Upgrading to a large reswaw bandsaw, opinions?

[CE Sobel]

Hello everyone,

I'm in the middle of upgrading some of my machinery and wanted to see if anyone has any experience/opinions with larger resaw bandsaw's?

I'm currently using a 3hp 20" Grizzly with either a 1" lennox carbide or 1 1/4" laguna RK blade. This is dedicated to resaw but it's pretty temperamental for doing really high yield stuff... the bearings are not aligned perfectly (double bearings for larger blades, this is just a machine flaw and not easily correctable) and it makes it difficult to get really consistent results, among other flaws. I'm currently getting .01 to .015 accuracy over a 9" african blackwood panel but would like to get that down to .005 or less. I'm pretty experienced with resaw and saw setup at this point.

I'm looking at a few different saws...

Laguna 24x24 possibly with the laguna power feeder
Felder 610 or 710
The 18" Laguna Resaw Master
Minimax 24" or Powermatic 24"
I could maybe also consider a larger 30" saw.

I'm unsure if I should prioritize overall size and mass or blade width capacity/HP in the decision. The resaw master wins on blade capacity, since it can take a 2" resaw king which is attractive... but it's a fairly small saw at 18" and I question how well it can tension blades larger than 1"? This is the saw that Dave Borson uses with a few modifications. The 24" laguna is nice and it can run their power feeder along with a 1.5" blade which would probably be plenty. I can get that one with a 3 phase converter and run the 7.5hp motor.
The minimax is the heaviest by far but has a weaker engine and only takes a 1" blade (probably fine). I can get it locally.

Overall though I have massive amounts of valuable wood to resaw and I'm not taking any chances on this purchase as I have already lost a few slices here and there over the last 5 years

Thanks everyone!

[redir]

I have a Hitachi cb75f set up for dedicated resawing but I have no experience with any of those on your list. But what I will say is that more horse power is better. 3 Phase will also be more efficient. The original motor on the Hitachi were underrated for that saw. Most people who own them seemed to have change them out. I have a 3hp motor on it now and I can feed 9in boards through it (using a 3 inch blade) as fast as I can push it. Some of the harder woods feel like they could use a bit more horse power.

I'm not so sure that blade width really matters so much for actual cutting but I do feel like it helps keep the cut more straight as it sort of guides the wood being fed into it. But that would not be a deal breaker for me. Lots of wood gets resawn on 1in blades just fine.

[Howard Klepper]

When you say "bearings," do you mean the guides? I've had saws with guides that were hard to adjust, and saws with guides that didn't hold their adjustment (much more likely when cutting curves), but never one with guides that could not be aligned. Sometimes it takes unbolting the guide mount from the frame and remounting it, or making some round holes into ovals to get adjustment room.

You also could get a new set of Carter guides (much better rear bearing system than on Grizzly, which is important for resawing) for a fraction of the price of a new saw. I also had a saw (old 20" Delta) with too weak a tensioning spring for a 1" blade, and adequate tension is necessary for resawing. They can be replaced, so long as the frame of the saw can handle the tension--look for die springs.

The only thing you can't tweak with common hand tools is the frame.

But some saws are just a PITA to keep adjusted, and if you are sawing a lot, you are best off without them.

I've had three Lagunas, and didn't like the original guides on any of them. Can't speak to your other candidates, but it is possible to get good resawing on a 20" saw. I can also suggest you try the Lennox AluminumMaster blade, which I think is now called the CastMaster. It's triple chip grind and takes a narrower kerf than most other carbide blades. Ignore the name--it works very nicely on hard woods.

[CE Sobel]

Originally Posted by Howard Klepper

When you say "bearings," do you mean the guides? I've had saws with guides that were hard to adjust, and saws with guides that didn't hold their adjustment (much more likely when cutting curves), but never one with guides that could not be aligned. Sometimes it takes unbolting the guide mount from the frame and remounting it, or making some round holes into ovals to get adjustment room.

You also could get a new set of Carter guides (much better rear bearing system than on Grizzly, which is important for resawing) for a fraction of the price of a new saw. I also had a saw (old 20" Delta) with too weak a tensioning spring for a 1" blade, and adequate tension is necessary for resawing. They can be replaced, so long as the frame of the saw can handle the tension--look for die springs.

The only thing you can't tweak with common hand tools is the frame.

But some saws are just a PITA to keep adjusted, and if you are sawing a lot, you are best off without them.

I've had three Lagunas, and didn't like the original guides on any of them. Can't speak to your other candidates, but it is possible to get good resawing on a 20" saw. I can also suggest you try the Lennox AluminumMaster blade, which I think is now called the CastMaster. It's triple chip grind and takes a narrower kerf than most other carbide blades. Ignore the name--it works very nicely on hard woods.

Hi Howard,

Thanks for your input.

So yea, one of the issues is that it just doesn’t hold its tune for very long, no matter how tight or loose the guides are. They just creep over the course of a few cuts and then suddenly it’s not cutting well. Maybe I should try drilling out the guide post and re mounting it and that would align it better like you mentioned. I think even if the guide alignment issue were solved (guides not parallel with the blade... it’s subtle but noticeable) it would still be problematic in terms of the setup “creeping” and having to be re adjusted every 7-9 cuts at least. It’s a lot of time that’s going into adjusting and re adjusting... I think part of the problem is that the saw just can’t fully tension a 1” carbide so it’s relying too much on the guides.

I’ll check out that blade you mention, thanks!

