it really to pay a whopping premium to get something “a step above”?

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Ian111

Most of the guitars made by the big names will very rarely make a less expensive instrument better then an expensive one...So for most people who aren’t always on the look out for those gems, it's a matter of how important is it really to pay a whopping premium to get something “a step above?"

Don't know how you feel about it, but for me that's part of the joy of the search ; while a lower-end electric (or amp) made to a reasonably high standard can often be upgraded for less than the price of the big-buck piece, I really love when it all comes together in the acoustic arena, as the suits trip over each other scrambling to either discontinue the product, or jack up the price before the word gets out and too many are sold vis-a-vis the big buck/high-profit boxes - and it's pretty much public knowledge, if you hang out enough on the General subforum, who the egregious corporate offenders are and which (now cult-favorite) no-longer-available "too-much-guitar-for-the-money" models we're talking about here...

[Blackmore Fan]

This is a great discussion. I learned guitar on an electric, and once upon a time I was attracted to any nice looking cheap Squier that came along. At some point I realized "they're all going to sound the same until you insist on quality". At that time, I started learning about good pickups and good electronics under the hood.

My journey with acoustics was pretty much the same. I started with realizing th importance of a solid top, but after awhile realized that solid backs and sides were musts as well.

Once these paths kicked in, I became a LOT more selective about what I would even consider buying. If someone tomorrow was giving away a cheap Squier or an acoustic that wasn't a solid body, I wouldn't bite--its "free" but not important to me--I have better.

I think once we establish a "floor" in regard to quality, we become much more selective about our interests. I played two amazing acoustics today--if I didn't have a couple of great acoustics I would have bought either of them. Instead, it was just a fun time to get out of the house.

[rmp]

Originally Posted by Al Mojo

Can we agree that value (expressed here as tone) is largely and literally in the hands of the player. The argument that "cheap" is better than "expensive"; "modern" is better than "vintage"; "import" is better than "Made in USA", or "quantity" is better than "quality" is subjective. Buy whatever flavor you like. 😊

yep, Agreed.. no argument there.

I've always felt that you can get a lot of guitar for not a lot of money when you're shopping electrics.

Acoustics, I wouldn't say categorically contrast this, but there is a lot more gray area in what the "you get what you pay for" with these vs electrics