Learning Technique -vs- Songs

solarix · #1 09-09-2009, 08:05 PM

Which is more useful in the long run, technique or concentrating on songs?

I have a feeling it is technique. On that thought where and how to begin on the technique part?

Jerry

Fingerstylist · #2 09-09-2009, 08:13 PM

I'd say you can't go wrong concentrating on songs. With every piece that you learn you should pick up new techniques.

daniel1703 · #3 09-09-2009, 08:49 PM

i think you should go with songs. There're so many techniques to learn. And once in a while people develop new techniques. If you concentrate on techniques, you probably won't know where to stop.

In the end, you might be a master at guitar techniques but you don't know many songs, which kinda defeats the purpose of playing the guitar, no?

And like what Fingerstylist said, you'll pick up new techniques with every piece you learn. Moreover, if you stick to playing songs from a certain genre, eventually you'll pick up most of the common techniques employed in that genre.

ljguitar · #4 09-09-2009, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by solarix

Which is more useful in the long run, technique or concentrating on songs?

Hi Jerry...

Do I have to choose?
Can they be rated?
Can they be separated?

It's sure possible to learn technique by learning songs, and it's possible to learn techniques and then apply them to songs. I see no value in learning techniques apart from applying them to a song...

Often while working on an arrangement I find a hole in my technique, so I spend some practice time just working out the nuts and bolts, then go back to the arrangement.

Which works best for you?

aaron1433 · #5 09-09-2009, 10:48 PM

Larry posts some valuable ideas. I have to counter it by saying that it is also useful to many musicians, especially improvisers, to shed some ideas/techniques/licks and then let that stuff creep into your playing.

Often, the way it comes out will surprise you, and can be really fresh and exciting.

mmmaak · #6 09-09-2009, 11:31 PM

I learn technique by learning songs

rcadian · #7 09-10-2009, 08:19 AM

Interesting discussion... "Both," would be my one word answer...

From personal experience, I've only learned techniques from watching and listening to lots of different versions of songs that I was learning and seeing and hearing where different techniques were applied. Hey Joe is a song with a really simple chord progression, but the different techniques you can apply through it and learn from it are extraordinary.

The one thing that has stunned me since staring to learn to play the guitar is just how differently lots of people play the same song. The first song I wanted to learn to play when I knew a few chords was Wagon Wheel. The gazzilion different ways people play it on YouTube was at first totally confusing to me ("Which one was RIGHT?," I remember asking myself), but now I find the fact that there are so many different ways - and techniques - that can be applied to any single song, both inspiring and educational...

Rc

ewalling · #8 09-10-2009, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmmaak

I learn technique by learning songs

Yes, that's my case, too, but really I'm less interested in the technique than the song. If I pick something up that has a wider use, well and good, but that's not my focus.

deltoid · #9 09-10-2009, 01:41 PM

Having a good foundation of proper technique will make those songs MUCH easier to learn and play. You said "in the long run", in the long run, you're better off learning proper technique, first and foremost. That's why a person in a formal (classical) training environment will practice technique and practice, and practice, and practice.
But, that's no fun, so, unless you plan on playing classical guitar in a symphony orchestra, I suppose you can learn a few songs along the way while also learning proper technique.

susitna · #10 09-10-2009, 01:55 PM

To me, there's a difference between knowing how to play a song and how to play guitar. I think already having the technique mastered makes learning the song easier. I think learning the song makes mastering technique more fun. You could waste your life philosophizing about the chicken and the egg, or you can get to work.

So I play a song to "warm up", then I do a couple exercises from technique books, and then I start working on new songs. If I get frustrated with the new song, I'll either play an old one or go back to the exercises (especially if I think I didn't do it so well earlier).

Bern · #11 09-10-2009, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by solarix

Which is more useful in the long run, technique or concentrating on songs?

I have a feeling it is technique. On that thought where and how to begin on the technique part?

Jerry

Everything is useful...when a time comes where you need to refer to something, you'll have it. Of course, there are basic techniques you have to conquer...after that, you're on your own.

solarix · #12 09-10-2009, 04:04 PM

Very interesting conversation here, thanks!

Quote:

Originally Posted by susitna

To me, there's a difference between knowing how to play a song and how to play guitar. I think already having the technique mastered makes learning the song easier. I think learning the song makes mastering technique more fun. You could waste your life philosophizing about the chicken and the egg, or you can get to work.

So I play a song to "warm up", then I do a couple exercises from technique books, and then I start working on new songs. If I get frustrated with the new song, I'll either play an old one or go back to the exercises (especially if I think I didn't do it so well earlier).

This was my thought process as well. I really want to learn the guitar the way an accomplished piano player KNOWS the piano.

Of course learning songs along the way or for what purpose do you know your insrtument.

stephensmat · #13 09-11-2009, 01:18 AM

I just started learning, but I plan to learn by songs. 'How to play songs you like' is not hard to find on the internet these days, and frankly, I don't plan to be the next great guitar composer, so playing songs I like, and I want to hear is rather the point for me.

Billy Memphis · #14 09-11-2009, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmmaak

I learn technique by learning songs

I agree, The technique you need is in the songs. Each song has particular technique requirements that you can concentrate on as you go. Besides, technique by itself gets very boring and hard to keep going without letting your mind wander.

wcap · #15 09-11-2009, 04:30 PM

While I would agree that lack of adequate knowledge of technique (and maybe music theory) will probably hinder a developing guitar player (I have frustrating gaps, even though I have played stringed/fretted instruments for decades, and I tend to turn heads and get compliments when I try out guitars in shops), the thing is that one of the most important things to do to develop your playing ability is to play guitar A LOT. Really really a lot. Call it practicing if you wish (though that sounds less fun). I simply call it playing guitar, which is something I am compulsively obsessed with and never have enough time for. In my opinion, you have to be obsessed with it to really develop into a great player.

And the thing that really keeps me going, more than anything, is the burning desire to learn and get good at playing music that I love. This is what keeps me at it.

Like, the year it took me to master Recuerdos de la Alhambra, a Spanish classical peice that has about 1700 notes played pretty rapidly and continuously from start to finish. I had loved this piece since I was a kid, and when I finally found tablature for it and started getting it to work (which didn't happen really until a year after getting the tablature) I was totally obsessed and after I really started making progress with it I must have played it through AT LEAST 2 or 3 times every day for about another year before I really had it down to the point where I could play it through pretty cleanly - I figure I've easily played it more than 1000 times. Focusing on this piece so much actually sort of erased one or two other complicated pieces that I had previously mastered but that I did not "maintain" for awhile - very frustrating!

Anyway, I don't think I could have worked with the same intensity had I not been working on something that I really really wanted to play, and that was giving me tantalizing bits of success that kept me going. And that piece could almost be viewed as a roughly 1700 note exercise in developing right hand technique.

This being said, I really wish I could get myself motivated to sit down and learn to sight read standard notation. I work at it a little bit once in awhile, and I make some progress and realize that it really is not that hard, but the effort is great relative to the immediate feedback that I'm getting, and I tend to revert to working on some piece, either original, or from Tablature, that is really intriguing me.

Also, every so often I do pick up some new idea or technique, often almost by accident (e.g. by watching another guitar player play - something I don't do enough of) and it feels revolutionary and wonderful and transformational.

I really ought to do more with technique. Actually, I need to spend more time seeing how others arrange and construct their arrangements, accompaniments, and such, and learn some radically different uses of chords and chord voicings. I think it might take my playing to a new level.

Recently I've gotten obsessed with DADGAD tuning, so there is a whole big new world to explore here!