The carter guides for this saw are $500... I loved those guides when I upgraded my 14”. I feel like I’m reticent to throw that much money at the saw and possibly have some of the same issues!

[CE Sobel]

Originally Posted by redir

I have a Hitachi cb75f set up for dedicated resawing but I have no experience with any of those on your list. But what I will say is that more horse power is better. 3 Phase will also be more efficient. The original motor on the Hitachi were underrated for that saw. Most people who own them seemed to have change them out. I have a 3hp motor on it now and I can feed 9in boards through it (using a 3 inch blade) as fast as I can push it. Some of the harder woods feel like they could use a bit more horse power.

I'm not so sure that blade width really matters so much for actual cutting but I do feel like it helps keep the cut more straight as it sort of guides the wood being fed into it. But that would not be a deal breaker for me. Lots of wood gets resawn on 1in blades just fine.

Thanks for the input Redir. I have seen those saws and heard good things, especially with a 3 or 5 hp upgraded motor. They don't tend to come up for sale that often as I imagine their owners are fairly happy with them!

I'm going to go down to an industrial machinery shop tomorrow in Portland and check out some bigger saws. They have a used miniMax 24" for a decent price as well as some 20 and 24" powermatics and a 20" laguna. That should hopefully give me an idea of how all those saws are made vs. the quality I'm looking for.

Thanks everyone!

[CE Sobel]

Originally Posted by CE Sobel

Hi Howard,

Thanks for your input.

So yea, one of the issues is that it just doesn’t hold its tune for very long, no matter how tight or loose the guides are. They just creep over the course of a few cuts and then suddenly it’s not cutting well. Maybe I should try drilling out the guide post and re mounting it and that would align it better like you mentioned. I think even if the guide alignment issue were solved (guides not parallel with the blade... it’s subtle but noticeable) it would still be problematic in terms of the setup “creeping” and having to be re adjusted every 7-9 cuts at least. It’s a lot of time that’s going into adjusting and re adjusting... I think part of the problem is that the saw just can’t fully tension a 1” carbide so it’s relying too much on the guides.

I’ll check out that blade you mention, thanks!

The carter guides for this saw are $500... I loved those guides when I upgraded my 14”. I feel like I’m reticent to throw that much money at the saw and possibly have some of the same issues!

Hi again Howard,

Update: I did fiddle with adjusting the main column and was able to straighten it out a bit... the problem is now, one of the ceramic guides I'm running on it will not reach the blade. So I'll have to ditch those and figure something else out... I think all of this is a little bit of a sign to move on and I'm pretty much done dumping so many hours into this saw (and there have been a lot of hours )

[Howard Klepper]

Originally Posted by CE Sobel

Hi again Howard,

Update: I did fiddle with adjusting the main column and was able to straighten it out a bit... the problem is now, one of the ceramic guides I'm running on it will not reach the blade. So I'll have to ditch those and figure something else out... I think all of this is a little bit of a sign to move on and I'm pretty much done dumping so many hours into this saw (and there have been a lot of hours )

Are you using Laguna guides? My current saw is a Laguna 18BX, and I am not happy with the ceramic guides--difficult to adjust, and the side blocks slip away from the blade, as well as not having enough range of adjustment so I get that same problem of one side being maxed out before it touches the blade. Also hard to adjust the upper guide column to stay true when it is raised or lowered. I would not buy it again. Please post what you learn about other saws in this size range as you look.

[tadol]

I would consider keeping an eye out for some older iron - I have a Davis Wells 20" that is a wonderful saw, and if you find one used for a fair price, are easily upgradable/modifiable to match anything available new. There are a couple on eBay, a little higher than I think reasonable, but keep scanning the local craigslist as well -

[CE Sobel]

Originally Posted by Howard Klepper

Are you using Laguna guides? My current saw is a Laguna 18BX, and I am not happy with the ceramic guides--difficult to adjust, and the side blocks slip away from the blade, as well as not having enough range of adjustment so I get that same problem of one side being maxed out before it touches the blade. Also hard to adjust the upper guide column to stay true when it is raised or lowered. I would not buy it again. Please post what you learn about other saws in this size range as you look.

I am not using the laguna ones--I got some alternative ceramic guides which are more like solid blocks. I think I paid $100 for the set.

Here is an update...

I went and checked out a used 24" MiniMax and the newer Powermatic line that spans 15-24".

The fit and finish is good on the Powermatic but it is very similar to my Grizzly. I wouldn't be surprised if they were made in the same factory as they share so many identical or similar features. That's not necessarily a ding, as I feel the overall quality of Griz machines is decent right now.

The MiniMax completely blew all of them out of the water. Its a centauro-made saw from 2003 that weighs a solid half ton. The thing is so beafy everywhere that I couldn't get anything, including the fence to deflect with hard pressure.

I've also read really good things about Grizzly's new line of 17" and 19" saws that are basically copies of the european resaw bandsaw's. The 17" alone weighs almost 800lbs and supposedly can tension a 1" carbide blade to 40k psi. That's part of the problem with my lesser Griz... it just can't throw down the tension.

They're asking 3500 for the minimax which is in really good condition.

The grizzly saws are 2600 and 3500 delivered, for the 17 and 19".

I think having seen the minimax now I would gravitate towards the Italian made saws or the higher end griz.

[H165]

I and my brother both have Agazzani saws. Both with after-market ceramic guides. We use Lennox blades. I use mine for resawing guitar sets. Doug used his for furniture, resawing, and raw veneer cutting.

They might have a model that suits you.